Elizaveta Tuktamysheva

[silverfoxes]

I think that some people have a very - very - narrow defnition of what constitutes "Art"... and they think that they, and they only, are the arbiters of what that is.

Basically, I've found, it should not be "entertaining" or at least not something so frivolous as "fun" (shudders at the notion). If it's any consolation, skaters who are otherwise considered "Artists" can be slapped with the same criticism if they do something too.... "fun" (shudders again, looks for smelling salts.) See for example Mao's Gershwin program (music only fit for a 12 year-old according to one poster, for example), or Daisuke and his rockabilly program... And Jason Brown is being tarred with the same brush - apparently being a "crowd pleaser" is a bad thing.

The mind boggles.... But really, the only thing is to leave those people to their own devices (shrug).

True, although I think Brown is still considered artistic by most because he's "musical." I happen to think he is both of those things - but I also think many of the skaters who get accused of being neither of those things are pretty artistic and/or musical in their own way. I can only sigh when I see those posters (always the same predictable ones) trot out those tired accusations, usually reserved only for Russian skaters and/or good jumpers. Different styles are a beautiful thing, and I would not enjoy this sport at all if it meant having to watch nothing but angst-ridden lyrical skaters swan around on the ice. :disapp:

Back to Liza...here's her preview from Japanese tv (sorry if it was posted already & I missed it):

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x2jofmu_2015世界フィギュア特集①エリザベータ-トゥクタミシェワ_sport

 

[plushyfan]

True, although I think Brown is still considered artistic by most because he's "musical." I happen to think he is both of those things - but I also think many of the skaters who get accused of being neither of those things are pretty artistic and/or musical in their own way. I can only sigh when I see those posters (always the same predictable ones) trot out those tired accusations, usually reserved only for Russian skaters and/or good jumpers. Different styles are a beautiful thing, and I would not enjoy this sport at all if it meant having to watch nothing but angst-ridden lyrical skaters swan around on the ice. :disapp:

Back to Liza...here's her preview from Japanese tv (sorry if it was posted already & I missed it):

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x2jofmu_2015世界フィギュア特集①エリザベータ-トゥクタミシェワ_sport

big like for your whole post! I also missed the Japanese video... And in this video we can see how beautiful is this sport!

 

[Sandpiper]

There's no one style I connect to more than others. Some of my favourite skaters are bombastic performers/show(wo)men, while others are lyrical artistes. I consider both artistic and enjoyable when well done. It just comes down to each skater's ability to sell their programs--whatever those may be--and their ability to grab the audience. If there is one trend, I guess I gravitate to skaters often cited as having charisma/projection/x-factor.

I love watching Liza because she delivers exciting performances, and she knows how to end a program with a strong climax. Maybe she won't ever pull off a sleepy sad love song*, but there are other skater to fulfill that need.

*Though maybe she could pull off a vengeful dark love song?

Different styles are a beautiful thing, and I would not enjoy this sport at all if it meant having to watch nothing but angst-ridden lyrical skaters swan around on the ice. :disapp:

There are other ways to swan around the ice.

 

[Sugarpova]

Yes, some North-Am posters used to say Plushy isn't artistry.. They are blind or forgot about Plushy cca 70 6.0s for his presentation since 1999. And they think the Judges were stupid or incompetent when they thought Plushy has innate artistry..And Liza is the next..:shocked: But you know this is figure skating..those are Figure skating fans...

I really try to be openminded & all but how one can not SEE it is just ....:think: Its pretty in your face ART (ina good way not OTT one)

On the 1 hand I scratch my head over marks for Lysachek(spelling?), Sarah Hughes, Sale/Pelletier, Weaver/Poje, PChan, Gracie Gold, D/R so soemtime I think maybe I AM just not a fan of NA style.
But on another hand I'm a huge fan of Weir, Shasha Cohen, & quite like this season Ashley Wagner, Farris, Nam Nguyen, Brown & all of them are NA
Haha something just doesnt add up

To me art is definitely something very subjective but there's some very obvious examples of the true performers who you cant take the eyes from no matter the music/tempo/vibe of the programm & Mishin's students aka Liza, Zhenia & Urmanov definitely posess THAt quality (to ME)

Again tastes differ & probably I just need to take it as a given & just accept that what is a PERFORMANCE for you may fee like 'jumping difficult jumps & flailing arms' to someone else :

 

[LRK]

There's no one style I connect to more than others. Some of my favourite skaters are bombastic performers/show(wo)men, while others are lyrical artistes. I consider both artistic and enjoyable when well done. It just comes down to each skater's ability to sell their programs--whatever those may be--and their ability to grab the audience. If there is one trend, I guess I gravitate to skaters often cited as having charisma/projection/x-factor.

