- Joined
- Jul 27, 2003
Yeah, but the question is, a touch of WHAT?Piel said:
Ladies Free Skate
- Thread starter RealtorGal
- Start date
- Joined
- Jul 27, 2003
The nice thing about Alyssa is that she's already 18 and past puberty. This is the perfect time for her to develop and mature artistically. I'm very excited to see that happen, just hoping that the jumps get to be rock solid. 
Yes, we all need to acknowledge that our dear pal Mathman has been raving about Alyssa for at least a year. Frankly, up until SA, I thought he'd perhaps OD'd on math equations and was hallucinating.
Yes, we all need to acknowledge that our dear pal Mathman has been raving about Alyssa for at least a year. Frankly, up until SA, I thought he'd perhaps OD'd on math equations and was hallucinating.
Alissa C. definitly is great in many parts of the skating, jumps, spins, and spirals. But I don't think that like many people said that she already has the whole package.
She has some obvious bad habits, such as pulling her neck while rotating most of the jumps, when doing 2axel her head has to turn to the opposite direction before turn to the direction she should rotate, and her spiral's free leg was to the side even it's straight, but just doesn't look right. I feel for now only Sasha, Irina, and Michelle really have the whole package.
She has some obvious bad habits, such as pulling her neck while rotating most of the jumps, when doing 2axel her head has to turn to the opposite direction before turn to the direction she should rotate, and her spiral's free leg was to the side even it's straight, but just doesn't look right. I feel for now only Sasha, Irina, and Michelle really have the whole package.
Hmmmm.......
I haven't seen the Skate America competition but I can tell you this right now, no one is going to take Kimmie Meissner's place in the third spot at Nationals. Ain't gonna happen. First, Kimmie is a sure thing courtesy of the powers that be. She would have to have a complete meltdown for her not to make it and Kimmie is one tough competitor. I love Bebe's style and totally agree that she is undermarked, but she also seems so overloaded with energy, that she can't control the whole performance. I am gald to hear that Alissa had a wonderful performance, but she is too inconsistent with her jumps and truthfully, I don't see that changing enough right now to make her a contender for 3rd place. Maybe in a year or two.
I haven't seen the Skate America competition but I can tell you this right now, no one is going to take Kimmie Meissner's place in the third spot at Nationals. Ain't gonna happen. First, Kimmie is a sure thing courtesy of the powers that be. She would have to have a complete meltdown for her not to make it and Kimmie is one tough competitor. I love Bebe's style and totally agree that she is undermarked, but she also seems so overloaded with energy, that she can't control the whole performance. I am gald to hear that Alissa had a wonderful performance, but she is too inconsistent with her jumps and truthfully, I don't see that changing enough right now to make her a contender for 3rd place. Maybe in a year or two.
kyla2 said:
Well I agree with you that Kimmie is going to get that third spot but I don't quite agree with your reasoning. I think Kimmie is a better competitor than the other two (Alissa and "Bebe") but I don't think it's a sign of the "powers that be". However, in a close one they MIGHT give Kimmie the benefit of the doubt and put her on the team. After all, she's been hyped to the hilt and Alissa and "Bebe" basically haven't been heard of.
I finally watched Skate America tonight, and I agree- Czisny was pretty good. But I, too, worry about her consistency. That was only ONE good performance. She's got a ways to go to get herself out there, but she took an important first step. Filling in for one of the stars is not an easy thing but I believe she gave the fans their money's worth with that performance.
- Joined
- Jul 27, 2003
Irina has the whole package? IMO, no. I think she lacks elegance, line, and flow. To me her skating is powerful but not at all pretty. I also think that Cohen lacks the ability to project to the audience and while she has great line, not so great edges. Kwan's package is less complete now with all of the spin variations the other ladies are doing unless she has improved in that area since
last season. I don't see the lack of a 3/3 as much of a problem for her as the lack of flexibility in her lower back.
last season. I don't see the lack of a 3/3 as much of a problem for her as the lack of flexibility in her lower back.
