Yuzuru Hanyu: 2013-14 Season

[Becki]

I don't see how he isn't mature enough to interpret Romeo and Juliet. Romeo was only what 17 in the play anyways and in no way was he mature. If anything, I think R&J needs a child like interpretation b/c Romeo and Juliet weren't making very mature decisions. He did amazing with R&J from 2011.
For me, the choreography for the last two freeskates could have been switch and I wouldn't be able to tell the difference (but it could also just be that since Wilson choreographed both, there were bound to be similarities). IMO the team took something that didn't really work (Notre Dame de Paris) and just continued working with it. The Romeo and Juliet cut even has the same build up as NDP. I would love for the team and Yuzu to pick a different type of music for next year. He's done somber lyrical music for two years already.

I want Yuzuru to skate to Piano Concerto No.1

 

[FTnoona]

I want Yuzuru to skate to Piano Concerto No.1

Hey I actually like Kovtun's music for the FS too
I feel like Yuzu needs this type of dynamic and "loud" music for his style. I really liked the cut of Rhapsody on a Theme of Paganini that he skated to for his junior days. I just don't think he's the wallflower type that the team is going for right now, and that he'll grow into that type of music later on though.

 

[Becki]

Hey I actually like Kovtun's music for the FS too
I feel like Yuzu needs this type of dynamic and "loud" music for his style. I really liked the cut of Rhapsody on a Theme of Paganini that he skated to for his junior days. I just don't think he's the wallflower type that the team is going for right now, and that he'll grow into that type of music later on though.

I think he likes music where he commands the stage and is the center of attention. I liked his Etude SP

I also want Yuzu to skate to Les Mis even if it's a warhorse. I have a feeling he will be able to interpret the music pretty well, especially "I dreamed a dream".

 

[yude]

Hey I actually like Kovtun's music for the FS too
I feel like Yuzu needs this type of dynamic and "loud" music for his style. I really liked the cut of Rhapsody on a Theme of Paganini that he skated to for his junior days. I just don't think he's the wallflower type that the team is going for right now, and that he'll grow into that type of music later on though.

I love that program

 

[phaeljones]

I don't see how he isn't mature enough to interpret Romeo and Juliet. Romeo was only what 17 in the play anyways and in no way was he mature. If anything, I think R&J needs a child like interpretation b/c Romeo and Juliet weren't making very mature decisions. He did amazing with R&J from 2011.
. . .

Interesting perspective. Yes, that is correct. Romeo is only 17 and it is a teenaged love story. During the Nice Worlds in 2012, the British commentator on ESPN made the comment that he felt that one of the reasons why Yuzuru Hanyu so well portrayed Romeo in his skate was because he was the actual age of the character in the story and therefore suitable to play the role as a skater. (The complete skate and commentary is on youtube.) As well, this season just after Finlandia, when people on Goldenskate were reviewing R&J#2, a few (but not many) commented that he seemed now older than a Romeo should be.

I think he is still young enough for the role.

In any case, in choosing the theme of Romeo and Juliet again (as according to Weir, Hanyu “owns” the costume and choice of music), Yuzuru must have had some kind of feeling or statement he wanted to make by choosing the same story again. If the past has taught us anything about Yuzuru and how he skates his programs, it is that he develops and grows into them as the season progresses. Part of their meaning is in the journey that it takes him. He did that with R&J#1, he did that with PW and he is doing that with R&J#2. (Just remember the evolution from Finlandia, to Skate Canada, to TEB, to GPF and to the Olympics.) He still has time with R&J#2 to make it whole. Perhaps we should wait until he skates R&J#2 as he means it to be skated before judgment is rendered on its appropriateness to his temperament and maturity. Even as it is, the judges have given it a thumbs up putting Hanyu second to no other skater in the world.

 

[Esopian]

It will be interesting to see what they do for the 2014-2015 season. With the chance of regulations and now allowing music with lyrics I hope he gets really cool programs.

Yeah, exactly! He has been using the SP [Parisienne Walkways] for two seasons already and seeing new programs would definitely be exciting. His FS is relatively good, but I know he can express himself in a newer and better way without the touching on Romeo and Juliet theme. I prefer his rocker/lively performances rather than his expressive/moving/touching-type of program.

