Define Lambiel’s coaching style | Page 6 | Golden Skate

Define Lambiel’s coaching style

Status
Not open for further replies.

Anna K.

Medalist
Joined
Feb 22, 2014
Country
Latvia
Here is an article from Kyodo News that features interview with Stephane Lambiel shortly before Men's event in Beijing. It's a bit eerie to read it now because it focuses on Shoma as possible winner of Olympic gold and we know that it didn't end exactly so, but still.

Excerpts from the article:

As Uno's coach and choreographer, Lambiel, a 2006 Turin Olympic silver medalist and two-time world champion, thinks the 24-year-old has a realistic chance of winning gold in Beijing, if only he can embrace his inner child.

According to Lambiel, Uno twisted his right ankle while landing a quad flip in December, but he has recovered to a point where he is well enough to go ahead with his planned two quads in his short program on Feb. 8 and five quads in his long program two days later.

"My biggest focus was to make him not focus so much on the result. For me it's important that when he comes to practice he has a challenge, and he's working toward that challenge, and the result doesn't really matter," Lambiel said.

"If he just remembers what happened to me in 2010, when I executed almost every element correctly but I was not free enough. [...] My problem was that I knew Vancouver was my last competition. So I had so much pressure and because of that I wanted to have a good result. That's why I was not able to perform freely."

"Skating is mathematics, and we do need to have a very specific strategy...If he lands all his jumps he will get a good score. But what I want is for him to be not only a good jumper, but a great figure skater,"



Clearly, there are some repercussions with Deniss' interview in the above post. Maybe, I shouldn't post this because we already knew? :laugh:
Or, contrary: now it makes even more sense because it is not just about Deniss, or just about Shoma, or just about Stephane. It's about the philosophy of Champery.
 

Anna K.

Medalist
Joined
Feb 22, 2014
Country
Latvia
Well in my mind Shoma has the great jumps and he HAS achieved Stephane's wish for him to be a great figure skater. And that only happened after he went to Champery.
And in Stephane's mind (from the same above interview): "I think the quality of his jumps has increased, his experience increased, and his personality increased. So the fact that he has matured gives him a good chance to become No. 1 at the Olympics."

Well, he didn't become No. 1 at the Olympics. But the World champion title isn't bad either :)
 

Anna K.

Medalist
Joined
Feb 22, 2014
Country
Latvia
And so, I spotted a YouTube video from a training session during the World Team Trophy (the uploader didn't specify the date) which I find suitable for this thread.
In this vid, Shoma is trying 3A+3T combo and has a problem with the second jump. There is certain communication going on between him and Stephane (worth watching for Stephane's body language alone) but the jump still doesn't work. In the end, Shoma does a few spins and finally cracks a smile.

Context: Shoma's toeloop problems continued during the 2021 World Team Trophy event:; some said it was because he switched to new skating boots (not an unusual situation at the end of the season). However, in the following 2021-22 season, Shoma jumped only 4T+2T combos so it could be that they dealt with the issue strategically and used double toe as the second jump. He also jumped a 3A+1eu+3F jump sequence (although he begun to single the flip closer to the end of the season) so this is apparently what they decided about the axel.

 
Last edited:

Vilya

On the Ice
Joined
Nov 21, 2019
Country
Finland
And so, I spotted a YouTube video from a training session during the World Team Trophy (the uploader didn't specify the date) which I find suitable for this thread.
In this vid, Shoma is trying 3A+3T combo and has a problem with the second jump. There is certain communication going on between him and Stephane (worth watching for Stephane's body language alone) but the jump still doesn't work. In the end, Shoma does a few spins and finally cracks a smile.

Context: Shoma's toeloop problems continued during the 2021 World Team Trophy event:; some said it was because he switched to new skating boots (not an unusual situation at the end of the season). However, in the following 2021-22 season, Shoma jumped only 4T+2T combos so it could be that they dealt with the issue strategically and used double toe as the second jump. He also jumped a 3A+1eu+3F jump sequence (although he begun to single the flip closer to the end of the season) so this is apparently what they decided about the axel.