Jesilly, ITA. I don't want to rain on Alissa's wonderful senior international debut and she has many wonderful qualities. But I think it's important to keep her skating in perspective. I went into detail in the "Alissa Czisny on the Hinged Figure Skating Boot" thread on The Edge (around page 5 or so, I think) so I won't repeat them here except to say I found her overall skating to be rather disjointed.jesslily said:
I'll somewhat echo Rgal that the good news is that Czisny is 18, which means not only is she past puberty (we hope) but also that she likely has the kinesthetic ability to make the improvements in her style she needs. I do like Alissa, especially the combination of athletic energy and emotional warmth in her presentation. But we do need to watch a skater compete with "the big dogs" over time before we can crown her "Greatest Thing Since Sliced Bread."
I also agree that right now, only Cohen, Kwan, and Sluskaya have the total package. No skater has a great measure of every single positive quality possible in skating. For me, the total package means that a skater has made up for her inevitable limitations and weaknesses with exceptional strength in other areas.
For example, Irina isn't what I'll call a balletic skater--I think Irina is very pretty
--but except for a couple of misguided programs, she doesn't try to be. For me, Irina is like the female version of Elvis Stojko. Her style isn't for everybody, but her strength, speed, edging, jumps, spins, and the excitement she can generate comprise the total package, IMO. I will emphasize that there is an enormous difference between the way Irina's skating looks on TV and the way it comes across if you're able to see her skate live. It's the biggest difference I've ever seen in a skater other than Surya Bonaly. Live, Irina looks far more graceful than on TV because when it's live, I think your eye is able to take in more of the total movement and focus less on the tiny details that get magnified by TV, such as pointed toes and things like that. Of course, live or on TV, for some people, Irina will never be their cup of tea and that, of course, is just fine.I'd make similar arguments for Michelle and Sasha, though of course use different examples relevant to each skater. But I think people get the idea.
As for Alissa, with Michelle and Sasha injured; with Sasha doing basically the same kind of program we've come to expect of her; and with Irina a question mark, I think it's great that Czisny has provided the beginning of the season with a big helping of positive excitement. I would love nothing more than to see Alissa realize her full potential. Same goes for Kimmie Meissner.
So we get a little carried away. I think for now it's a good thing. After all, we watch figure skating for enjoyment, at least I think most people do, and Czisny has provided us with a big shot of enjoyment during a time when we were all bummed at either Michelle or Sasha's injuries or both.
I can only speak for myself, but I know what I'm saying, and maybe Jesilly too, is, "We agree Alissa Czisny is great. But let's not hang the OGM or World gold medal around her neck just yet
."Good luck, Alissa!
Rgirl
Red Dog
What i mean about Kimmie is this: the powers that be see her as a tough competitor who can manage the pressure, and a skater who can hang onto her jumps, including the triple axel. That will get her the third spot short of a complete meltdown and an amazing performance from someone else.
What i mean about Kimmie is this: the powers that be see her as a tough competitor who can manage the pressure, and a skater who can hang onto her jumps, including the triple axel. That will get her the third spot short of a complete meltdown and an amazing performance from someone else.
kyla2 said:
I can give you that, but Kimmie still has to step up to the plate and hit the ball. It can't be given to her just like that. (Now, about another skater...
) So do the others. My only hope is that the best of the bunch gets to go, no matter who it might turn out to be.
It don't mean a thing if it ain't got that zing! 
- Joined
- Sep 20, 2003
I can speak for the long program live vs tv. Elena really was great, the zing and spark were there that are not so apparent in the broadcast.
As far as the cheat goes that she had in the long, if it was good enough for Kimmie and Alissa it should be good enough for Elena...
As far as the cheat goes that she had in the long, if it was good enough for Kimmie and Alissa it should be good enough for Elena...
Well, judging from the commentary that Dick and Peggy gave (and they were THERE, supposedly) I would have thought that she absolutely didn't deserve to be there. The TV camera made her look very unappealing but it's up to the commentators to point out the good and bad because they are right there calling the action. If they give comments that insinuate that it sucked, then I have to assume that it did.
Even on tv I thought Elena looked strong and and 'zing'...sure, here spirals are, well not so nice...but she looked to be in good form, I'm glad to hear others saw that (and live, how exciting!).