 

[FTnoona]

Interesting perspective. Yes, that is correct. Romeo is only 17 and it is a teenaged love story. During the Nice Worlds in 2012, the British commentator on ESPN made the comment that he felt that one of the reasons why Yuzuru Hanyu so well portrayed Romeo in his skate was because he was the actual age of the character in the story and therefore suitable to play the role as a skater. (The complete skate and commentary is on youtube.) As well, this season just after Finlandia, when people on Goldenskate were reviewing R&J#2, a few (but not many) commented that he seemed now older than a Romeo should be.

I think he is still young enough for the role.

In any case, in choosing the theme of Romeo and Juliet again (as according to Weir, Hanyu “owns” the costume and choice of music), Yuzuru must have had some kind of feeling or statement he wanted to make by choosing the same story again. If the past has taught us anything about Yuzuru and how he skates his programs, it is that he develops and grows into them as the season progresses. Part of their meaning is in the journey that it takes him. He did that with R&J#1, he did that with PW and he is doing that with R&J#2. (Just remember the evolution from Finlandia, to Skate Canada, to TEB, to GPF and to the Olympics.) He still has time with R&J#2 to make it whole. Perhaps we should wait until he skates R&J#2 as he means it to be skated before judgment is rendered on its appropriateness to his temperament and maturity. Even as it is, the judges have given it a thumbs up putting Hanyu second to no other skater in the world.

I think he still has that innocence and almost naivety needed to play Romeo (or at least that is how he portrays himself when he skates - he's got that youthfulness to him), and I think R&J is still appropriate for him. I was actually replying to Meoima who said that "The program's content is TOO OLD for this kid. He hasn't reached the age that allow him to fully understand the feelings they expect him to express. Technically he can nail in in practice, but artistry, he hasn't grown up enough for that." I don't think Romeo was that "deep" of a character. He was simple, young, and didn't think things through. For me, I don't think age is a problem when portraying Romeo as long as you can get across that young almost blinder straight ahead character.
On the other hand, I don't think Yuzu was able to fully interpret NDP. His exhibition at TEB showed great improvement from last season though.

 

[giulia95]

I think he likes music where he commands the stage and is the center of attention. I liked his Etude SP

I think Scriabin Etude is a mastepiece. First of all it is an unusual and difficult piece of classical music, Yuzu's coach was very brave to select it for a 16 yr old teen skater and the choreo is lyrical, classy and extremely difficult because of some crazy transitions /steps . Surprisingly Yuzu interpreted it in such a mature and poetic way , expecially at Worlds 2012, where he had a very good control on his arms/upper body movements and the magic outfit Yuzu's mom created perfectly matched this wonderful interpretation.

R&J n°1 atmosphere was in a certain way almost the opposite of the Etude SP , enhancing Yuzu's wild , emotional and raw side and once again the outfit matched the program wonderfully.

This is just to say that IMO it' is the choreo that must be tailored on skater's qualities and strenghts, and Yuzuru has already proved to be able to skate to many different types of music, and not the opposite, having the skater constantly trying to interpret something that is basically uncongenial to him.

 

[Maria Victoria]

I agree that Yuzuru has a wider artistic range than some would give him credit for. He has the willingness to challenge himself both technically (hence the insistence on the two types of quad jumps in his LP) and artistically. I watched a TSL (The Skating Lesson) interview of his PW choreographer Jeffrey Buttle where the latter expressed his pleased surpise that Yuzuru did not reject outright that choice of music for his SP and instead actively collaborated in the choreography. It may be hard to recall right now since the PW SP has broken a hundred in the Olympics, but there was initial criticism that Yuzuru then was attempting too much to be like Daisuke. Even the great skating blogger Morozombie, who raved about Yuzuru's 2011-2012 Romeo and Juliet program, commented that the PW SP "was tolerable in a certain way (I could at least approve of its balance between complexity and attention to the music, even if it gave a certain 'trying too hard' vibe at times)," which is indeed to "damn with faint praise." Since then Yuzuru has made the PW SP his own where his personality shines out. I hope for Yuzuru's own inner satisfaction, as well as for my own as a skating fan, that he will do justice to his 2013-2014 Romeo and Juliet program in this year's World Championships. We already caught a glimpse of what it could be at the 2013-2014 GPF.

