World Team Trophy: Teams and Entries

[Mathman]

By the way, how is it even possible that Amodio is going? He is far behind Ponsero and Préaubert in the standings, he screwed up Junior Worlds, didn't attend one senior event this season.

The wording of the ISU document is, I think, deliberately obscure on this point. They try to make it seem like it is a requirement that each federation send its highest ranked skaters. But I don't think they can enforce this.

I think the actual rule is, IF the national federation appoints a top-ranked skater to the team (and the ISU hopes and expects that they will), and then IF that individual skater refuses to go, then the skater can get in trouble.

This seems like a rather foolish rule. The highest ranked U.S. men's skaters are Lysacek and Weir. As I understand it, the USFSA asked Weir if he wanted to go, Weir said no, so they invited Abbott instead. Since Weir was never "appointed" to the team, he did not get in trouble with the ISU (and thus is permitted to do shows and exhibitions during the same time period as this competition, etc.)

I presume that France is the same way. They wanted to give Amodio a reward for finishing second in French nationals. I don't know whether Ponsero or Preaubert were ever asked -- I don't think so, since the announcement of the French team was made quite early.

I take all this to mean that Gailhaguet doesn't really care what Cinquanta wants. Gailhaguet will do it the Gailhaguet way. Maybe this is Gailhaguet's way of saying, screw it, we're not going to win anyway!

 

[chuckm]

Actually, both teams are pretty new. J/B have been together for just over a year, AFAIK Vanessa James had little or no experience skating pairs, and they've only done three int'l competitions according to their ISU bio. D/B of course have been together for less than a year, and Jeremy spent much of that time working odd jobs at the rink to support their skating; they too have only three international events behind them.

Since both pairs have limited experience training-wise and in competition, I believe it's really too early to say who is better and who has more potential. The one thing in D/Bs favor is that they are younger than J/B, so they will likely have a longer career assuming things continue to go well between them.

What's interesting is that with former partner Shantel Jordan, Jeremy Barrett won the French National Championship back in 2004. At the time they were the US Junior Champions, but Shantel was too young to compete internationally, except at NACS and the occasional championship event that invited outside competitors.

 

[Medusa]

Hmm, if you look at the bottom of this page - are those the skaters who will do the gala? Because you have Aliona and Robin, the Kerrs, I guess the upper left one with "2005, 2006" is Lambiel - who is number four?

 

[Sylvia]

Finland's Laura Lepisto is the invited lady. I assume Yu-Na Kim was invited but declined.

 

[fumie_fumie]

Hmm, if you look at the bottom of this page - are those the skaters who will do the gala? Because you have Aliona and Robin, the Kerrs, I guess the upper left one with "2005, 2006" is Lambiel - who is number four?

Medusa,

Although I am a big Chan fan, I still LOVE your banner. Great humour in this... Good stuff!

 

[Medusa]

Although I am a big Chan fan, I still LOVE your banner. Great humour in this... Good stuff!

^^Well, the banner is me making fun of them, making fun of myself and of all the other guys on these boards who took part in the heated discussions. (though I found out later that the penguin race that I used for Joubert is called "Jackass penguin" - it was an accident, I swear! I mean, who chose that kind of name for a penguin race to begin with?)

 

[Buttercup]

Medusa, I see you are also back to Stephane as the avatar - do you know something we don't?

 

[Medusa]

Medusa, I see you are also back to Stephane as the avatar - do you know something we don't?

^^Nay, I just had a bout of melancholy. I sometimes go back to him, I think I also had the Stéphane-banner for some time before Worlds. It's just me missing the crazy Zebra.

 

[Kimmie Fan]

I don't get it.
So why only one team for pairs and dance?
Pairs and dance are only half as important as single skating?

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

I don't get it.
So why only one team for pairs and dance?
Pairs and dance are only half as important as single skating?

and don't forget the list of challengers who are not invited because it is a closed competition. No riff-raffs alowed.

 

[Mathman]

I don't get it.
So why only one team for pairs and dance?
Pairs and dance are only half as important as single skating?

