What was the controversy in the 94' Worlds

[engrsktr]

Re: What was the controversy in the 94' Worlds

"Surya was a total fake!"

As far as that goes... a lot of skaters come across as the opposite of what they are.... so surya's not the only one... sonja henie may have appeared to be the sweet little skater.. but many who have skated with/against her would say otherwise... history is always told by the winner...
but it takes all kinds... I think surya was different and unusual and she really wasn't THAT bad.... anyone can nitpick her skating...but they would have to do the same with the skaters today.......
like I said before, it takes all kinds...

 

[DORISPULASKI]

Re: What was the controversy in the 94' Worlds

Gaillehuguet, the head of the French federation, was Surya's coach, and I read it was his idea to spread the story about Surya being an orphan from Tanzania or Mozambique or whatever rather than from Marseilles. Not a surprise there. Not a man noted for honesty. The hair story comes from the same time frame, and she had this huge, rather ugly kielbasa looking braid/ponytail hanging off her head. Later it disappeared. So it is possible she never cut her hair, but then she did later. What she did have is some of the biggest feet in proportion to her height that I have seen on a skater. Quite the landing platforms there.

dpp

 

[Joesitz]

Re: What was the controversy in the 94' Worlds

Surya Bonaly, imo, is a first rate figure skater. Not blessed with that 19 century ballet body which most fans demand, she did her best with what she had. Even with the nonfans, no one turned their head when watching her skate. She had that certain 'must see' presentation.

And yes, she did not behave in the accepted sportsman manner for a runner up. I got over it. Let's move on.

Joe

 

[schmooze1]

Surya Bonaly

Sorry Joe, I have to disagree on this one!! Surya most definitely did not have 'must-see' presentation I and quite a number of people I have been to competition with quite happily used Surya as their toilet break skater.

I don't think we should dwell on her bad display of sportmanship though as I feel a lot of that is to do with her mothers influence and what she was drilled to believe about herself and her own ability which was frankly no where close to what she thought it was.
No doubt about it the potential was there and like I said in my original post since turning pro I have had much more time for her as a skater and have watched as she has matured in skating ability, presentation and as a person over all. It could be said that now that she is out of the handling of her mother and the French Federation we are really getting to see the true Surya.

 

[mathman444]

Re: Surya Bonaly

To me, Surya skated great, she jumped her legs off, and she thought that she won by a mile. Naturally she was mad when the judges didn't see it that way. She probably thought that there was some kind of conspiracy against her, or perhaps that Yuka was the beneficiary of home cooking.

I'm surprised that this doesn't happen all the time. These young competitors are pumped with "fight or flight" adrenalin, filled simultaneously with ecstatic hopes and agonizing fears, and worked up to a fever pitch. Baseball players throw their bats at the pitcher, basketball players get in the referee's face and draw technical fouls, hockey players drop their gloves. Only the poor little figure skaters have to just grin and take it.

Then there was the time Surya did a back flip at the Olympics, right in the judges faces...

But I agree with Joe, at least about Surya's professional career. She remains one of the most popular skaters in Champions on Ice. Edges, schmedges, the girl knows how to put on a show.

Mathman

 

[Callystarr]

Re: What was the controversy in the 94' Worlds

<em><strong>
Yuka Sato landed
3Lutz
3Flip (held on)
3Loop/2Toe
2Toe
3Salchow/2Toe
3Loop
2Axel
3Salchow

Surya Bonaly
2Axel
3Lutz
3Toe half loop 3Salchow/2Toe
3Loop
3Flip/3Toe (3Toe may have been underrotated)
3Lutz


I never understood why so many people bashed Suryas presentation, I always thought that her presentation was "mediocre" and it is a lot better than many today. By no means was it a level of Yuka Sato, but the competition was close, not a reason to protest, but it really could have gone either way. Surya compeltely demolished the field on a technical aspect and deservred much higher technical marks.


My Marks...

Bonaly: 5.9/5.7
Sato: 5.7/5.8

I personally thought Bonaly should have won, but it depends on what you would give Sato for her technical performance. But Bonaly clearly murdered her in that aspect and I thought that a 5.7 for presentatioin for Bonaly's "Winter" program was not out of line.</strong></em>

 

[SkateFan4Life]

Re: What was the controversy in the 94' Worlds

Surya Bonaly and her mother were an oddball skating twosome, to put it mildly. Mrs. Bonaly was the ultimate
"skating mother from below" who simply rubbed a lot of people the wrong way. They concocted the story of Surya being founded running on the streets of the island of Reunion and how Mrs. Bonaly adopted her and brought her to France.
Even members of the French Skating Federation grew exasperated with them, and a few went so far as to state that they did not belong in the figure skating world. Perhaps some of this sentiment was based on jealousy, snobbery, and who knows what else. I for one found Surya's skating to be like a breath of fresh air. Sure, she wasn't graceful or artistic, but as a pure athlete, she was terrific. Had the back flip become a legal move, Surya surely would have scored points on the technical side for landing this move on one foot.