Or as I call it: Charisma, presence, personality.

Which will make it no mystery why I hang out on the Liza fan thread.

 

[Tutto]

A new article by Vaitsechovskaia on Liza’s triple axel:

http://www.sports.ru/others/figure-skating/1028138330.html

Most if it here but might go over some points again a bit later (in a hurry sorry!)

'Tuktamisheva's Axel is a Landmark Event

Strategically the intention to try 3A at Worlds makes sense. As regards the Worlds 2015 the comparison with a racing term ‘pole position’ comes to mind which means in this context a fight for the most advantageous position at the most important start of a 4 year cycle, ie Olympics 2018, even if there is still three year to go. But this is only if by the calendar, in reality it is only 2 seasons.
Liza’s axel in this respect is a landmark event. Because even now at the initial stage her attempts so far demonstrated that having such ideal technique and jumping power, Liza is practically the only skater who potentially is capable of doing 3A-3T combination. Should it happen it could be a weapon of 'killing' her competitors as once the legendary duels between Alexei Yagudin and Evgeni Plushenko with their 4-4 combinations had been.
By the way 'killing' does not imply any hurry. It will be quite sufficient to demonstrate the element from time to time in official practice as in fact Liza & Mishin have already done.
Having said all this, Liza’s road to the top is not going to be easy from now on. But that that Liza has managed to step up a level amidst a very busy season is quite outstanding'

 

[LRK]

Interesting point that this might be aiming at working on a 3A-3T... Gulp! If the thought of the 3A "alone" scares me as much as it does... If she goes for the 3A-3T I suppose I will be "watching" with my eyes closed, praying like crazy, and only daring to peek!

 

[Tutto]

Interesting point that this might be aiming at working on a 3A-3T... Gulp! If the thought of the 3A "alone" scares me as much as it does... If she goes for the 3A-3T I suppose I will be "watching" with my eyes closed, praying like crazy, and only daring to peek!

Frankly I wonder if she really meant 3A-2T which Liza already showed in practice at competitions - you know what journalists are like

No, correction, she clearly said 'potentially' so she must have meant 3A-3T

 

[Sandpiper]

Where would 3A-3T go under COP? :think: It's not allowed in the SP, unless you do another solo (double) axel, which just loses the points you could've gained from a 3Lz/3F/3Lo instead. And in the LP, you're better off tagging the -3T onto another jump (and possibly putting it in the second half). Less energy, less risk, more points.

I hope Liza stays healthy and can attempt 3A-3T sometime in her career, just to put her in the history books. Maybe at a GP or something.

 

[StitchMonkey]

Where would 3A-3T go under COP? :think: It's not allowed in the SP, unless you do another solo (double) axel, which just loses the points you could've gained from a 3Lz/3F/3Lo instead. And in the LP, you're better off tagging the -3T onto another jump (and possibly putting it in the second half). Less energy, less risk, more points.

I hope Liza stays healthy and can attempt 3A-3T sometime in her career, just to put her in the history books. Maybe at a GP or something.

Le sigh. . . and this is why we need to rethink how combos are score. You are 100% right, what would be the point. If a 3Z and later a 3A+3T is the same value as a 3Z+3T and later a 3A, there is little point to doing it that way. But it is clearly a more difficult combo, and should be rewarded. A 3T at the end of a combo should be scored differently than a solo 3T.

 

[LRK]

Absolutely.

I don't understand why there can't be a set base value for various combos based on their relative difficulty, just as there are for solo jumps. This system is very number-happy - more numbers, should make them happy, no?

 

[sabinfire]

Made a couple videos of Liza tonight :

Elizaveta Tuktamysheva mega Jumpamatron (1080p HD)

Elizaveta Tuktamysheva Spinamatron (1080p HD)

 

[Sandpiper]

Just for the interest of sharing (not to force you to make more videos ), though Liza is not a great spinner, she did have two (imo) interesting spins as a junior. There's this combo spin with an Irina Slutskaya-esque Biellmann (even more apparent from this angle). There is also this camel variation, which is rather reminiscent of Adelina's.

Though Liza's early programs aren't always loved on these boards, I thought they had some nice choreography: the blade-bolding twizzles, the split jump entry into 3S, and how she holds that 3Lo landing like there's no tomorrow. It would be cool to see some of these things again. Yes, she was a bit frantic, and certainly not as expressive as she is now, but there was a lot to like even about 13-year-old Liza.

 

[plushyfan]

Just for the interest of sharing (not to force you to make more videos ), though Liza is not a great spinner, she did have two (imo) interesting spins as a junior. There's this combo spin with an Irina Slutskaya-esque Biellmann (even more apparent from this angle). There is also this camel variation, which is rather reminiscent of Adelina's.

