US Olympic Team Announced

[anonymoose_au]

Now, since a lot of people seem to be crying "This wudn't happen in Russia !!1!", I will relieve you all of that delusion - the Russian figure skating federation had absolutely no problem leaving their national champion at home during a home-field Olympics in favour of a "sentimental fave" who had essentially no body of work from the past few season due to being retired and didn't even bother to skate at Euros, also leaving two that-year Euros medalists off of the team for that same fave.

That is not what happened at all.

Maxim Kovtun would have gone to Sochi had he not messed up at Euros that he was off the podium and prior to that screwed up so badly at
Worlds he failed to get the second spot back that Russia really could have used. Kovtun finished 17th at the 2013 Worlds, almost as bad as Vincent at Worlds 2021.

Maxim could skate brilliantly as long as there was no pressure, but at a HOME Olympics as the sole representative in his sport skating in the first ever Team Event? A Team Event where the first event was the Men's SP?

I always find it hilarious when posters claim Plushy just waltzed into Sochi grabbed the Team Medal from the deserving hands of every other Russian men's skater and then waltzed out. Do people honestly believe he "planned" to withdraw from the singles event and set himself up for a life time of hate and abuse from his own country's media (the very media who called him a hero hours earlier) and eternal scorn from the Federation who now scores the skaters he coaches?

Maxim Kovtun should be relieved it wasn't him.

I will agree with you that Sergei Vonorov should have gone, but I'm pretty sure the RusFed didn't even realise he existed. Which certainly isn't Plushy's fault.

 

[GymDad]

He withdrew prior to the competition and didn't skate.

Why was he not considered for Post Champsionship Events - Tomiko was and he did not skate? Also it was never announced why William Hubbert withdrew. Was it Covid?

 

[treblemakerem]

I have a question - not very important to anyone - but, How in the H is Ryan Dunk an alternate to anything? He cannot even land a 3 Axel. What? That makes no sense at all to me - Why? What happened to Eric Sporberg? Why not list Yaro, Dinh or Liam as alternates? Oh, they don't have the right prelim scores? Well put an asterik by their name as well.

I don’t think there is time to get minimums before 4cc unlike worlds. I’m assuming Yaro is too injured.

 

[formersk8ter]

Once again these are all nice but the scores don’t scream I am a world or Olympic medal contender. And mean score means nothing.

Is USFSA shooting for 7th?

I am so over Jason. He has had eight years to up his technical content and has failed to do so. His novice/junior jump content just doesn't cut it anymore.

As for his "artistry," I haven't seen any growth in four years, and he still skates to the same stale old David Wilson programs.

Next.

 

[norwegianfairytale]

Yes, the Starr promotion train continues. Why did she get so many opportunities this past season? It is all the same, as long as she is in thees, sport and middling around she will get opportunities. The world rankings is a two edge sword - with alot of opportunities - someone can continue to get points here and there and keep their name higher on the list - when others don't get an opportunity to compete - they can't use that as a portrait. Yes they should stop the world rankings criteria. I just want to award opportunities for up and comers. How about Jill Heiner? Rena Ikenishi? Was Gracie even on the table? If TV ratings are a concern - Send Gracie. I wish real people were on the selection committees.

Now, containing GG to the national scene is the decision of the USFS that I can wholeheartedly support.

I would love if Gracie Gold was sent to 4CC, but nor she, Jill Heiner or Rena Ikenishi has the minimum required for 4CC, so it´s not possible.

 

[moonvine]

Samarin was at least thoroughly defeated by Aliev at Euros by about 44 points, so the Russian fed selecting Aliev made sense at the time (and indeed paid off with Aliev placing 7th at the Olympics (rough FS but perfect SP) even higher than Kolyada.

Some (by no means all) posters on this website seem to feel placements other than 1-3 are meaningless. So they would be opposed to sending Jason who is extremely likely to finish in the top 8. They would send Ilia who might skate well or might not make the free.

I think I’ve said I would send Nathan, Ilia and Jason but the USFS didn’t have that option according to published criteria.

I wonder if USFS will ever publish their criteria again. They haven’t in the past.

It’s so unfortunate the GPF wasn’t held. That would have been another data point.

 

[Lzbee]

I wonder if USFS will ever publish their criteria again. They haven’t in the past.

I think they should. There will be cases like this year again where any decision is going to be left with unhappy fans. Having the criteria out there puts the onus on them to get the criteria right and protects the affected skaters from some amount of hate.

(Of course, in this case I'm talking about Vincent and Jason but if it was Ilia who had made the team, he would be on the receiving end of criticism at the age of 17. I don't think US reporters would be as brazen as Russian ones but I don't want to have to see a 17 year old have to deal with the consequences of decisions made by of their fed, like Anna had to, again)

 

[Tavi...]