 

[Joesitz]

Re: What was the controversy in the 94' Worlds

I agree SkateFan. Figure skating fans seem to me to be hung up on 19th century ballet and pooh pooh any skater who does not have those long legs and line.

In addition to liking Surya, I also liked Shen and Zhao from the beginning when others were pooh poohing them for not conforming to the Protopopov's style. Look at them now! Still different and great.

Joe

 

[Excidra2001]

Re: What was the controversy in the 94' Worlds

I too enjoyed Surya's skating because it was different from the "norm". I watched her free skate at the Olympics in 98 and the only thing missing in her program was the middle finger and at the end of her performence I gave her a standing O in my living room.
It gets tiresome when people keep on repeating that so and so is lacking in presention or so and so is not graceful. Who said you have to be graceful to be one of the best skater in the world and as far as presention goes, its in the eye of the beholder.

 

[heyang]

Re: What was the controversy in the 94' Worlds

While Surya beats Yuka when counting jumps, there are other aspects of the technical score where Yuka beats Surya. IMO, Yuka has better edges and spins and footwork.

I also remember a conversation with a non-skating fan. He referred to Surya has the one who skated (editing to add that 'skated' means she travelled on the ice to try to get on the proper edge) practically the length of the rink before performing her jump. I recall her doing this with her lutz.

I've enjoyed Surya's athletic style, but I would not credit her with being a fabulous 'skater'. If you take away the jumps, there isn't 'all that' much to her skating as an Oly eligible. JMO.

 

[RealtorGal]

Re: What was the controversy in the 94' Worlds

<span style="color:maroon;font-family:georgia;font-size:small;">I remember someone (probably Uncle Dick or Aunt Peggy) saying that a truly great skater is someone who captures your attention even if they never jump. Peggy & Dorothy come to mind. If you take out Surya's jumps, well, there wouldn't be much of anything.</span>

 

[SkateFan4Life]

Re: What was the controversy in the 94' Worlds

Let's not forget that Michelle Kwan made her World debut at the 1994 Worlds. As a 13-year-old, she had won the silver medal at Nationals, and she was sent to the Worlds after Nancy Kerrigan declined to compete and Tonya Harding was banned for life from USFSA-sanctioned competition. Michelle finished a very credible eighth, and this assured the US of being able to send two women to the 1995 Worlds.

 

[Callystarr]

Re: What was the controversy in the 94' Worlds

<span style="color:green;">I would not say that Yuka necessarily had her in spins, Suryas spins are more difficult and quite appealing and very good..as well.</span>

 

[Princess Leppard 625]

Re: What was the controversy in the 94' Worlds

<span style="colorurple;font-family:georgia;font-size:x-small;">Who else from the US ladies went besides Michelle? Was it Nicole or Tanya K?

Just wondering.

Laura </span>

 

[SkateFan4Life]

Re: What was the controversy in the 94' Worlds

Nicole Bobek also competed for the US at the 1994 World Championships. She finished 13th in qualifying group B. I'm not sure whether or not Nicole qualified to compete in the long program - I believe she did, but she did not finish in the top ten. Michelle Kwan was the only US woman to finish in the top ten, and her 8th place finish ensured the US of sending two women to the 1995 Worlds.

 

[THIZfiyaVIETgrl]

Re: What was the controversy in the 94' Worlds

Nicole didn't make it out of the qualifying round, so she didn't compete in the SP making Michelle the only U.S. lady competing at the "official" competition. Most ppl get to learn and be under the radar and not expect too much in their first Worlds, MK had to learn and make it to the top ten in her first worlds.

 

[rgirl181]

Re: What was the controversy in the 94' Worlds

Doris,
You are so right about the size of Surya's feet relative to her height. I saw her in person at a reception sans skates and Surya is an absolute peanut. Looked to be about 4'10 or 4'11. Also, as is common in blacks, Surya had a long calcaneus (heel bone), which gave her foot that kind of canoe look. The long calcaneus also makes it difficult to fully point one's foot.

