BerthesGhost, Vietgirl,
I loved your posts (Vgirl! You remembered something nice that Rgirl said about Michelle! Yay!).
Anyway, here's my obnoxious contribution: Look, I know there is a contingent of MK "haters" who say, "Move on, old broad!" But in all seriousness, how many of them are there compared to the billions (and I do mean billions) of fans Michelle has worldwide who want to see her on the ice competing forever? I think this whole "Everybody (the antiKwans) wants Michelle to retire" is more overblown than the Goodyear blimp. I think for some people it may even be an excuse to keep Michelle in the underdog position, as in, "Boy, that Michelle! Look at the courage she has! Staying eligible when EVERYBODY is SCREAMING for her to retire!" I just think this is hooey.
If "everybody" wanted Michelle out the door, then what does one make of the close to 20,000 fans I saw on their feet screaming for Michelle at Nationals and Worlds? They sure weren't yelling, "SoCal girl, turn pro!" They were practically orgasmic over watching Michelle turn in possibly her most transcendant and technically superior programs ever. Somebody tell me seriously that 99% of the people in those arenas and at home watching on TV didn't want Michelle to do a repeat competition next year, and the year after that, and they year after that...
So my question is: Where are all the antiKwans yelling for Michelle to retire? I know, they're at TaraWorld--that enormous site--there are some at SashaFans, right next to the Michelle fans arguing with them, and at the large general forums such as FSU, you might find 5-10% who might, that's MIGHT express an occasional, "I think Michelle should move aside yadda yadda."
So my first point is: Why are people so upset about something that IMO does not even exist in sufficient numbers to warrant anything but ignoring them? Let's see, I put the number of antiKwans who want her to retire at about, oh, let's be generous and say 20,000--that's in the world--whereas I would put the number of Kwan fans who want her to keep skating eligible competitions until she's 101 at, oh, let's be conservative and say 3 billion. 20,000 to 3 billion. Mathman, would you do the honors and calculate that ratio please?
I think it's great to discuss whether or not Michelle will ever turn pro, but let's keep it in the realm of earthly reality and not just use it as a place to b**** and moan about a relative few (note the word relative) antiKwans who have never liked Michelle and never will.
Also, I don't see ANY trend toward fans wanting "term limits" for skaters. In fact, I see the opposite. I see fans saying, "This is LADIES skating. I want to see ladies or at least young women skating. We've seen jumping beans come and go. So been there, done that. Yes, new skaters are exciting, but only if they have staying power. I want to see these ladies stay around until they have some life experience outside the rink that they can bring to the ice." Even though she beat an admittedly ailing Michelle, the vast majority of the people I read were thrilled for Bute's World championship at age 26. Thrilled. Not even the dumb old ISU favors young skaters. IIRC, it was when Tara was competing that the ISU INCREASED the age of eligibility for Worlds and Olympics. In '00, I think, you could get a bye to Worlds if you were under the age limit by medaling at Jr. Worlds, but you can't even do that anymore. I believe you have to be 15 by July 1 of that year or the previous year, I forget which (BerthesGhost, help me out here; I know you'll know). But the point is that the trend as I see it among both the ISU and fans is that they want to see the best skaters competing, meaning those who have the full range of qualities needed to be a top skater (aka, full package), go on and mature. You may not like Irina's opera programs, but I think most will agree that they are a heck of a lot better than the "Klinka" LP she did in '98. If you need a reminder, it was Irina in a woman's body skating in a young-girl style to a Russian folk tune with puff-sleeve costume to match. (Nothing against folk music, just want age appropriate folk music.)
So, this is it: The number of skating fans who want Michelle to go pro is miniscule and certainly not worth all the fist-pounding and outrage I see from some in this thread, IMHO.