I am so over Jason. He has had eight years to up his technical content and has failed to do so. His novice/junior jump content just doesn't cut it anymore.

As for his "artistry," I haven't seen any growth in four years, and he still skates to the same stale old David Wilson programs.

Next.

Huh. Being such a worthless mess and all, it’s surprising Jason has the nerve to continue skating. And it’s just disgusting that he managed to beat Vincent’s 5-quad FS by nearly 12 points, isn’t it?

 

[moonvine]

Yes, the Starr promotion train continues. Why did she get so many opportunities this past season? It is all the same, as long as she is in thees, sport and middling around she will get opportunities. The world rankings is a two edge sword - with alot of opportunities - someone can continue to get points here and there and keep their name higher on the list - when others don't get an opportunity to compete - they can't use that as a portrait. Yes they should stop the world rankings criteria. I just want to award opportunities for up and comers. How about Jill Heiner? Rena Ikenishi? Was Gracie even on the table? If TV ratings are a concern - Send Gracie. I wish real people were on the selection committees.

Jill Heiner is adorable. But she’s not skated internationally at all. So she has no minimums for anything.

Now if I were her, which I’m not, I would be thinking about something next year where I could get tech minimums (or even if not, some experience in a competition that is kind of low key). Somewhere like Philly International or Cranberry Cup.

Rena did go to Cranberry and finished 15th. Gracie finished 13th. Neither had minimums so neither can go.

I have no doubt USFS would love to send Gracie somewhere. She’s ratings gold and they have to know that.

 

[moonvine]

I think they should. There will be cases like this year again where any decision is going to be left with unhappy fans. Having the criteria out there puts the onus on them to get the criteria right and protects the affected skaters from some amount of hate.

(Of course, in this case I'm talking about Vincent and Jason but if it was Ilia who had made the team, he would be on the receiving end of criticism at the age of 17. I don't think US reporters would be as brazen as Russian ones but I don't want to have to see a 17 year old have to deal with the consequences of decisions made by of their fed, like Anna had to, again)

I’m so glad I’m not USFS right now. People will never let this go.

 

[figureskatingandrainbows]

I think we are all caught up in the magic of Ilia's two great programs or Jason's Olympic selection. It's completely understandable. We are only human after all. But we're also way too fickle. One skater has one great skate and all of a sudden it's "OLYMPIC PODIUM! MUST SEND!". And if Jason has a great skate at the Olympics, everyone will be pointing out "Oh see! I told you Jason deserved to go!". If Ilia bombs at Worlds, everyone will say "I knew he shouldn't have gone to the Olympics!". So I invite everyone to sit back, relax, take a deep breath, and admit that the decision has been made already, Ilia might get to go because of COVID anyway, and no matter how much ranting, raving, and angry noise we make about this, it's not going to change. It's fine, folks. This drama is supposed to be for the Russian women anyway!

(seriously please stop bashing Jason/Ilia it's getting really tiring and it's also really rude like what have you accomplished that's even close to what they've done in skating also some people prefer quads others artistry again THAT'S FINE)

 

[Greengemmonster]

I’m so glad I’m not USFS right now. People will never let this go.

Haha I admit I'm totally griping about this but at the end of the day it's just a bunch of us figure skating fans on the interwebs.

I doubt anyone else cares!

 

[CanadianSkaterGuy]

Some (by no means all) posters on this website seem to feel placements other than 1-3 are meaningless. So they would be opposed to sending Jason who is extremely likely to finish in the top 8. They would send Ilia who might skate well or might not make the free.

I think I’ve said I would send Nathan, Ilia and Jason but the USFS didn’t have that option according to published criteria.

I wonder if USFS will ever publish their criteria again. They haven’t in the past.

It’s so unfortunate the GPF wasn’t held. That would have been another data point.

Even if the US didn't have published criteria there are literally zero points that Brown would have over Zhou in the Olympic conversation.

To reiterate, it was between Brown and Malinin. Not Zhou and Malinin (no matter how much people dislike Zhou). Zhou had a GP gold (over Chen) and silver, and thus was even ranked higher than Chen in the Grand Prix standings. As far as how their scores stack up with the rest of the world:

https://results.isu.org/isujsstat/sb2021-22/sbtsmsp.htm

https://results.isu.org/isujsstat/sb2021-22/sbtsmfs.htm

https://results.isu.org/isujsstat/sb2021-22/sbtsmto.htm

Chen had the best SP and FS.

Zhou had the 4th best SP score, 2nd best FS score, 2nd best total score.

Brown had the 10th best SP and 9th best FS, 9th best total score.

Malinin had the 35th best SP and 24th best FS, 25th best total score. (Although these were with Junior restrictions of no SP quads and no ChSp in the FS) - he still would have been well behind Zhou/Chen and likely behind Brown.

