Sasha Cohen - here we go, AGAIN!!!!

[Rgirl]

News or Rumor?

I'm sure she does have a diva complex - or something near that.

In that vein, diva's do not want any talented competition around them. Usually they have someone disuade the "competition threat"; in Sasha's case, she's doing the dirty work herself.

I wonder if she has a sane mind - in that respect.
sh

There are just too many "Sasha" reports about behaviour problems. There's the she just has to be the first one on the ice thing (who was it jumped over the boards just to usurp her?), then there's all these practice reports, factor in that the girl can't seem to keep a decent coach and it all adds up to there is something going on.

Puh-lease. Piel, I'm with you.:agree:

According to Timothy Goebel, Frank Carroll fired him and Michelle left Carroll six months before the '02 Olympics. Something must be going on there!

Dorothy Hamill went bankrupt with Ice Capades, her husband was having affairs with several of the Ice Capade skaters for years without Dorothy knowing, and ultimately Dorothy divorced him. Plus, according to Scott Hamilton's autobiography, SOI had a difficult relationship with Dorothy Hamill. Now there's smoke if I ever saw it!

According to the Washington Post, Jenny Kirk has had three coaches in three years; Tim Goebel is on his third coach since 2000; and Michelle Kwan has had four coaches, including herself, since 2001. If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, it must be a duck!

A number of people post that they don't like Michael Weiss's personality. Surely he must be guilty of something pretty bad!

It goes without saying that people are entitled to feel any way they want about Sasha Cohen. She's human and like every human I know, she's probably done things she regrets. And clearly intimidation tactics exist in every sport. I just haven't seen them from Sasha.

However, to question Sasha's sanity and blow out of proportion coaching changes common to a number of top US skaters, not to mention skaters from other countries, well, I'll defer to what one of our moderators, Joesitz, says: "When a poster bashes a skater, it says more about the poster than it does about the skater."

I posted the link to Eliza88's description of what happened (she was there) in Post #2 of this thread. But so people don't have to click the link and find the post, here's the quote.

http://www.goldenskate.com/forum/showthread.php?t=8202&page=9&pp=15
Post #133 by Eliza88, 1-14-2005 (Day of Ladies SP)

About the near Michelle/Sasha collision--it was a bit close, however I have seen a lot closer! Michelle was in the air, Sasha took too sharp a turn (or something like that), the crowd gasped and Michelle shrugged it off IMMEDIATELY! She kind of gestured to Sasha "no biggie" (hmmmm, that doesn't sound right!). Anyway, Michelle made it look right away that it was a non-event.

Rgirl

 

[gezando]

I wasn't accusing--I was identifying with her.
I have ADD and was empathizing.
I deliberately avoided anything resembling a diagnosis.

Flora you have to know that here at GS some posters are very militant, and team tag about others can not about their own health experience. Last year I mentioned that I had shingles, and I was told that only MD should talk about shingles, posters should not talk about their own experience.

If you dare to disagree with them they will cry foul and asked for mommy, I mean daddy

 

[Piel]

Sounds like ADD (Attention Deficit Disorder) to me.
We don't know if Sasha has it but some of her public behaviors seem consistent with the symptoms.
In her journal entry of the near miss incindent she says something to the effect that she thought Michelle came out of nowhere and that 's a real flag for ADD.
It would would explain so much.

Flora you have to know that here at GS some posters are very militant about others can not about their own health experience. Last year I mentioned that I had shingles, and I was told that only MD should talk about shingles, posters should not talk about their own experience.

But Flora in your post you were not relating your own experience but speculating on what caused Sasha's behaviour. There is a difference. Then in a later post you said that you were identifying with her.

I wasn't accusing--I was identifying with her.
I have ADD and was empathizing.
I deliberately avoided anything resembling a diagnosis.

Read your first post again. "Sounds like ADD to me." "We don't know if Sasha has it but some of her public behaviors seem consistent with the symptoms." "Her journal entry of the near miss incindent she says something to the effect that she thought Michelle came out of nowhere and that 's a real flag for ADD." Not diagnosing but suggesting.

Talk about your own health experiences all you want. I just happen to think that speculating about what might or might not be wrong with someone physically or mentally especially when they are not here to speak up for themselves is wrong. That is one of the ways rumors get started. One or two symptoms does not always mean someone has a particular disorder. While you may be quite comfortable discussing your medical history with everyone here for others it is a private matter. It is just one of those areas that I feel is off limits.

