World Team Trophy: Teams and Entries

[Buttercup]

I agree. This may be the first and last of this series. Or maybe it will be in Japan every year, or at least until Mao Asada and Miki Ando retire.

For some reason I have in the back of my mind the idea that it was supposed to be held every other year. I think it would be hard to find any other country that could guarantee a big enough audience and televsion coverage to make it pay.

I think the ISU said that the first two WTTs will be held in Japan. After that, who knows?

But clearly, and unlike what some columnists in the US seem to think, figure skating is thriving in some places :agree:.

 

[McWicked]

Zhang??? Seriously??? kick mule Zhang??? I'm sooooo disappointed!!!!!! Well, at least Flatt is going. :thumbsup:

 

[feraina]

Zhang??? Seriously??? kick mule Zhang??? I'm sooooo disappointed!!!!!! Well, at least Flatt is going. :thumbsup:

Well, had Alissa placed top 10 at World's, USFSA would have no choice but send her. But even having been denied the chance to compete at World's, Caroline is still US's top-ranking lady:
http://www.isufs.org/ws/wsladies.htm
and this without having the benefit of competing in international B's like Alissa.

So why shouldn't Caroline be sent?

Go Caroline! Can't wait to see you mule-kick your way to another "surprising" finish!

 

[Shaba22]

teams and entries

TEAM:
http://www.isufs.org/events/wtt-09_teams.htm

CATEGORIES:
http://www.isufs.org/events/fsevent00011015

 

[Trewyn]

Looking at the teams Canada has the best all around team; they have a real top notch skater or team in each discipline. Followed closely by the US. Japan has really strong teams in Ladies and Men. Russia's good in Dance and Pairs, and they now have Leonova to possibly do well (she beat Caroline at Jr Worlds). China and France really can't compare to the others; they have one or two stars.

Oh; and looks like they didn't offer a spot to Alissa, since she's substitute. Doesn't surprise me. Though if they really went all ranking-wise, Ashley would be substitute (assuming Kimmie and Mirai would decline). But I guess Alissa is more logical choice.

 

[PolymerBob]

Caroline confirmed she is indeed going. She said she was told last Sunday, which would be right after World's.

Well, I guess we know whom the USFSA thinks their best ladies REALLY are.

 

[Buttercup]

Looking at the teams Canada has the best all around team; they have a real top notch skater or team in each discipline. Followed closely by the US. Japan has really strong teams in Ladies and Men. Russia's good in Dance and Pairs, and they now have Leonova to possibly do well (she beat Caroline at Jr Worlds). China and France really can't compare to the others; they have one or two stars.

I disagree about Canada vs. the US. I think the US has better depth in the singles disciplines and are fielding a very good dance team. Both could win, but I would say the US has a better shot at it. As I understand it, the key is the singles skaters; a first-place finish gets 12 points and you lose one point for each placement beneath that. So the lowest ranked dance and pairs teams will get 7 points, compared to only 1 point for the last-place men and ladies.

 

[chuckm]

I can't picture Cynthia Phaneuf finishing last or even close to last. She should be able to beat the Didiers, Binshu Xu and Yan Liu at the very minimum, and possibly Gerboldt as well. That would give her 6 points.

Denney/Barrett could beat James/Bonheur and Takahashi/Tran for a total of 9 points.

The men are completely unpredictable. I think it will be tough to beat the Japanese ladies on home ice.

 

[PolymerBob]

I think the biggest competition for the Americans will come from the Canadians. The Japanese are weaker in all areas except the ladies.

 

[Dipyramidal]

I can't picture Cynthia Phaneuf finishing last or even close to last. She should be able to beat the Didiers, Binshu Xu and Yan Liu at the very minimum, and possibly Gerboldt as well. That would give her 6 points.

Denney/Barrett could beat James/Bonheur and Takahashi/Tran for a total of 9 points.

The men are completely unpredictable. I think it will be tough to beat the Japanese ladies on home ice.

James/bonheur are better than you think......

mao and miki will probably dominate in the women, maybe rochette will become a factor.
The japanese man always skate well at home.


I hope yuna kim doesn't come to these, she has already other things to do and doubt this is going to be a big profit for her as she gains massive amounts of cash from endorsements.

 

[shallwedansu]

As I read the rules, I think they must invite Kim for the exhibition, since she is the number one ranked lady who is not on any of the six teams.

I suppose she can decline, but she will get $10,000 just for doing an exhibition number. (OK, that's chicken feed to Kim, but still... )

Remember the days when she had to reuse programs for multiple seasons because she couldn't afford new choreography? Oh, times have changed!

I hope she doesn't go not because she doesn't need the money, but as someone mentioned upthread, it would be awkward for her to participate only in the EX when everyone else was in the actual competition.

I like the idea of a team competition. It encourages countries to be well-rounded in all disciplines. And maybe one day there will be a team competition at the Olympics, much as in gymnastics. Personally, I get as much, if not more, kick out of team gymnastics events as I do the individual events. Yay!

ITA. I'm looking forward to this competition and I think it gives federations a good push to develop all 4 disciplines instead of focusing on 1 or 2.

You also raise up an interesting question: Besides this WTT, why aren't there official team competitions in FS? In gymnastics, team competitions are as highly regarded as the individual and all-around comps. IMO, the team comps are so much more exciting and rewarding to watch than any of the individual comps in gymnastics.

 

[Wrlmy]

You also raise up an interesting question: Besides this WTT, why aren't there official team competitions in FS? In gymnastics, team competitions are as highly regarded as the individual and all-around comps. IMO, the team comps are so much more exciting and rewarding to watch than any of the individual comps in gymnastics.