 

[Silvia451]

I'm a big fan of PW program and I would really like to see a similar choice of style for the FS next season. However, I don't know if Yuzuru can, at the moment, have a clean performance on a long program PW style. It requires a lot of energy and he often looks tired (I mean, more tired than other skaters) at the end of the his FS (I must admit this improved a little bit in the last months). But the PW style suits him. Lively, dynamic and most of all, very relaxed. I don't know and I don't think the kid was always very confident about his SP, but the moves, the choreography let the impression that he is. When the music started, it was something like "ok, look at him, he's so cool and calm and everything is fine and there's no chance he'll have any mistakes".

 

[phaeljones]

I think he still has that innocence and almost naivety needed to play Romeo (or at least that is how he portrays himself when he skates - he's got that youthfulness to him), and I think R&J is still appropriate for him. I was actually replying to Meoima who said that "The program's content is TOO OLD for this kid. He hasn't reached the age that allow him to fully understand the feelings they expect him to express. Technically he can nail in in practice, but artistry, he hasn't grown up enough for that." I don't think Romeo was that "deep" of a character. He was simple, young, and didn't think things through. For me, I don't think age is a problem when portraying Romeo as long as you can get across that young almost blinder straight ahead character.
On the other hand, I don't think Yuzu was able to fully interpret NDP. His exhibition at TEB showed great improvement from last season though.

Yes. I agree totally with your position. Yuzuru does not lack the maturity to play a seventeen year old of the Romeo personality. It is a good one for him to portray.

 

[Meoima]

Yes. I agree totally with your position. Yuzuru does not lack the maturity to play a seventeen year old of the Romeo personality. It is a good one for him to portray.

Lmao, I don't think he is not old enough to be Romeo, he did a good choice on coming back to Romeo & Juliet because he can connect to the music/story. He is the best Romeo ever on ice, blogger Morozombie also stated that out.
The problem of his current free skate is, the program is loaded with too many technical elements, with the highest TES score ever if he landed all those jumps perfectly. I get it that he need those technical elements, obviously, to beat PChan. But he hasn't masted 4S perfectly, it's like a mental block, :sarcasm:thus he focus so much on the jumps, other than the interpretation of the program.
It's good that he is not afraid of challenges, but to some point people should know that he is still a growing kid, both mentally and physically, not just a competitive athlete. That's why I said I think David Wilson's programs are too old for him. NDP program last year was even wayyyyyyy older than his mental age at that time, thus the result we all see.
But he is growing into it, not just in GPF, but also in Sochi. Frankly, I think his FS in Sochi was more passionate than his FS in GPF despite all the mistakes. I can sense that he was desperate more than in GPF. And that means in a good way, I hope he would finally do some justice to his current free skate and move on to something new.
And yes, new costume, as much as I dislike Weir's design, I have to say his costume was so much entertaining to watch in performance. Like the kid was playing both Juliet and Romeo in one performance.

 

[cruzceleste]

I want him to do a program to Some Nights by FUN. just because it will made me happy

 

[Silvia451]

And yes, new costume, as much as I dislike Weir's design, I have to say his costume was so much entertaining to watch in performance. Like the kid was playing both Juliet and Romeo in one performance.

haha best comment

 

[HanDomi]

The problem of his current free skate is, the program is loaded with too many technical elements, with the highest TES score ever if he landed all those jumps perfectly. I get it that he need those technical elements, obviously, to beat PChan. But he hasn't masted 4S perfectly, it's like a mental block, :sarcasm:thus he focus so much on the jumps, other than the interpretation of the program.

I think he simply needs that 4S in program due to it's construction with most of jumps and combination in 2nd half. But the thing is he still is making many points of that 4s - 7.20 about because he is going all in, anyway he will land or fall he is going for full 4 rev, when others mainly are opening it on 2-3 revs when they feel they will not land it. But when he will master 4s.... his TES will be monstrus despite it is currently with 4s fall anyway
I just wonder when he will cross 200 points in FS, I think he is capable of doing that in near future with landing 4s and making program perfectly.

 

[YesWay]

Like the kid was playing both Juliet and Romeo in one performance

Actually, I believe that was exactly the intention, and one of the reasons his costume is the way it is...