Stéphane and Shoma's communication during practice is always nice to watch! 😆
I'd like to point out some things though; what Shoma is training here is not 3A+3T but 3A+4T, which he has yet to land cleanly in a competition, and he hasn't been attempting it in any "serious" competitions yet (not worth the risk). He has been trying it more as a fun challenge at WTT only. The 3A+1eu+3F however he has been including in his layout for many seasons now.
Shoma had 4T3T planned in his FS all 2021-2022 season but was only able to execute 4T2T - in his SP however, he did land 4T3T many times 😊
 

Anna K.

Medalist
Joined
Feb 22, 2014
Country
Latvia
Stéphane and Shoma's communication during practice is always nice to watch! 😆
I'd like to point out some things though; what Shoma is training here is not 3A+3T but 3A+4T, which he has yet to land cleanly in a competition, and he hasn't been attempting it in any "serious" competitions yet (not worth the risk). He has been trying it more as a fun challenge at WTT only. The 3A+1eu+3F however he has been including in his layout for many seasons now.
Shoma had 4T3T planned in his FS all 2021-2022 season but was only able to execute 4T2T - in his SP however, he did land 4T3T many times 😊
Now when you are telling me this, I feel like I need to sink a bit deeper into Shoma's jumpograpy... Who knows? Maybe I will. There's the whole summer ahead ;)
 

Anna K.

Medalist
Joined
Feb 22, 2014
Country
Latvia
Lambiel is forcing his style as a skater on his skater. I don't like that approach
Welcome to Define Lambiel's Coaching Style thread!

I am guessing that you are new to this thread because here we already have more than six pages of information and evidence which explains that forcing anything on anyone has never been Lambiel's approach. Actually, if you want to learn more about coaching style that respects skater's personality and creative freedom, you may find here some likable reading material.

Even so, your fresh look from aside is of course also welcome. So, how would you define Lambiel's style as a skater? And where do you see it "forced" on his skater?
 

el henry

Go have some cake. And come back with jollity.
Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 3, 2014
Country
United-States
Yuri on Ice vibes with him and his students

I have never watched Yuri on Ice and don’t know what “Yuri on Ice” vibes are. Can you explain?
 

el henry

Go have some cake. And come back with jollity.
Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 3, 2014
Country
United-States
figure skating anime

Thank you for the reference.

I did know there was an anime series with that name, so I should have made that clear. I have never watched anime.

So I'm still not sure, having never watched the series, what the OP means by Stéphane's "Yuri on Ice vibes with him and his students".
 

yesterday

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 8, 2022
Thank you for the reference.

I did know there was an anime series with that name, so I should have made that clear. I have never watched anime.

So I'm still not sure, having never watched the series, what the OP means by Stéphane's "Yuri on Ice vibes with him and his students".

From the linked page:

After seeing Yuri skating his winning routine in the viral video, Victor regains his inspiration and decides to become his coach to unlock his full potential.

As a coach, Viktor is very patient and supportive, yet he challenges and helps push Yuri K. into exploring his untapped potential and charm. In his day-to-day life, he is a carefree and romantic person.
 

Anna K.

Medalist
Joined
Feb 22, 2014
Country
Latvia
This forum actually has an amazing thread about this anime series (now in archives).
These are 57 pages of reactions, production information, gossip, confirmed and non-confirmed prototype search, discussion and more as it covers the whole way from the announcement of the series to its TV premiere finale. I keep recommending it as a good read not just to skating fans but also to anime fans in general because the insight provided there is really great.

From what I remember,
the show combines the stories of Yuzuru Hanyu (who skated Plushenko's winning routine in a viral video) and Tatsuki Machida, who was the first skater ever to have Stephane Lambiel in his Kiss&Cry. (Their collaboration started almost instantly after Stephane finished his carrier but there is little-to-no coverage of it in English. Yes, I tried to find some without success :cry:)
Hanyu/Plushenko line was more resonating with fans (who would doubt). But I agree that there is also certain Lambiel vibe in this anime :)
 

SXTN

Final Flight
Joined
Jun 5, 2008
Welcome to Define Lambiel's Coaching Style thread!