 

[Eeyora]

At this point I don't know what to believe. But I had a feeling after the 2002 Nationals warmups. Sasha would never let the incident down.

 

[gezando]

But Flora in your post you were not relating your own experience but speculating on what caused Sasha's behaviour. There is a difference. Then in a later post you said that you were identifying with her.

There is a difference, but last year when I related my own experience of shingles some posters, including you Piel were going on about how posters should not talk about shingles even their own expierence unless they are MDs.

Talk about your own health experiences all you want.

What a change and revision of opinion in one year Piel.

I just happen to think that speculating about what might or might not be wrong with someone physically or mentally especially when they are not here to speak up for themselves is wrong.

I think speculation of public figure's physical or mental health may or may not be off limits depending on the situation. BTW I do not speculate on anyone's physical or mental health . OTOH I have seen some Cohen fans speculating about her "attention" problems, and may need a "sports psychologist" here at GS many times, and you did not protest. Why the inconsistencies? I have seen posters here calling Weiss "narcissistic personality disorder" Have you protested and protected Weiss then? I have seen some basher here bashed another poster with OCD, and you were silent then why?? IMHO the latter is definitely off limits and wrong.

 

[Piel]

Not my night in the barrel Gezando!

 

[attyfan]

Just out of curiosity -- if Sasha gave to other cars on the road when she is driving the same attention that she seems to be giving to other skaters when she is warming up, would you feel safe driving if you knew that she, also, was driving? Would you want her driver's license revoked? Even though these all are accidental, the fact remains that these collisions could cause severe injury, and, care needs to be taken. If Kwan, for example, "came out of nowhere", then maybe she needs to pay more attention to what the other skaters are doing.

 

[R.D.]

Maybe she does need to pay better attention to where she's going (it does seem to happen a bit more frequently with her) but these things happen. I mean, didn't ESPN show some mishaps during the Men's warm-up?

As for the driving comment I thought that was a little out of line as it's the worst speculation can get.

Piel

 

[sk8er1964]

Anyone who has seriously competed (or even practiced) knows that those types of things are completely unavoidable.

I was on a session once with about 25 girls working on a triples, and a friend of mine came right behind me when I was in the middle of a jump. I couldn't move, and she didn't realize I was there, and my blade sliced her leg and she had to get stitches. Did that mean that I had it out for her, or vise-versa? No, I felt terrible, as did she.

Warmups are even worse, since you have to completely prepare in 6 minutes. When people are skating with any kind of speed or resolve, those things happen. It doesn't mean that skaters are resorting to intimidation tactics or that they have ADD. It's simply part of the sport.

Hmmm. I had a near collision a couple of times in competition warm ups. Then there was that girl at practice who came within a foot of me while I was in the air in an axel. Wonder if they were out to get me? :sheesh:

Folks, as Perry says, it is normal for skaters to be so into themselves in competition warm ups that near misses happen. The reason that you don't hear about them more is that usually there is no "intimidation theory" that would make them interesting to people on the internet. Do some people try to intimidate? Probably. However, the skaters would know who they are and those tactics generally don't work. Skating is a very, very small world. Take Michelle's words at face value. She wasn't bothered by it - why should anyone else be?

 

[chuckm]

After the 2002 incident, Sasha made the comment that she wasn't paying attention to what the other skaters were doing, that she was concentrating only on what she was doing. In effect, she was saying that other skaters should look out for her, that it wasn't up to her to look out for other skaters.

That says to me that Sasha doesn't deliberately set out to intimidate other skaters, but at the same time, she is not particularly concerned about how other skaters are affected by her movements.

So if I were a skater on the same rink with Sasha, I would want to be as far away from her as possible.

 

[attyfan]

chuckm -- you made the point that I was trying to make with my driving analogy! IMHO, the important issue is not whether Sasha is trying to intimidate Michelle; instead, the important issue is whether Sasha (and every other skater) is taking as much care as they can to avoid such accidents, and if any specific skater is not paying proper attentiion to the others on the rink, then some form of disciplinary action is needed.

 

[gezando]

Not my night in the barrel Gezando!