You have to compare FS to Rhythmic Gymnastics more than to gymnastics. RG has individual all-around and team competition, at least in the O. But, those who compete in individual section are different from those in the team competition. The team competition is more like synchronized skating. This baffles me because in gymnastic, one can win as many as 8 medals including team competition.

 

[skatingbc]

I think the biggest competition for the Americans will come from the Canadians. The Japanese are weaker in all areas except the ladies.

I did some predictions from the Worlds results. If you take the skaters participating in the WTT, took out the skaters who weren't competing and gave them the points they would receive in that place at the WTT (12 pts for 1st, etc), USA, Canada and Japan were at 55, 54, and 53, respectively. However, this does not take into account Caroline in place of Alissa or K/N in place of D/S. I think that Caroline might improve a place or two on Alissa, and K/N will lose a point or two on D/S, which would most likely bump the US and Canada up. For Japan to be so close in the points though with comparatively weaker Dance and Pairs infuriates me! It seems to undermine the whole objective of the competition if a country could quite possibly win with such an unbalanced team. The US, Canada, and even Russia and France have much more balanced teams, imo.

 

[Dipyramidal]

Yeah, they're pair team are from juniors.... (Japan)

 

[chuckm]

James/bonheur are better than you think......

At Worlds, Denney/Barrett beat James/Bonheur 52.74 to 44.10 in the SP and 104.10 to 95.24 in the FS. Worlds was only D/B's second international event and they have been together only about 8 months.

J/B are a promising team, but IMO D/B have the greater potential.

 

[Sylvia]

Worlds was only D/B's second international event and they have been together only about 8 months.

So far Denney/Barrett have competed three times internationally this season -- their international debut came at Nebelhorn Trophy in Germany last fall, where they showed promise and potential by finishing 4th overall and 3rd in the FS (Ukraine's Volosozhar/Morozov were 4th in the FS and 3rd overall): http://www.deu-event.de/results/Nebelhorn_2008/CAT003RS.HTM

Denney/Barrett initially skated together for several months in 2006 (they competed and performed well at Liberty -- you can find their 2006 Liberty SP and FS videos filmed by a fan on youtube) but did not end up competing in U.S. qualifying competition (Eastern Sectionals) that season. Denney decided to focus on singles and ended up moving to Colorado Springs. She returned to Florida last year and resumed skating with Barrett. As someone who saw D/B compete at both Liberty and Indy Pairs Challenge last summer, their success this season is not at all surprising and I think it's great they can end their season with another opportunity to compete internationally and especially to earn some money for their training.

 

[Buttercup]

At Worlds, Denney/Barrett beat James/Bonheur 52.74 to 44.10 in the SP and 104.10 to 95.24 in the FS. Worlds was only D/B's second international event and they have been together only about 8 months.

J/B are a promising team, but IMO D/B have the greater potential.

Actually, both teams are pretty new. J/B have been together for just over a year, AFAIK Vanessa James had little or no experience skating pairs, and they've only done three int'l competitions according to their ISU bio. D/B of course have been together for less than a year, and Jeremy spent much of that time working odd jobs at the rink to support their skating; they too have only three international events behind them.

Since both pairs have limited experience training-wise and in competition, I believe it's really too early to say who is better and who has more potential. The one thing in D/Bs favor is that they are younger than J/B, so they will likely have a longer career assuming things continue to go well between them.

 

[PolymerBob]

Zhang??? Seriously??? kick mule Zhang??? I'm sooooo disappointed!!!!!! Well, at least Flatt is going. :thumbsup:

I was apposed to sending Alissa to Worlds after her performance at 4 Continents. Even though I disagreed with the decision, I felt a degree of grudging admiration for the USFSA. They followed their own rules, however difficult that was, and remained loyal to their champion.

OK, now let's go forward 2 weeks. Where is this loyalty now? Why is the USFSA not standing by their champion? I'm very happy Caroline is going, but the USFSA does not look good here. It's like when green money is on the line, there are no rules or loyalty. They just do what they have to do to maximize their profit.

 

[Mathman]

OK, now let's go forward 2 weeks. Where is this loyalty now? Why is the USFSA not standing by their champion?

I think the USFSA has a way out of this one. They stood by their champion at worlds because the idea of worlds, historically, is that each country sends its national champion and they duke it out to see whose champion is the best.

If there are extra places, fine, send the champion and the runner up.

But this team championship thing is another matter. Countries qualify for the event by having skaters ranked highly internationally. Caroline is the highest ranked U.S. lady and Rachael is second on the ISU ranking list. So you could say that Caroline earned her own spot on the team by doing her part to get the USA into the competition in the first place.

Plus, the ISU is making it clear that they expect each country to send its highest ranked skaters -- in fact, there is a big section in the rules for this event regarding the sanctions that skaters face if they are ranked in the top ten internationally but decline to skate.

 

[Medusa]

Plus, the ISU is making it clear that they expect each country to send its highest ranked skaters -- in fact, there is a big section in the rules for this event regarding the sanctions that skaters face if they are ranked in the top ten internationally but decline to skate.

On the one hand I understand the ISU, they need the biggest stars to attract the money. But on the other hand it would be nice to see others, especially the big countries that are invited have lots of depth, e.g. it would be nice to see Akiko once again this season or Nakano.

By the way, how is it even possible that Amodio is going? He is far behind Ponsero and Préaubert in the standings, he screwed up Junior Worlds, didn't attend one senior event this season.