New Hersh Article- says Kwan probably won't be at December event

[Doggygirl]

A couple MK questions....

I go firmly on record hoping MK "is BACK" for US Nats. That's seffish on my part, as it will be my first elite competition to see live, ever.

I'm wondering about MK's injury, and how far back it goes. MK has always been very private, so little "news" tends to come in any official sense from MK or her spokespeople.

Since she IS so silent, lots of "chatter" tends to get fire over the internet. Here is my question.

Does MK's injury really go back one or more years, or is that just urban legend?

As MK's current injury has kept her out of a couple of current season comps, I first read things like "here's a report - MK is back on the ice." And somehow some of those reports seemed to blossom into "this is a historic injury that MK has been battling for years."

I have no idea what MK's issues really are, and when they started. But I've seen nothing official from MK (or Kamp) indicating that her current problems are a result of past injuries. I suspect that "Urban Legand" has taken hold with regard to how far back these problems go.

Here is my question. If MK has hip (or any other) problems that she (or her team) attribute to past problems, are there any links to official commentaries about this?

Mean time, all the best to MK for a great recovery. Hope to see MK "live" for my first ever time at US Nats!!!!

DG

 

[R.D.]

MK tends to keep a lot of things under wraps (I suppose she's just not that type of person) so I take most of the stuff people say on here about her with a grain of salt. However, a few posters claim to be "in the know" about MK and have a good "track record" of being right, so I sort of trust them.

 

[BronzeisGolden]

Mean time, all the best to MK for a great recovery. Hope to see MK "live" for my first ever time at US Nats!!!!

That is one of my favorite memories and one of the most enjoyable experiences of my life....attending the 2004 U.S. Nationals. It was my first time at a major competition and I was in heaven. The atmosphere was great, and I so enjoyed seeing ALL of the ladies skate their LPs. It is a completely different experience live. AND....I got to see Michelle deliver one of her most heartfelt performances to "Tosca". I hope you can have the same type of experience, DG.

 

[Rgirl]

Now I am NOT saying Michelle does what I'm about to discuss at all. I am definitely not "in the know" when it comes to skaters, except for things that have been reported by the media, whether on TV, online, or in print.

With that out of the way, some/many/who knows how many skaters prefer to keep any injuries under wraps as part of their competitive strategy. If other skaters know a top skater is injured, it can them feel more confident, ie, "If Top Skater is skating with an injury, I have a real chance of beating him/her!"

This can prompt the Top Skater's Competition (TSC) to not only feel more confident in practices and competition, but to also put more work and concentration into practicing their weak points, which most skaters hate to do.

Of course, many/some/who knows skaters are truly private people and want to keep things that way for no other reason than "'t'ain't no body's business but their own." JMO and experience.

I certainly wish Michelle the best and am heartily with those who would hate to see Michelle end her eligible career by having to withdraw from Nats, not to mention Olys and Worlds, which I don't even want to think about. I understand we have to send our three best and healthiest skaters to the Olympics, but with the love for Michelle at Nats and her chance (still, I hope!) of winning a 10th National championship, even if Michelle just had to skate around, do what she can, and create the magic she does (provided she's not in serious pain nor that she makes herself worse), I think it would be a fitting opportunity for the fans to give Michelle a tribute like nobody's ever seen before and that she certainly derserves.

Of course I want Michelle healthy and skating well enough to skate at Nationals make the Oly team. But if the skate gods happen to make a bad call so this can't happen, I'll settle for giving her time enough to heal and have one last great competition at Worlds. Or even if it's not so great, as long as Michelle goes out in her inimitable gracious way on the ice.

Rgirl

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

I really believe that Michelle has had a sub-par back/hip problem since before 2002. She had been cutting back on much of the moves in the field after 2000. She also began to cut back on the GPs, and skated only Nats and Worlds. Of course she did the cheesfests but none of these competitions were more than her usual technical and even then the technical was slipping due to the pain.

She did skate a remarkable Worlds 2003 but even that there was no stretch of technical in the program. She won it on her stunning performance, and I believe ignoring the pain.

We know she is a private person and nothing about her health is ever revealed unless she has to cancel. (Other skaters tend to let the public know that they are skating under hardships.}

We will not know the whole story until she is ready to tell it. She's a lady in the true sense of the word.

I'll be in St. Louis and I am afraid it will be the last time I see Michelle and I doubt it will not be more than a bow on the ice.

