Paris Shootings and Explosions

[EdgeCall]

It's a Religion, it's only beautiful in the hands of good people

True. And the same applies to every other religion.

And in general to every other form of ideology, be it religious, political or whatever. That leaves the question what makes people "good". Ideology obviously does not.

 

[tulosai]

It's not, And it has.

And it's also ok to acknowledge that in this era the Religion that's mainly associated with this kind of behaviour is Islam.

Right, I do admit that, but my broad point is that this is not necessarily an indictment of the particular religion in and of itself or an argument that this religion should end or is worse than other religions and so on. These terrorist acts are perpetrated by an extreme minority group (by which I mean both that their ideas are extreme and that in fact they are a very small minority- the vast majority of Islamic people worldwide are peaceful and in fact believe that the interpretation of their holy texts by this extreme minority group is incorrect and that they are wrong). While in this era, the terrorism is associated with this particular religion, throughout history many religions have been sucked into a terrorist mentality. Like those religions, I'm confident that ultimately Islam will 'ride this out' and no longer be associated with terrorism, though it may take some time.

As for 'how I can compare them', they are pretty directly comparable. There may be lower 'tolerance' for terrorism now (though I think you'd find if you asked those who were being terrorized during the crusades and other events, you'd find their tolerance was similarly low) but at the end of the day these are extreme opinions which those leading the movement corruptly (IMO) use religion to justify in an effort to seek their own ends. In that way it is exactly the same thing.

 

[Mista Ekko]

Right, I do admit that, but my broad point is that this is not necessarily an indictment of the particular religion in and of itself or an argument that this religion should end or is worse than other religions and so on. These terrorist acts are perpetrated by an extreme minority group (by which I mean both that their ideas are extreme and that in fact they are a very small minority- the vast majority of Islamic people worldwide are peaceful and in fact believe that the interpretation of their holy texts by this extreme minority group is incorrect and that they are wrong). While in this era, the terrorism is associated with this particular religion, throughout history many religions have been sucked into a terrorist mentality. Like those religions, I'm confident that ultimately Islam will 'ride this out' and no longer be associated with terrorism, though it may take some time.

As for 'how I can compare them', they are pretty directly comparable. There may be lower 'tolerance' for terrorism now (though I think you'd find if you asked those who were being terrorized during the crusades and other events, you'd find their tolerance was similarly low) but at the end of the day these are extreme opinions which those leading the movement corruptly (IMO) use religion to justify in an effort to seek their own ends. In that way it is exactly the same thing.

Very true,

But the peaceful people are irrelevant here.

 

[gravy]

Strange, how many Christian terrorists group do you know? And how many terrorist attacks these religious Christian fanatics made in Europe and in other countries?

The deadliest attack in my country of Norway since WWII was carried out by a Christian extremist who wanted to prevent the Islamization of Europe.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_Norway_attacks

Your ignorance as evidenced in your posts is just baffling and absurd.

 

[peg]

The deadliest attack in my country of Norway since WWII was carried out by a Christian extremist who wanted to prevent the Islamization of Europe.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_Norway_attacks

Your ignorance as evidenced in your posts is just baffling and absurd.

Thank you, I was thinking about him earlier today and forgot to mention him now.

 

[tulosai]

Very true,

But the peaceful people are irrelevant here.

I don't think they are, because they suffer when they are grouped in with the terrorists. It is one thing to forthrightly state (as we both have in our previous posts) that the majority of organized, religiously motivated terrorism that currently occurs is perpetrated by Islamic groups. It is another to broadly say 'Muslims are terrorists', forgetting that most Islamic people are not in fact terrorists, and also not even showing basic understanding for the terms you are using, since actually Muslim is not the same as Islam.

 

[OniBan]

It is true that most attacks in the recent past that have been religiously motivated have come from Islam. However, throughout history, religions have cycled in and out in terms of who are the terrorists when. Do the crusades ring a bell to you? 'Holy' wars have been a staple for centuries. Yes, this was years ago, but someday this will all be years ago too. Quite honestly, though it's perhaps a bold move to state this in public, it is my broad feeling that throughout history religion has done more harm than good.

It is also worth noting that, though many people from all three religions will deny this, in extremely broad terms Christianity, Islam, and Judaism are quite similar, having many critical and cornerstone points 'in common'.