 

[lbc2138]

Thanks for the welcome!

I hope Yuzu does manage to master the salchow, just like his quad toe that he has almost down to a tee. I've seen him land it in exhibitions and of course during practices but I guess the weight of the competition usually has him pretty nervous.

The 2012 Finlandia FS program has a 4T first and then the 4S. He managed to save the 4S and skated quite cleanly (despite wobbling from fatigue at the end) so my question is, why didn't he start off R&J #2 with a 4T then a 4S instead of the other way around? I think with him nailing the 4T, it would boost his confidence as well as enabling him to make the necessary adjustments to land the 4S. Plus, the 4T is the first jump in his SP so I'm sure he would land it in his FS. That's what one of the commentator said when he failed his Salchow, he said Yuzu glanced at his landing spot when he was transitioning into his 4T.

 

[Meoima]

Thanks for the welcome!

I hope Yuzu does manage to master the salchow, just like his quad toe that he has almost down to a tee. I've seen him land it in exhibitions and of course during practices but I guess the weight of the competition usually has him pretty nervous.

The 2012 Finlandia FS program has a 4T first and then the 4S. He managed to save the 4S and skated quite cleanly (despite wobbling from fatigue at the end) so my question is, why didn't he start off R&J #2 with a 4T then a 4S instead of the other way around? I think with him nailing the 4T, it would boost his confidence as well as enabling him to make the necessary adjustments to land the 4S. Plus, the 4T is the first jump in his SP so I'm sure he would land it in his FS. That's what one of the commentator said when he failed his Salchow, he said Yuzu glanced at his landing spot when he was transitioning into his 4T.

I think 4S is his biggest mental block at the moment so he wanted to get rid of it first? When I was a child I used to finish the dish I hate the most then finish the dishes I like latter. He could land 4S perfectly in practice many times, but it's still new to him, unlike 4T and 3A which he had executed successfully so many times in ice shows. Personally I think he should get rid of that 4S unless in Exhibition. He could land two 4T in a row instead of 4S4T. But this kid seems to love challenge so it's no help. He is still growing so I hope he would eventually get rid of this mental block and move on... to the next quad. He seems to be ambitious about the quad.

 

[HanDomi]

I think 4S is his biggest mental block at the moment so he wanted to get rid of it first? When I was a child I used to finish the dish I hate the most then finish the dishes I like latter. He could land 4S perfectly in practice many times, but it's still new to him, unlike 4T and 3A which he had executed successfully so many times in ice shows. Personally I think he should get rid of that 4S unless in Exhibition. He could land two 4T in a row instead of 4S4T. But this kid seems to love challenge so it's no help. He is still growing so I hope he would eventually get rid of this mental block and move on... to the next quad. He seems to be ambitious about the quad.

I thinked they aren't able to do two separate 4T only jumps isn't ?

I mean one would have to be in combination, that's why he has 4S rather than 4T + 4T3T like Patrick, because Yuzuru have heavily loaded programme in second half with two combinations with tripple axels, while Patrick is making first 3A in the 1st half.

I am very courius about 4A for YH. Looking that he can jump 3A without much speed and from very hard entry, it may will be possible to him to nail it ( but I don't think anyway he would use it because he have incredible level of execution combinations with 3A). We will see. Maybe he will do diffrent quad instead of 4S next season if he will not be able to master it in competition.

 

[Crylais]

If Hanyu does another 4T then it has to be in combination which will mean the rest of his programme will need a change. If he is going to 4T+3T intead of a 4S, that means he cannot do a 3A+3T combination if he plans to do 2 3A. It also means he needs to drop one of his 3Lz.

I guess his new program could be

4T+3T
4T
3F
--
3A+2T
3A+2T+2Lo
3Lo
3Lz
3S

but that isn't worth as much as his current program? The one above only has a BV of 70.37

His current program has a BV of like 74/75? Assuming he will always fall on his 4S (receiving -3 GOE and 1 point deduction for fall). His program is still worth like 70.72?

I guess GOE will then make a difference. Hanyu will most likely get positive GOE for his 4T+3T but if he somehow lands his 4S, he will get more points than 4T+3T with positive GOE. I guess he is going for higher risk higher reward.