Fully agree but they are still better than Capellini/Lanotte. Did you see C/L's step sequence or paso doble? Small patterns, very slow, very labored. Without Igor, their skating looks more juniorish.
2014 Cup of China Free Dance 11/08
- Thread starter dorispulaski
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Zoueva very consistently not creating new lifts for her teams. Capellini/Lanotte uses this and this from her former work. Last rotational lift, of course a joker lift of C/L. You can do in paso doble, danse macabre, finnstep or italian opera.
It is like a double axel for Capellini/Lanotte. Had to use short and long, every year. 
I love Papadakis/Cizeron's first lift.
Very good use of music, beautiful positions. Even If you can't hear, you will know what kind of music they are skating, just from looking this lift. +3 from me
It is like a double axel for Capellini/Lanotte. Had to use short and long, every year. I love Papadakis/Cizeron's first lift.
Very good use of music, beautiful positions. Even If you can't hear, you will know what kind of music they are skating, just from looking this lift. +3 from me
Because they still skate like juniors, always have, always will. And last year was no exception. It's just that Igor is a master at hiding flaws and that's what he did with them last year. They just had a late season start and a rough skate here, they'll be better in two weeks. It's visible Anna still has some overweight and isn't in top form. I agree that world champions that don't use edges is bad, but they're still better than Maurizio
There can be some nuances like Lena’s a litle bit more soft knee’s work, but Ruslan’s knee work is still on the top in men’s field together with Nikita. Both Lena and Ruslan have deep edges. They are on the same level in technique.
If some couple is not equal in Skating Skills then:
1) One of them moves faster – it is visible in Step Sequences, one partner skates faster and another one must hurry to catch him, it is also visible in the same turn done together like in Mohawk or Chocktaw, Bracket, Counter, in Double Twizzles…in FD both Lena and Ruslan are doing a few same difficult turns together and you can see that Lena is not getting forward some mile in front of him…
…in FD you can see that during Twizzles Lena is moving a little bit faster in last two rotations of the first Set, but in second and third Set it is Ruslan who is moving a little bit faster…
2) One of partners have light or lighter edges…in case of Lena & Ruslan you can notice that they have both deep edges.
3) The couple is overall slower than the couple where both partners are great technicians – once again visible in Step Sequences…you can notice that I&Z are faster than I&K were in their top form…how it would be possible if Ruslan would be much weaker or weaker than Nikita…
…just compare…I&Z… http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=rgR7cEYIcnU#t=85
…I&K’s World Champs FD… http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=y1Zu4ZKruzw#t=113
I fully agree that they need time to gel, because it is visible that they don’t skate all the time like one unit. I don’t have any idea how long it will take, because they are definitely NOT skating like somebody who is together for such short time…so normal time schedule of geling looks to be not equivalent for them.
If already now they are so fast with having deep edges not only in Step Sequences but also in Transitions (and thanks to not perfect technicians in top field they are maybe the fastest team with Bobrova & Soloviev at the current field, not seen S&K yet) and they were visibly faster then other teams here in Shanghai, then in future it can be only better.
- Joined
- Mar 29, 2009
Look at their scores over the last 3 comps and they are on a downward trajectory: 162.73, 160.33, 157.36.. They improved their SD each time which is good but their FD has gone down each time with a high of 100.26 to this week's 92.16. At the beginning of the season they were fighting to be US no 1 but if they can't start being consistent in their levels they will be fighting to stay no2. And I say this as a big Shibs fan
I wouldn't take the 100.26 mark seriously, it was a at a senior B where all the marks were inflated - it's like when B/S were given 105 for their birds program the Latvia event and you knew it would never be replicated anywhere else... The drop this week from Skate America is concerning but I don't think it's really a big downwards trend, just still working out a new program.
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- Aug 1, 2011
I think it has more to do with nerves than working out a new program. If I remember correctly, that is the first time in a long long time they've been first heading into the FD. I think they wanted it so much they OVERskated and OVERthought it and made silly mistakes. There's so much more to ID than just technique, but of course YMMV on that.
I have reviewed I/Z FD so many times. That FD will be exceptional once they've gelled. WOW. This is not the generic Kustarova crap, this is probably her first of two star teams. Y/M are going to be huge. Not to mention a couple good juniors they have coming up. Russian ID is going to be so much fun in a few seasons.
Nathalie was also rooting for them on Facebook, prior to the start of their skate. Last year Fabian mention P/C and H/D as being skaters to watch in the future.
I just watched the FD yikes!