 

[moonvine]

I think we are all caught up in the magic of Ilia's two great programs or Jason's Olympic selection. It's completely understandable. We are only human after all. But we're also way too fickle. One skater has one great skate and all of a sudden it's "OLYMPIC PODIUM! MUST SEND!". And if Jason has a great skate at the Olympics, everyone will be pointing out "Oh see! I told you Jason deserved to go!". If Ilia bombs at Worlds, everyone will say "I knew he shouldn't have gone to the Olympics!". So I invite everyone to sit back, relax, take a deep breath, and admit that the decision has been made already, Ilia might get to go because of COVID anyway, and no matter how much ranting, raving, and angry noise we make about this, it's not going to change. It's fine, folks. This drama is supposed to be for the Russian women anyway!

(seriously please stop bashing Jason/Ilia it's getting really tiring and it's also really rude like what have you accomplished that's even close to what they've done in skating also some people prefer quads others artistry again THAT'S FINE)

I have to laugh because look what a short time ago Alysa was the NEXT GREAT HOPE of US figure skating. Now she’s shoved out to pasture and Lindsey or Isabeau is the NEXT GREAT HOPE OF US FiGURE SKATING.

This Olympics more than any other could be absolute chaos. Entire teams could have to WD. Hopefully not. But if so something nuts could happen. Like Uncle B on the podium nuts.

Not bashing anyone. Not my style.

 

[lariko]

Why was he not considered for Post Champsionship Events - Tomiko was and he did not skate? Also it was never announced why William Hubbert withdrew. Was it Covid?

Okay, I follow American senior men but not to this level of detail. Hiwatashi skated 2 GP, so I assume he has TES for 4CC and maybe the best score from the non-Olympic/reserve teams. I don't recall seeing ES in the international competitions this year, so I don't know if he has TES.

 

[moonvine]

Okay, I follow American senior men but not to that level of detail. Hiwatashi skated 2 GP, so I assume he has TES for 4CC and maybe the best score from the non-Olympic/reserve teams. I don't recall seeing ES in the international competitions this year, so I don't know if he has TES.

William may also not have given a reason. It’s not required.

 

[ladyjane]

I am very much in favour of publishing criteria and sticking to them. I think that's what happened in the case of the men. The US Federation might have to rethink the criteria because of what happened at their Nationals this year, as it turns out they may be detrimental to the up and coming. I don't recall anybody mentioning this specific point when they were first published (plenty of comments at the time, but not this particular one), so this could be a learning for the Federation. That's fine. For now, I'm just very pleased I'm going to see Jason Brown at the Olympics, and I think it's unfair to call him out in any way. He did what was required in the criteria, had a great fall season and skated well at this Nationals considering what happened beforehand with all the travelling problems. I realise these travelling problems aren't an excuse for anything, but neither are the hate comments towards a very nice young man who happens to execute programmes that are very much enjoyed by many people. And, yes, I'm biased because I am one of those people and I'm going to enjoy his programmes at the Olympics.

And now I'm going to leave this thread.....

 

[el henry]

I am so over Jason. He has had eight years to up his technical content and has failed to do so. His novice/junior jump content just doesn't cut it anymore.

As for his "artistry," I haven't seen any growth in four years, and he still skates to the same stale old David Wilson programs.

Next.

Gee, have you even watched Sinnerman, Love is a BItch or I Can't Go on Without You? David Wilson, sure

But I am so over revolutions in the air being prioritized as the only facet of figure skating worth evaluating. I am so over not understanding or recognizing what Jason does as so incredibly athletic that other skaters praise him for his athletic skills. As Kurt Browning says, Jason is a skater's skater. Or maybe you're over Kurt Browning too?

Next.

 

[purplecat]

Also it was never announced why William Hubbert withdrew. Was it Covid?

Yes, it was Covid.

https://twitter.com/AnythingGOE/status/1479872673958305797

 

[chuckm]

Feels like to me it was a very big strategic mistake to have Malinin do juniors this season. The criteria was always "show that you can score well internationally then podium at nationals".

It was a big risk to have only one senior challenger to make a case for himself and he made enough mistakes that he didn't even get the worlds tech minimums. That's a skate that should've gotten it off his system earlier in the season. If his team were not going to seriously go for the Olympic spot then they must have known this could/would happen.

You have to rely on the veterans having a bad season to do a Polina and unfortunately both Jason and Vincent have delivered results this season.

Sorry, but Malinin DID get the tech minimums for the Olympics at the Austrian Challenger. The Olympic minimums are the same as the Euro/4CC minimums, and Malinin got those. But the Worlds minimums are a bit steeper. At the Austrian Challenger, Ilya missed the Worlds SP minimum by 0.22, but exceeded the Worlds FS minimum by 21.77 points.