Someone was saying (Rgirl maybe) that she has bad stroking technique and that that is surprising given she is Russian....I'm just not able to see that even though I've been trying to look at the feet. But regardless, i though she seemed 'up' and energetic and in pretty good form.
Someone was saying (Rgirl maybe) that she has bad stroking technique and that that is surprising given she is Russian....I'm just not able to see that even though I've been trying to look at the feet. But regardless, i though she seemed 'up' and energetic and in pretty good form.
I'm glad to hear Elena looked zingy live. TV really gives the shaft to some skaters. But I still have a question for those who saw SA live: If Elena came across as zingy, how was Alissa? Zowie Wowie!!!? Or did each just have a different kind of zing, with. I assume, the total zing edge going to Alissa?emma said:
Yep, Emma, I'm the one guilty of saying I was surprised at Elena's poor stroking technique. Especially compared to great Russian strokers (hmm?) such as G&G, Bereznaya&Sikhaluridze, Ilia Kulik, Victoria Volchkova, and Irina, I found Elena's stroking to be short, that is, with very little distance between the feet on the back stroking. Also, each stroke did not seem to move her farther along with increasing glide. Plus she didn't have very good knee bend, but then she's had knee surgery. At least that's the way I saw it.
However, I would love to hear from somebody who saw Elena live on the stroking issue, especially as she compares to great strokers who were at the event or other great strokers you've seen live.
Rgirl
- Joined
- Jun 21, 2003
I can't comment of the quality of stroking, but in the SP I would say that the main area in which Sokolova's program fell short was musical interpretation and "selling it" to the audience. While the music was soaring to a hugely extended climax lasting the whole last thirty seconds, Elena was putzing around doing some weak spirals and half-hearted spins.
Nevertheless, the power of her jumps and the fact that she gave a clean skate set her well above all the others in the SP. She got the loudest applause by far of all the performers, even though the audience was very supportive of all the American skaters.
I didn't see Czisny's LP live, but in the SP, I thought that she was more delicate than Sokolova, she smiled more and the audience was definitely encouraging her every step of the way -- especially that part of the audience that knows her history of "great potential, too many falls."
At Skate Canada, she may not have such a warm audience (they will be cheering for Rochette). We'll see whether that will make a difference, zing-wise.
MM
Nevertheless, the power of her jumps and the fact that she gave a clean skate set her well above all the others in the SP. She got the loudest applause by far of all the performers, even though the audience was very supportive of all the American skaters.
I didn't see Czisny's LP live, but in the SP, I thought that she was more delicate than Sokolova, she smiled more and the audience was definitely encouraging her every step of the way -- especially that part of the audience that knows her history of "great potential, too many falls."
At Skate Canada, she may not have such a warm audience (they will be cheering for Rochette). We'll see whether that will make a difference, zing-wise.
MM
Rgirl...thanks for explaining some of the stroking issues (that word makes me giggle). Anyway, Cizzny looked fab on tv for the LP (i didn't see the short, don't know if they showed it). I mean she wowed even on tv....but sure, you could see that she is 'arriving' but not quite there but I can't remember details at the moment to say exactlty what. I mean it was little things and not really the fall per se (although that counts). I guess what I'm saying is I could see why she won the LP, got real excited about the prospect of watching her skate more, AND wasn't surprised that Elena won overall even without seeing the shorts.
- Joined
- Sep 20, 2003
Mathman said:
We were quite high for my sight, but I brought my special telescope I got from Maxi Aids a few years ago! It was like I was right with the skaters! I had a hard time following them occasionally when I ran into someone's head, and if they had light costumes on forget it, but otherwise I was able to manage quite well.
We hope to continue the tradition and go next year too, hopefully with closer seats, especially if Dasha will join us, her sight is worse than mine.
- Joined
- Jun 21, 2003
Hey Anya Angie, all you have to do is move down to the lower seats after the show starts, LOL.
I have very bad eyesight, too. I bought some special binoculars with a built-in camera, but I am not good enough with them to follow the action or to take pictures.
I have very bad eyesight, too. I bought some special binoculars with a built-in camera, but I am not good enough with them to follow the action or to take pictures.
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