Yeah you already had your night by pointing the barrel at flora

 

[show 42]

Here's a dumb comment from a non-skater.........why have so many doing warm-ups at the same time? You know they are all going to be warming up jumps, frantically stroking across the ice to warm up their leg muscles.......put three of them on the ice at a time, let them skate, and then the last three. Shouldn't put a big deficiet in their time allotment..........I know, they can save the minutes by not cutting to that idiotic sky cam................... 42

 

[Piel]

Wrong kind of barrel Gezando

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

There now seems to be two threads of this going. I was there too and saw what I saw, and there was some blocking, but it did not seem to me to be deliberate blocking by anyone. When the call from the ref says to take the ice, there is a scramble to get out there. It is only natural to lose oneself in the moment of the last practice. That's what skaters do.

If you look closely, and there is deliberate blocking you will see a chase from one contestant after another on more than one instance. If that happens then there is indeed deliberate blocking.

I did not see this but then again, I wasn't paying that much attention to Sasha. I was looking at Kimmie whom I was told just may do a 3A. BTW, she did do the 3A and it was a beaut.

Joe

 

[nuggetr]

I think, where there's smoke, there's fire. There are just too many "Sasha" reports about behaviour problems. There's the she just has to be the first one on the ice thing (who was it jumped over the boards just to usurp her?), then there's all these practice reports, factor in that the girl can't seem to keep a decent coach and it all adds up to there is something going on. I could be way off base but if it waddles like a duck, quacks like a duck and has feathers like a duck....it's a duck.

Very original :sheesh: All the talk about her bumping Michelle reminds me of a BMW bumping into a F150 . Can you guess who would get hurt here? I don't think it would be Michelle as she has what maybe 15-20 pounds on Sasha?

 

[shdotz]

Sasha & Katerina Witt

O.K. for starters, remember Katarina Witt? She was notorious for REALLY trying to intimidate her fellow competitors. She even admitted that she engaged in that kind of behavior. Sasha isn't even remotely in the same league. That's all the history I care to give you. I cannot for the life of me, understand why some of you insist on villifying Sasha.

I've heard that KW was especially guilty of doing these same kinds of things. Unfortunately, during that time, I was not as "tuned in" to figure skatings as I now am. If I had been aware back then - and if I had had a computer, etc. - I would have made the same remarks.

This intimidation stuff has to stop - regardless of who is participating.

The more said in print, the more the person who intimidates is aware that they are being talked about for unsportsmanship conduct. Nothing wrong with that. If you want to stop a bully, just bring the conduct to the light and let everyone know what's going on. I didn't write the news articles; I just read them.

I know the same stuff goes on in other sports - maybe even all of them; I only tune into figure skating and gymnastics, so I only know what I see and read concerning those two sports.

I've witnessed other types of interference with skaters, like the time Kurt Browning kept signing autographs and stayed on the ice when it was time for Todd Eldredge to begin his skate in a competition - this was a couple of years ago. THAT really ticked me off, and since then I've lost my admiration for KB. I have zero tolerance for this type of thing.

Am I the only one who expects fairness in competition?

I doubt it. sh

 

[shdotz]

bump MK on purpose?

Why don't you guys shut the hell up about Sasha---get a grip. All you are trying to do is start controversy comparing it to Tonya and Nancy. Do you think that she would bump into Michelle on purpose--- to ruin her own career and possibly hurt herself in the process. What would something like that prove? It seems as if the media and whoever are blowing things out of proportion, let sleeping dogs lie. get over it and see who will win at worlds, not Nationals. OVER AND OUT!!!!!

Time will tell. Intimidation is intended to get the competitor nervous and lose concentration. If SC's tries would work, then the competitor might just not skate their best, giving SC the upper hand - even if she falls three times!

By the way, only Bullies intimidate.

Friends support.

sh

 

[shdotz]

15 - 20 pounds - are you kidding?

Very original :sheesh: All the talk about her bumping Michelle reminds me of a BMW bumping into a F150 . Can you guess who would get hurt here? I don't think it would be Michelle as she has what maybe 15-20 pounds on Sasha?

This has nothing to do with weight. It has to do with bad sportsmanship.

It has to do with trying to bully someone.

If you don't get it by now, you probably won't get it later.

sh

 

[RealtorGal]

I can't believe that anyone in his right mind truly believes that Sasha has nothing better to do with a paltry 6 minute warm-up than plot how to intimidate a competitor. That is just ridiculous.