I am guessing that you are new to this thread because here we already have more than six pages of information and evidence which explains that forcing anything on anyone has never been Lambiel's approach. Actually, if you want to learn more about coaching style that respects skater's personality and creative freedom, you may find here some likable reading material.

Even so, your fresh look from aside is of course also welcome. So, how would you define Lambiel's style as a skater? And where do you see it "forced" on his skater?

I have to disagree with you and agree with what halulupu said. Having successful students is not always an indication of being a good coach. A good coach needs empathy to see what a skater has to offer and what you can offer back to the skater to bring out the best qualities. Lambiel on the other hand tries to create little mini-me's, I also get strong narcissistic vibes from him. Dennis Vassilijevs is like a copycat, Rika Kihira even imitated gestures and facial expressions in one of her programs that were a 100% Lambiel and not even close to her own personality, just to point out two examples. The music choices are always the genre he liked skating to, the programs always have his handwriting, but in a bad way for me. I also don't think that being a retired skater , a coach and a choreographer at the same time is a good mix because it gives you too much power. It can lift your ego in a negative manner and he has no one to correct him.
 

halulupu

Final Flight
Joined
Oct 21, 2017
I have to disagree with you and agree with what halulupu said. Having successful students is not always an indication of being a good coach. A good coach needs empathy to see what a skater has to offer and what you can offer back to the skater to bring out the best qualities. Lambiel on the other hand tries to create little mini-me's, I also get strong narcissistic vibes from him. Dennis Vassilijevs is like a copycat, Rika Kihira even imitated gestures and facial expressions in one of her programs that were a 100% Lambiel and not even close to her own personality, just to point out two examples. The music choices are always the genre he liked skating to, the programs always have his handwriting, but in a bad way for me. I also don't think that being a retired skater , a coach and a choreographer at the same time is a good mix because it gives you too much power. It can lift your ego in a negative manner and he has no one to correct him.
Exactly, and everything is than sold under the narrative of being artsy fartsy, while actually its just not that good.

I don't know his technical input, which is probably very good. Shoma seemed to be a more stable skater now. But programwise I prefered much more pre Lambiel Shoma. It was more him, more energy, more honest
 

Anna K.

Medalist
Joined
Feb 22, 2014
Country
Latvia
I have to disagree with you and agree with what halulupu said. Having successful students is not always an indication of being a good coach. A good coach needs empathy to see what a skater has to offer and what you can offer back to the skater to bring out the best qualities. Lambiel on the other hand tries to create little mini-me's, I also get strong narcissistic vibes from him. Dennis Vassilijevs is like a copycat, Rika Kihira even imitated gestures and facial expressions in one of her programs that were a 100% Lambiel and not even close to her own personality, just to point out two examples. The music choices are always the genre he liked skating to, the programs always have his handwriting, but in a bad way for me. I also don't think that being a retired skater , a coach and a choreographer at the same time is a good mix because it gives you too much power. It can lift your ego in a negative manner and he has no one to correct him.
Are you sure that you are not confusing two very different things?

It is fairly normal if you don't like a specific skating style (although it would better contribute to this thread if you could define why exactly you don't like Lambiel's skating/choreography style or what @halulupu makes it "false artistry"in comparison to what makes "true artistry") or genre; or, if you are disappointed with a skater not developing in the direction that you would prefer.

However, the fact that you don't like it does not mean that the skater does not like it or that the skater feels uncomfortable with it. In the whole feedback from Champery we have had here Lambiel puts the emphasis on his student being comfortable with the music and the choreography. If you have any different feedback, then please bring it up. Because "I have a vibe" is what happens in your head, not on the ice.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top