Men's Short Program - USA, Japan, and France Oh My

[Tonichelle]

Notice also the the Technical Specialist is Todd Sand

what's your point with noting that? *confused*

 

[SailorGalaxia518]

Just that I didn't know that Todd sand even was a technical specialist

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

Just that I didn't know that Todd sand even was a technical specialist

I wonder if he is downgrading any jumps?

 

[seafoam]

Johnny is out of the mix. With Lambiel still up there, Joubert revived, Oda and Takahashi coming into their own, and Lysacek consistent and solid there isnt room for Weir to be a real contender anymore.

I wouldn' write Johnny off just yet. But I think he needs to get back to his familiar style, at least next season. It's too late for this season. The way he skated at Marshall's--it was some of the best skating I've seen from him. More power and fire than usual, along with that exquisite grace and smoothness.

In that Platov interview, he said that the most dangerous thing was making a change in a skater's style--that you either sink or swim, nothing in between. Well, I don't think Johnny is swimming with these new programs, unfortunately. I just don't think he's feelin' it, and that's reflected in his scores. Even if he didn't make the jumps, his PCS was always high. Now he's not even getting that.

I honestly think he's potentially one of the greatest talents out there. I'd love more than anything to see his potential fulfilled.

 

[slutskayafan21]

I wouldn' write Johnny off just yet. But I think he needs to get back to his familiar style, at least next season. It's too late for this season. The way he skated at Marshall's--it was some of the best skating I've seen from him. More power and fire than usual, along with that exquisite grace and smoothness.

In that Platov interview, he said that the most dangerous thing was making a change in a skater's style--that you either sink or swim, nothing in between. Well, I don't think Johnny is swimming with these new programs, unfortunately. I just don't think he's feelin' it, and that's reflected in his scores. Even if he didn't make the jumps, his PCS was always high. Now he's not even getting that.

I honestly think he's potentially one of the greatest talents out there. I'd love more than anything to see his potential fulfilled.

I dont think he has judges respect anymore really, and they have grown tired of waiting for him and he has dropped down the pecking order with the emergence of alot of the up and comers. I think it is too late for him.

He is regularly scoring mid 70s for squeeky clean shorts so far this year, when the scoring has become increasing all the time for the men. At this event he has less glaring technical errors then Oda and Oda beat him by about 0.4 per each program component score, that is a huge difference, and that is supposably Weir's greatest strength. At Skate Canada Lambiel had major disruptive errors in his disaesterous short program, his skating and programs looked totally unprepared and coated in rust and still beat Weir on the PC scores in the short. What does all that tell you?

 

[Tonichelle]

Just that I didn't know that Todd sand even was a technical specialist

oh ok... it was just so random that I was confused lol

IIRC he also called some events last season

 

[seafoam]

I dont think he has judges respect anymore really, and they have grown tired of waiting for him and he has dropped down the pecking order with the emergence of alot of the up and comers. I think it is too late for him.

He is regularly scoring mid 70s for squeeky clean shorts so far this year, when the scoring has become increasing all the time for the men. At this event he has less glaring technical errors then Oda and Oda beat him by about 0.4 per each program component score, that is a huge difference, and that is supposably Weir's greatest strength. At Skate Canada Lambiel had major disruptive errors in his disaesterous short program, his skating and programs looked totally unprepared and coated in rust and still beat Weir on the PC scores in the short. What does all that tell you?

You're welcome to you're opinion ::

 

[Vodka Shot]

How did Oda get higher marks than Johnny after falling on 3A and popping the 3f???? Johnny's only mistake was doubling the 3 flip- am I reading this correct?

b/c he's Johnny Weir. :scowl:
Damn, what happened to Oda? He's one of my faves.
As usual Joubert has ridiculously inflated PCS JMHO.
I srsly hope Evan is better by worlds and I srsly hope Takahashi can pull ahead of Joubert.

 

[Kasey]

How did Oda get higher marks than Johnny after falling on 3A and popping the 3f???? Johnny's only mistake was doubling the 3 flip- am I reading this correct?

Um, Johnny had a fall also.

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

Um, Johnny had a fall also.

Johnny did not fall on a required element. I'm trying to find out if one faults on a required element it is as serious as it used to be. Maybe the rules have changed where incomplete or missing elements are no longer heavily penalized in the Short Program and the SP is just a mini LP skate.

Anyone know?

Joe

 

[debdelilah]

Johnny did not fall on a required element. I'm trying to find out if one faults on a required element it is as serious as it used to be. Maybe the rules have changed where incomplete or missing elements are no longer heavily penalized in the Short Program and the SP is just a mini LP skate.

Anyone know?

Joe

I think COP works exactly the same for both. When I look at judging protocols, they just list the base value for each item, and the GOE, and then any deductions for timing violations or falls.

Keeping in mind, too, that jumps aren't the only elements being graded. Oda has been very good at presenting his short program, and it suits him well, and his spins are fast. When he skated it clean, it consistantly earned over 80 points.

I hope he and Johnny both improve in the LP.

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

I think COP works exactly the same for both. When I look at judging protocols, they just list the base value for each item, and the GOE, and then any deductions for timing violations or falls.

Then I find the SP just a mini LP and really not necessary.

Keeping in mind, too, that jumps aren't the only elements being graded. Oda has been very good at presenting his short program, and it suits him well, and his spins are fast. When he skated it clean, it consistantly earned over 80 points..

Not in practice. I've seen slips in spins resulting in falling in several SPs in the past and they were heavily penalized. All I am saying is that it appears to be no longer penalized for missing required elements, and the SP is not being tested for Technical as was the original purpose.

Joe