C/L's free program would be a beautiful dance if performed cleanly, but I have my reservations about Luca's ability to handle more intricate choreography. The lifts were clearly too hard for him, as was the rest of the program. He needs to step it up and become a better partner.
S/S, well what's left to say? This was their comp for the taking.
This FD is a dud and they better come up with a better FD for GPF and Nationals.
P/C, lots of potential. Clearly a top five finish at worlds.
I/Z what a complete letdown. After reading the comments here I was ready to be wowed by Elena and her partner. What a mess. It's like her skating has regressed. :disapp:
C/L's free program would be a beautiful dance if performed cleanly, but I have my reservations about Luca's ability to handle more intricate choreography. The lifts were clearly too hard for him, as was the rest of the program. He needs to step it up and become a better partner.
S/S, well what's left to say? This was their comp for the taking.
This FD is a dud and they better come up with a better FD for GPF and Nationals. P/C, lots of potential. Clearly a top five finish at worlds.
I/Z what a complete letdown. After reading the comments here I was ready to be wowed by Elena and her partner. What a mess. It's like her skating has regressed. :disapp:
I just watched the FD yikes!
C/L's free program would be a beautiful dance if performed cleanly, but I have my reservations about Luca's ability to handle more intricate choreography. The lifts were clearly too hard for him, as was the rest of the program. He needs to step it up and become a better partner.
S/S, well what's left to say? This was their comp for the taking.
P/C, lots of potential. Clearly a top five finish at worlds.
I/Z what a complete letdown. After reading the comments here I was ready to be wowed by Elena and her partner. What a mess. It's like her skating has regressed. :disapp:
You are right Ilinykh has changed. She no longer covets the role of diva or movie star, but rather she's a character actress on ice. Her look is now very natural, she practically looks like a 16 year old girl. This I believe will be their most difficult challenge to overcome. She and Ruslan look so CUTE!
Her skating has in fact improved but the change in style/appearance might actually distract us from that. The FD has great potential but no doubt needs polishing. But your disappointment was my absolute delight. Different strokes and all that jazz....
We don't know. They didn't say. At the time all fans are suprised too...
http://www.goldenskate.com/forum/sh...llini-Lanotte-move-to-train-with-Zoueva/page4
This week's result didn't suprise me.
- Joined
- Mar 20, 2013
Interesting insights regarding C&L.
My guess is that C&L think that Zueva is a better aesthetician who can possibly create masterpiece programs for them; many fans have been complaining about Zueva, but the fact remains she is an artist. I thought she did a good job with the Shibs' SD. I think they too realize that despite Igor's technically loaded programs, their programs were boring last season. Maybe they thought Zueva can give them the artistic breakthrough the way Igor gave them a technical breakthrough.
I do wish Igor and Zueva stayed together in this instance.
My guess is that C&L think that Zueva is a better aesthetician who can possibly create masterpiece programs for them; many fans have been complaining about Zueva, but the fact remains she is an artist. I thought she did a good job with the Shibs' SD. I think they too realize that despite Igor's technically loaded programs, their programs were boring last season. Maybe they thought Zueva can give them the artistic breakthrough the way Igor gave them a technical breakthrough.
I do wish Igor and Zueva stayed together in this instance.
I didn't like free dance too. But they show us some good quality. I think matching each other is important.
Twizzles:
Ice coverage, speed and synchronization all match and very good quality. They both have good control. Watch 2010-2011-2012 twizzles of Ilinykh/Katsalapov. You will understand I/Z did good work.You will never know they are skating together 5 months.
Step Sequences:
They got consistent level3 both in SD and FD. Edge work cleaner than other teams. No partner dragging other on ice. Edges, knee work match nicely. Remember they just learned skating with each other. Dancers often repeats last year's steps. They don't have this advantage. Still good quality. Look at SD steps you will see more clearly: wide, big, deep edges.
Lifts and spins: Still needs work. But you have to give them time. Shibutanis repeats their former lifts this year. Weaver/Poje and Chock Bates too. I respect Papadakis/Cizeron. They are trying new things.
If we compare them to Chock/Bates, Samuelson/Gilles or Hubbell/Donuhue's first year, that is very good debut. If we compare them to Ilinykh/Katsalapov's first senior GP season. It is still very good. If we compare them to Ilinykh/Katsalapov in Olympics, that is bad.
I believe that Natalie was very glad that P&C won, I didn’t have in mind some negative emotions towards this couple from Natalie.
I regreted that P&B didn’t get so great push from French Federation at the Olympics and World Champs, because their FD really deserved higher points in Component score than they got.
Good note.