And I am 100% behind BerthesGhost's Point 5: "Quit Dissing Pro Skating." ITA with BG that it was the class of Kristi, Midori, Yuka, Oksana, Paul, Kurt, Brian, and others who made pro skating the valuable creative offshoot of eligible skating that it was in the mid-90s. Just think of the innovative programs Kristi Y and Paul Wylie came up with during that time. Classics! And these were programs they could NEVER do as eligible skaters, not even as exhibition numbers because they were too difficult. True, it was an unusual period of time when a certain group of very talented and creative skaters made the pro scene what it was. IMO, it had a positive effect on eligible skating because the pros, who were no longer focused on increasing their jump content, focused instead on high quality creativity, meaning programs such as Wylie's "JFK," "Schindler's List," "On the Waterfront," "Carmina Burana," and others, and Kristi's "Doop Doop," "Bridge Over Troubled Water," "Romeo and Juliet," and others. Even Midori Ito worked her heart out to connect with the audience AND do a 3Axel, which she did the one year she beat Kristi for the World Pro Title (though Midori might have beaten Kristi twice, I'm not sure). And let's not forget that G&G did many of their most memorable programs as pros. Who can ever forget Sergei and Katia skating to Ella Fitzgerald's rendition of "The Man I Love," something they never could have skated had they not turned pro. If eligible skaters did not get the message that a lot of the magic of any program, competitive or otherwise, is in its heart and expression of the skater's individuality, then they were not watching.
In fact, I'll give you an example of a skater who I don't think would have a second Olympic bronze medal if it weren't for the lessons learned skating in pro shows and competitions: Philippe Candeloro at the '98 Olympics with his "D'Artagnan" LP. For many, Candeloro was the highlight of the men's event.
I just don't understand how some people are constantly berating and belittling pro skaters and their fans, saying the skaters do nothing but gimmicks in cheesey costumes, and at the same time those very same people say, "Oh, Yuka! She is glorious!" Yeah, she's been glorious as a PRO skater since 1996, IIRC. I find quotes like the following to be both uninformed and offensive to those fans who enjoy QUALITY pro skating:
Pro competitions is for fans who are more interested in gimmicks and far out costumes than sport, imo.
It's not the fans who are telling the skaters what to perform. When Ilia Kulik skated his '98 Olympic program to win what was to be the last event entitled the World Pro Competition in '02 with every jump except the quad and skated against Kurt Browning doing "Nyah," I can only think that the people making those comments never watch pro skating or if they do, they focus only on the gimmicks of the skaters over 40.
Certainly pro skating is in a significant slump--or I should say US pro skating, and I do feel it is specific to the US pro skating system for some very specific reasons. Where I see the problem is not in the fans or even in the skaters but in the USFSA who ONLY makes a distinction regarding the "pro" status for US skaters if they skate with SOI. Any skater from any other country, at least that I know of, can skate with SOI one year and go back to eligible skating the next, if they so choose. To me, the USFSA's stand on this, which has to do with the $$$$ the federation gets from COI, is a pure and simple kickback scheme. COI skaters from the US can stay eligible forever. Only those US skaters who want to skate with SOI have to give up their eligible status. The USFSA is in bed with COI and not SOI and who pays? The US skaters and the fans. Personally, I think it violates the RICCO statutes and why SOI doesn't sue the USFSA is beyond me.
As for the actual topic of this thread, I have no doubt that Michelle will stay eligible as long as it is in her best interest. Why shouldn't she? She's committed to COI for personal reasons (though as we've seen, personal reasons can fall through), so as long as that relationship stays good, Michelle has no reason to make a choice. She could remain an Olympic eligible skater for as long as she lives. If and when the time comes that she does not want to compete, she can still skate with COI. As for me, I'll stick with the 3 billion skating fans around the world who want to see Michelle compete for as long as possible. After all, if people were "sick" of seeing Michelle, as some on this thread have claimed, why would the USFSA have called her to please, please come do Skate America when Sarah Hughes dropped out? Why did ticket sales for SA zoom up as soon as it was announced Kwan would skate? I'm all for differences of opinion; I'm just urging that hyperbole and exaggeration be reined in. Michelle is the world's most beloved skater and has been since '96. Why try to make her into something she's not, that is, unwanted?
Rgirl