I think one of the reasons is that not all countries have more than one competitive dance or pairs team. Some countries don't have any.

and don't forget the list of challengers who are not invited because it is a closed competition. No riff-raffs alowed.

But then, if everyone were invited, that would be Worlds. We already had that.

 

[Buttercup]

I think one of the reasons is that not all countries have more than one competitive dance or pairs team. Some countries don't have any.)

Yes, but by the same token, some countries do have strong dance or pairs teams, and don't really have more than one competitive skater in the singles disciplines - e.g. France has three good dance teams, two of which are healthy, but only Candice Didier is competitive among the ladies, and she's no Mao. The Chinese have a similar situation with their pairs program vs. men and ladies. How is it fair to give a break to countries who are bad in pairs or dance but not to those with weaker men/ladies?

Medusa, Jeffrey is very handsome but you really need to bring back the penguins!

 

[dorispulaski]

It isn't fair. But then it is a Japanese cheesefest, paid for by a Japanese company, so you would expect them to make the rules. Given the state of the Japanese pairs & dance program, we are lucky that any dancers and pairs at all will compete.

 

[Buttercup]

It isn't fair. But then it is a Japanese cheesefest, paid for by a Japanese company, so you would expect them to make the rules. Given the state of the Japanese pairs & dance program, we are lucky that any dancers and pairs at all will compete.

If it's meant to be a cheesefest, why all the threats in the official announcement by the ISU - you know, you must send your top people OR ELSE? I thought cheesefest participation was more voluntary...

 

[PolymerBob]

Because the ISU is expecting a big payday.
Which they may very well get.

 

[Kimmie Fan]

Yes, but by the same token, some countries do have strong dance or pairs teams, and don't really have more than one competitive skater in the singles disciplines - e.g. France has three good dance teams, two of which are healthy, but only Candice Didier is competitive among the ladies, and she's no Mao. The Chinese have a similar situation with their pairs program vs. men and ladies. How is it fair to give a break to countries who are bad in pairs or dance but not to those with weaker men/ladies?
[/B]!

Exactly. Its not fair at all.
ISU is basically saying that pairs and dance are not as important....not worth as much as evidenced by reduced number of entrants and reduced number of points for pairs and dance.

 

[chuckm]

Exactly. Its not fair at all.
ISU is basically saying that pairs and dance are not as important....not worth as much as evidenced by reduced number of entrants and reduced number of points for pairs and dance.

Actually, it's the DANCE and PAIR teams that are getting the big points, and the country that has strong singles but no strength in Pairs and Dance is at an advantage. Even if JPN's dance and pair teams next to last/last, they still earn 15 points. If Japanese singles finish top 3, they will probably win the whole shebang.

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

Actually, it's the DANCE and PAIR teams that are getting the big points, and the country that has strong singles but no strength in Pairs and Dance is at an advantage. Even if JPN's dance and pair teams next to last/last, they still earn 15 points. If Japanese singles finish top 3, they will probably win the whole shebang.

Veeeeeery interrrrresting. Japan rigs the points .

Can't help but think from reading the comments that this limited competition is as hot as a World Championship.

There really is no team. It's all about the individual skaters, and yes, we did just see them at Worlds. The real Team competition is called Synchonized Skating. No?

Why not have this in July during the skating doldrums?

 

[dorispulaski]

The time to have it is now (and not July) because the skaters want to stop training this year's programs and move to training next year's programs. Or in the fall, prior to the Grand Prix, when it would provide an interesting showcase of next year's programs.

What might be fun in July is to have a competition based on exhibition programs.

 

[Mathman]

Actually, it's the DANCE and PAIR teams that are getting the big points, and the country that has strong singles but no strength in Pairs and Dance is at an advantage. Even if JPN's dance and pair teams next to last/last, they still earn 15 points...

Although... if they scored the pairs and dancers from 1 to 6 instead of from 7 to 12 that would not affect the outcome. It would just subtract an automatic 12 points from every team's score across the board.