Some people are mentioning Lena’s presentation…
When some couple is newly formed both partners must concentrate on many things which become automatic after year or two. Just to make the same cross-overs - they must concentrate on it now, plus all levels, all steps, presentation. The couple is very expressive even now, but once these millions details in their skating become authomatic, their presentation will improve.
Concretely as Lena’s presentation, I was surprised with commentators comments (and it once again proved me not to put much attention into what they are saying.)
British commentators were talking about Lena to loose her sparkle, not to be a Diva etc. Could any of those commentators (but also fans having the same opinion) log in and explain us in what moment in music should Lena stop in front of judges and send them kisses?
Listening Appassionata – I hear many tender but also very sad and even painful emotions. Putting Diva’s dancing style into this music would be like putting Lara Croft holding the gun into Romeo & Juliette – balcony scene.
Looking at SD – Carmen is a passionate and dramatic woman, Lena is doing her job very well. But don’t forget we are talking about Spanish dance style, where a man is the leader…and Ruslan is the leader. So where is a problem?
In the arena I would say IZ and PC were the fastest and PC had a lot of nuances. PC also looks to have deeper edge than the Shibs. Very deserved win. The Shibs' program lost steam in the second half. You just can't have one very overused waltz going through the whole program. Even the lay viewers lose interest.
Now about IZ, I could see that the choreography is simple compared to PC and the Shibs and the second lift is a bit problematic, but their twizzle was fantastic and simply the best. They literally moved across the entire judging panel on their first set of twizzle. I'm baffled why the judges give them such little GOE. Their SD step sequence was also with the best ice coverage and edge (though probably a little less intricate than PC's and a little slower than the Shibs, but overall a +2 step sequence. I'm not sure if this is the new team penalty across the board or Zueva's politicking at work. I would worry very much if the later is the case.
Anna and Luca were an uninspired mess. Paul Islam however is incredibly slow and labored. They don't look much better than the third Chinese team. I can't believe this team made it to the Olympics instead of Gilles Poirier. This team is in no way close to IZ in anything and yet they ended up with higher TES in the FD.
I shall say that Ruslan and Elena, though having no problem matching each other technically, lacks the kind of spontaneous chemistry Nikita and Elena had. Remember those ending poses (every ending pose) they had when both of them looked so dramatically soaked in emotion. I don't see how R&E can ever have that which worries me.
Now about IZ, I could see that the choreography is simple compared to PC and the Shibs and the second lift is a bit problematic, but their twizzle was fantastic and simply the best. They literally moved across the entire judging panel on their first set of twizzle. I'm baffled why the judges give them such little GOE. Their SD step sequence was also with the best ice coverage and edge (though probably a little less intricate than PC's and a little slower than the Shibs, but overall a +2 step sequence. I'm not sure if this is the new team penalty across the board or Zueva's politicking at work. I would worry very much if the later is the case.
Anna and Luca were an uninspired mess. Paul Islam however is incredibly slow and labored. They don't look much better than the third Chinese team. I can't believe this team made it to the Olympics instead of Gilles Poirier. This team is in no way close to IZ in anything and yet they ended up with higher TES in the FD.
I shall say that Ruslan and Elena, though having no problem matching each other technically, lacks the kind of spontaneous chemistry Nikita and Elena had. Remember those ending poses (every ending pose) they had when both of them looked so dramatically soaked in emotion. I don't see how R&E can ever have that which worries me.
I didn't like free dance too. But they show us some good quality. I think matching each other is important.
Twizzles:
Ice coverage, speed and synchronization all match and very good quality. They both have good control. Watch 2010-2011-2012 twizzles of Ilinykh/Katsalapov. You will understand I/Z did good work.You will never know they are skating together 5 months.
Step Sequences:
They got consistent level3 both in SD and FD. Edge work cleaner than other teams. No partner dragging other on ice. Edges, knee work match nicely. Remember they just learned skating with each other. Dancers often repeats last year's steps. They don't have this advantage. Still good quality. Look at SD steps you will see more clearly: wide, big, deep edges.
Lifts and spins: Still needs work. But you have to give them time. Shibutanis repeats their former lifts this year. Weaver/Poje and Chock Bates too. I respect Papadakis/Cizeron. They are trying new things.
If we compare them to Chock/Bates, Samuelson/Gilles or Hubbell/Donuhue's first year, that is very good debut. If we compare them to Ilinykh/Katsalapov's first senior GP season. It is still very good. If we compare them to Ilinykh/Katsalapov in Olympics, that is bad.
All things being well, we'll see them try something more dynamic and interesting next season. I don't think they realized at the beginning how well they would have gelled technically.
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