Though Liza's early programs aren't always loved on these boards, I thought they had some nice choreography: the blade-bolding twizzles, the split jump entry into 3S, and how she holds that 3Lo landing like there's no tomorrow. It would be cool to see some of these things again. Yes, she was a bit frantic, and certainly not as expressive as she is now, but there was a lot to like even about 13-year-old Liza.

Mishin said once when Liza arrived him she had a very strange movements but she had great jumping ability..

 

[sabinfire]

Just for the interest of sharing (not to force you to make more videos ), though Liza is not a great spinner, she did have two (imo) interesting spins as a junior. There's this combo spin with an Irina Slutskaya-esque Biellmann (even more apparent from this angle). There is also this camel variation, which is rather reminiscent of Adelina's.

Though Liza's early programs aren't always loved on these boards, I thought they had some nice choreography: the blade-bolding twizzles, the split jump entry into 3S, and how she holds that 3Lo landing like there's no tomorrow. It would be cool to see some of these things again. Yes, she was a bit frantic, and certainly not as expressive as she is now, but there was a lot to like even about 13-year-old Liza.

It's no matter to me who loves which programs on these boards. Finding truly high-quality video of these early programs is not always easy (I wonder if the quality I'm looking for even exists in some cases), but I agree, those are some interesting spins. I should go back and make more Jumpamatron/Spinamatron/etc vids of earlier Liza performances... it's just that her current season is still "fresh" and by far her most successful up to this point. If nothing else, there is always the off-season... which is awfully close now.

Very eloquent descriptions of Liza's spins, Sandpiper. I bow to your fellow admiration of her skating now and over the years.

Mishin said once when Liza arrived him she had a very strange movements but she had great jumping ability..

Hey, those strange movements are beloved by some of us. Although my tastes in many things have never been referred to as 'conventional' or 'traditional'...

 

[sabinfire]

Just for the interest of sharing (not to force you to make more videos ), though Liza is not a great spinner, she did have two (imo) interesting spins as a junior.

Okay, you inspired me. Her spins were so much better back then... even a couple years ago, the spins seem better compared to her current ones. Spinning was still never her strongest element.

I used 2010 Russian Nationals footage for this shorter vid:

Elizaveta Tuktamysheva retro Spinamatron (1080p HD)

 

[Sandpiper]

Okay, you inspired me. Her spins were so much better back then... even a couple years ago, the spins seem better compared to her current ones. Spinning was still never her strongest element.

I used 2010 Russian Nationals footage for this shorter vid:

Elizaveta Tuktamysheva retro Spinamatron (1080p HD)

Man, I can't believe you took on such a task (due to the reason you stated--the lack of high quality videos. It looks great to me anyway, since I'm far from a video nerd ).

In terms of centering, her spins actually might've improved. The Biellmann-combo spin seems prone to travelling on entry (especially in the JGPF video). But she definitely had more interesting positions back then. I suspect both those spins were hard on her back, so I'm fine with them gone. Plus, is this even a viable option these days--doing a layback with no Biellmann position, and then using the Biellmann in your combo spin? I don't remember anyone doing it this year.... Maybe if Liza can learn the change-of-edge done for Viktoria Helgesson for her layback, then use the Biellmann in the combo...?

Regarding Liza's programs/"strange movements," I personally don't gravitate to the hardcore COP skates. You know I'm a huge fan her Malaguena LP at Skate America. Looking at it in detail... yeah, she took out the preceding steps before her lutzes, which is doing this year and has done in previous years. I don't know what level that StSq got, and I don't know how many turns she crammed in. But I know it was fast, it was exciting, and she had such fire and passion in the performance. This is why I love figure skating.

And speaking of Malaguena, it seems like that blade-catch twizzle lasted longer than I thought. She does it as her final position in the spin here. This is something I'd like to see return, since it's an issue of balance and probably won't be hard on her back.

 

[Sweet Dream]

Liza's Planned Program Content at Worlds:
SP: 3T+3T, 3Lz and 2A.
FS: 3Lz+2T+2Lo, 3Lz, 3F, 3T+3T, 3Lo, 3S+2A+SEQ and 2A.

 

[Caustica]

Liza's Planned Program Content at Worlds:
SP: 3T+3T, 3Lz and 2A.
FS: 3Lz+2T+2Lo, 3Lz, 3F, 3T+3T, 3Lo, 3S+2A+SEQ and 2A.

:ОООООООООО what a surprise! No 3A? Or is this just not bothering to update the program content, à la Pitkeev at Junior Worlds?

 

[Sweet Dream]

:ОООООООООО what a surprise! No 3A? Or is this just not bothering to update the program content, à la Pitkeev at Junior Worlds?

It's from the official sheet.