As for Surya's style: When I saw her on TV, I felt she was too upright most of the time and she didn't seem to have a sense of transition--except in her '94 Olympic and World SP, which was one of her best, IMO. Then I saw live with COI in I believe '94. I've never seen such a difference between the TV and the live "version" of a skater. She did a beautiful program to a cappella opera (not exactly the kind of music COI fans jump up and down for) and had the entire arena in the palm of her hand. For some reason, the "awkward angles" on her body that seemed so distracting on TV were not there live. I've seen this kind of thing in other skaters, but over the years I've seen Surya live many times and all I can say is TV is not kind to Surya's skating. She does improvise almost all of her exhibition programs, though they are based on certain moves and themes, so sometimes the spirits are with her and sometimes they are not.

I agree that some of the dislike of Surya is the fact that she doesn't have a balletic body or style; however, I also think the way she came across on TV made her look less graceful than she is in actuality. Also, a lot of people saw the '94 Worlds silver medal situation and people tend to not like bad sports--at least in figure skating, as Mathman rightly pointed out. John MacEnroe is now making big money doing commercials based on his tennis tantrums. Can you see that working for any skater? The thing is though, skating is a judged sport whereas tennis, basketball, etc. are sports where, tantrum or not, if you make the points, you win. My point is that I think the presentation mark doesn't end with the program for fans. I think skating fans tend to judge the skater off the ice as well and Surya always wore her heart on her sleeve.

The '94 silver medal incident was poor sportsmanship, but as Berthes Ghost said, definitely great TV (how many other medal ceremonies do we remember?:lol: ). OTOH, Surya did apologize to Yuka and also, at '95 Worlds, Surya thanked Michelle for skating so well and coming in 4th because it allowed Surya to win the bronze medal.

BTW, I thought Yuka deserved the gold, but it was very close. If those Worlds had been held in a European country I strongly suspect the gold would have gone to Surya. Surya had many strong points, one of her best eligible short and long programs, and Yuka had not yet blossomed into the amazing skater she became in about '97. Also, if you watch Yuka's LP from '94, it has some of the strangest Muzak-y music I've ever heard.

One last tidbit: When Surya won the World Professional Championship in I believe '00, which may have been the last year it was just for pros, the US commentators who had blasted Surya all during her eligible career suddenly couldn't stop saying enough good things about her:lol: That was also the year, if not the competition, where Surya, spirited as ever, did a nasty imitation of Oksana Baiul behind Oksana's back but right in front of the camera. No love lost between those two:lol:
Rgirl

 

[SkateFan4Life]

Re: What was the controversy in the 94' Worlds

For the record -- medalists at the 1994 Worlds:

Men:
Elvis Stojko, Canada, gold
Philippe Candeloro, France, silver
Viacheslav Zarorokniuk, Ukraine, bronze

Women:
Yuka Sato, Japan, gold
Surya Bonaly, France, silver
Ranja Szewczenko, Germany, bronze

Pairs:
Evgenia Shishkova,Vadim Naumov, Russia, gold
Isabelle Brausseur/Lloyd Eisler, Canada, silver
Marina Eltsova/Andrey Bushkov, Russia, bronze

Dance:
Oksana Grishuk/Evgeny Platov, Russia, gold
Sophie Moniotte/Pascal Lavanchy, France, silver
Susanna Rahkamo/Petri Kokko, Finland, bronze

 

[OldGold79]

Re: What was the controversy in the 94' Worlds

<blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>BTW, I thought Yuka deserved the gold, but it was very close.[/quote]

The outcome should've been 9-0 in favor of Yuka (unless France had a judge, than 8-1 would have been expected). Surya may have beat Yuka in the jumping department, but Yuka beat Surya in the everything-else department. Surya's spins were very poor at Worlds, her footwork was nowhere near the level of Yuka's, and her in-betweens consisted mainly of cross-overs with the exception of that one part where she moved her arms in time with the "Winter" section of the music. Beyond that, it was typical edge-less Surya-skating.

<blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>Also, if you watch Yuka's LP from '94, it has some of the strangest Muzak-y music I've ever heard.[/quote]

Odd, I've never heard anyone refer to 19th century ballet music as "strange" or "Muzak-y".

You haven't watched this competition in awhile, have you?

 

[Spree2spree]

Re: What was the controversy in the 94' Worlds

<strong>engrsktr</strong>
<blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>"Surya was a total fake!"[/quote]

to say that she is a total FAKE, i think is very wrong of you!.. Surya may have been a bad sportsman, and that's it!
I think it's beautiful to see a BLACK woman commin' in to this sport with all her power and masculinity and though still feminine at the same time...Showing that "white men can't jump" *LOL*, and proving that the backflip also is possible for the women to do! +on one foot!..

Surya was a great Figure Skater who gave the sport alot!!!|I