Really sad.

Joe

 

[nymkfan51]

It's been almost two years that I have been hearing about about back/hip problems ... although I agree with Joe, I think they go back even before that.
Michelle is a very private person. I'm not sure we will ever know exactly what her health issues are/were.

I do believe though, that this injury now is more serious than originally thought. But I also believe she has been working as hard as she can to get back to training. She wants to skate this season ... that is obvious to me; and if she can, she will.

 

[swannanoa54]

And if she ever gets beyond the "flexibility IS expressive!" choreography and actually tries something new, something that she has not used four times already, I'll give her some credit.

Well, dancindiva, that could apply to any skater constantly doing Biellmans or any other contortionistic move that garners points. Flexibility IS expressive and impressive under COP. If you are flexible, you garner points left and right. However, I find flexibility to be a yawn if it is overdone. Therefore, I've always despised Sasha's final BC spin and every catch foot spin Irina and others do. I find the repetition by every male and some females of the "how far can I scrunch and stick my hand up" spins to be as boring and as repetitious as the Biellmans. I find COP is starting to make every program look the same no matter who skates to what music because everyone is trying to rack up points.

I do, however, think that Irina is skating the best, technically, at this time. I think she lacks the complete package and is judged in PCS scores on choreo and interpretation on the fact that she stays on her feet.

However let's revisit this if Irina has the same type of skate at Euros this year that she had last year and still wins with the high scores she is getting now. And let's revisit this if the other skaters stay on their feet, have outstanding skates (or even pretty good skates and they land ALL their jumps) and Irina still wins with falls. FWIW, I don't like it when any skater falls on anything. I think it disrupts the flow of the program and I don't think there's any such thing as a "good" fall. A fall's a fall and should be marked down completely.

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

I think it is time for posters to define flexibility. There have been very few figure skaters who I would say are NOT flexible. I would say that about baseball players also like the infielder who jumps way up and stretches to catch a fly ball.
All athletes are flexible as are actors and so many more in show biz. They have to be. It's their work.

Getting back to the meaning of posters perception of flexibility in figure skating.

1. Are we discussing who has the most flexibility? (Are degrees of flexibility not considered unless they compare with the best?)

2. Must that flexibility mimic ballet? (Bielman positions are character positions not classical ballet positions.)

3. Are flexible positions in figure skating more important than jumps?

4. Skaters who do not measure up to the most flexible skaters should not skate because figure skating is based on balletic flexibility. T or F? (Is that in the rules?)

5. Are fans allowed to appreciate skaters with less flexibility than the ones perceived to have the most especially if they show "passion" without one?

IMO, Nothing wrong with a high free leg with toe pointed in a spiral, but I tend to go to the edges which are more about skating. A high free leg in a spiral gets a +1 for me. And 'high' for me is a beautiful look - not necessarily verticle.

Joe

 

[mzheng]

My hope is that both Shizuka and Kwan skate the skates of their lives and let it be between the three of them. Then, if the judges do as they are doing now and place Irina's PCS scores above BOTH of them I will finally realize that skating is no longer about the ENTIRE package, but just a little bag. While I think, technically, Irina is better ( not superior) in some aspects, I think Shizuka and Michelle have everything and what they might lack in technical they more than make up in presentation.

I agree you whole heartly.

 

[mzheng]

So True. And after watching Irina's COC freeskate. I'm not so sure she's unbeatable. She wasn't as clean as I orignally thought. She two-footed her double axel and had a not so great landing on a loop (I believe). And her presentation is just awful, nowhere near as good as her short. Granted she got the PCS scores, but like someone mentioned in another thread, that could be because she was head and shoulders above her competition (particularly in the short) at COC.
.

You may be right. And Suzzie mentioned her jump entry is not that clean, often sloppy. But obviousely judges don't see it. Just watched 2002 Olympics again......And more often than other top ladies she tended to add one rotation of elusion spine at her jump landing.....soon if the trend continue you'll find this elusion spin at the end of landing will be counted into some transition score or positive GOE since it's considered a transition move after the jump....

 

[mzheng]

Guess one way to bow out gracefuly is to show up then drop out due to injury and then retire.

Your wish?

If she shows up, she'll EARN that ticket to Turino!

 

[mzheng]

How can she possibly be ready for Nationals in just 6 wks if she isn't able to land her triples yet? She's running out of time....

I would think the same way as you before this injury fisco. But seems there is always something new to learn. According to her coach and parents, the jumps you learn to do you never forget. As long as the programs ready, you just need 4 weeks (if she is allowed to jump without risking permernant injury) to get the triples back and consistant, then stuck them into the programs. The most important thing is if she is mentally ready....since so far there is no official announcement directly from Kwan Kamp, I would expect her rehabi process goes smoothly (though longer than what Dr. Yu first anticipated).......If she is not ready, IMO, she'll make decision and anouncement before Nationals......Currently she is doing exactly what Shep says she is doing.

 

[mzheng]

You mean like that catch foot spin she ALWAYS does at the very end of EVERY program I have ever seen her do? Or that spiral move where she lifts her foot up and turns? I was watching the short programs that were on this evening, and thinking to myself that Sashas programs all look EXACTLY the same, regardless of the music or anything else. It's hard to believe she is 21 years old...her skating almost looks no different from the 15 year old Sasha we first saw at the 2000 Nationals.

Nop. There is different. Her edge is more steady. For example, that spiral move you mentioned, in past more often her edge would got 'skidding' when she switche to this position because her lack of control or lack of edge. But in this SP her transition of position and edge were so smooth, no bubbling....Thank GOD at least she only put her I spin in her program ONCE.

 

[JanJam]

MM, with this system being based on a cumulative point basis, 3.36 points can mean a great deal.
Now, so we're clear ... I do not believe that anyone would have beaten Irina so far this season, but the scores should have been closer, IMO. The way things are now, there is no contest for the gold. If the PCS were given more fairly, there might just be some slight question who would win.

I think what might be the problem is the judges don't have enough time to evaluate each component score individually. Thus, Irina is getting the advantage of her good marks in SS and PE spilling over to the other categories.
In any case, nothing I have seen so far shows me that Irina has improved in any measuable amount in her presentation/interpretation skills.

That's my story and I'm sticking to it!

Yes. Irina's skating may be fast and powerful, but her entire skating is ugly. Her preps for her jumps are ugly, her line is ugly, her arm and leg movements are ugly, and even her supposed master move - the Biellmann, is just pure ugly. She does not move with the music and her interpretation is very "forced." The rests in her programs make for ugly transitions. And she definitely does not move with grace. She can get rack up points in her completely rotated but ugly jumps for all I care, but how she gets scores above 7.0 in any of the PCS categories for her non-existent artistry is beyond me.

 

[Mathman]

OK, but other than that, how do you like Irina's skating?

 

[JanJam]

OK, but other than that, how do you like Irina's skating?

He, he I do admire her determination as a skating competitor and her athleticism although as I don't agree with the scores she receives.

And unlike other people who think she'll succumb to the Olys pressure, I don't think she'll buckle at all.

 

[nymkfan51]

Don't hold back JanJam ... tell us how you really feel!

Whatever Irina's doing, the judges seem to like it ... so I guess she doesn't have to worry about what we think.

 

[BronzeisGolden]

How much preparation time did Michelle lose in 97-98 due to the toe injury? I know she withdrew from the Champions' Series Final in December and had to stay off of the ice for a period of time. I also know she also had to take it slow when she began training again. Is it at all comparable to this new injury?

 

[soogar]

How much preparation time did Michelle lose in 97-98 due to the toe injury? I know she withdrew from the Champions' Series Final in December and had to stay off of the ice for a period of time. I also know she also had to take it slow when she began training again. Is it at all comparable to this new injury?

Well she did compete in SA and SC that season so she didn't miss that much time. Though a 17 year old body tends to bounce back quicker than a 25 year old body.

 

[kyla2]

Gezando

Stalking is when you are fixated on one particular person (for whatever reason) and you follow them obsessively. You have never missed a chance to rip apart one of my posts (actually dissect it would be a better description)-with decidedly mixed results I may add. It's not name calling Gezando, it's describing your behavior. To the point that you have even determined that my friend with the M.S. must have been taking a different kind of steroid than I was (a little knowledge is a dangerous thing sometimes). You were wrong of course, we were taking the same kind (in fact the exact same drug). It's sheer nuttiness on your part. You have attributed every possible motive to my comments/opinions just short of trying to undermine Western Civilization. Part of me finds you amusing and part of me finds you pathetic. I have a solution that you should consider: I will ignore your posts if you will ignore mine.