They are similar. I read a very interesting book - 'History of God' by Karen Armstrong that touches on how the 3 religions intertwined, and it's quite a revelation to say the least.

 

[katia]

It is true that most attacks in the recent past that have been religiously motivated have come from Islam. However, throughout history, religions have cycled in and out in terms of who are the terrorists when. Do the crusades ring a bell to you? 'Holy' wars have been a staple for centuries. Yes, this was years ago, but someday this will all be years ago too. Quite honestly, though it's perhaps a bold move to state this in public, it is my broad feeling that throughout history religion has done more harm than good.

It is also worth noting that, though many people from all three religions will deny this, in extremely broad terms Christianity, Islam, and Judaism are quite similar, having many critical and cornerstone points 'in common'.

Well. Palestine was conquered by the Islamic Caliphate, beginning in 634 CE. In 636, the Battle of Yarmouk during the Muslim conquest of the Levant marked the start of Muslim hegemony over the region, which became known as Jund Filastin within the province of Bilâd al-Shâm (Greater Syria).The majority of the population was Christian and was to remain so until the conquest of Saladin in 1187. Well, in 1071 Seljuk empire got Palestine and they cut access of Christian pilgrims to sacred places in Holy Land. In response pope proclaimed first Crusade.

Of course that Judaism, Christianity and Islam have some similarities after all they all started in the same geographical area and they took some things from each other. However, they are also quite different in many things. As for atheism, unfortunately Mao, Stalin and Pol Pot (all atheists, mind you) killed as many people as all religious people. So they also did more harm than good.

 

[Mista Ekko]

I don't think they are, because they suffer when they are grouped in with the terrorists. It is one thing to forthrightly state (as we both have in our previous posts) that the majority of organized, religiously motivated terrorism that currently occurs is perpetrated by Islamic groups. It is another to broadly say 'Muslims are terrorists', forgetting that most Islamic people are not in fact terrorists, and also not even showing basic understanding for the terms you are using, since actually Muslim is not the same as Islam.

People tend to group them with the terror when they see they stay silent in the face of it,
It's probably a wrong thing to do, And tbh if i was facing a backlash to myself or my family of the proportions known to
radical Islam i'd probably consider shutting up too, But it definitely doesn't show any fighting spirit against it either

 

[bartlebooth]

TEB is cancelled.

Source: http://www.bordeaux.fr/p9690

 

[Mista Ekko]

Well. Palestine was conquered by the Islamic Caliphate, beginning in 634 CE. In 636, the Battle of Yarmouk during the Muslim conquest of the Levant marked the start of Muslim hegemony over the region, which became known as Jund Filastin within the province of Bilâd al-Shâm (Greater Syria).The majority of the population was Christian and was to remain so until the conquest of Saladin in 1187. Well, in 1071 Seljuk empire got Palestine and they cut access of Christian pilgrims to sacred places in Holy Land. In response pope proclaimed first Crusade.

Of course that Judaism, Christianity and Islam have some similarities after all they all started in the same geographical area and they took some things from each other. However, they are also quite different in many things. As for atheism, unfortunately Mao, Stalin and Pol Pot (all atheists, mind you) killed as many people as all religious people. So they also did more harm than good.

Yes, Nationalism is a tool too haha,

Like in that SouthPark double episode "Go god go" which depicts a future world free of religion, Where people just fight about some other crap

 

[oriquey]

Well. Palestine was conquered by the Islamic Caliphate, beginning in 634 CE.[47] In 636, the Battle of Yarmouk during the Muslim conquest of the Levant marked the start of Muslim hegemony over the region, which became known as Jund Filastin within the province of Bilâd al-Shâm (Greater Syria).[48] The majority of the population was Christian and was to remain so until the conquest of Saladin in 1187. Well, in 1071 Seljuk empire got Palestine and they cut access of Christian pilgrims to sacred places in Holy Land. In response pope proclaimed first Crusade.

Of course that Judaism, Christianity and Islam have some similarities after all they all started in the same geographical area and they took some things from each other. However, they are also quite different in many things. As for atheism, unfortunately Mao, Stalin and Pol Pot (all atheists, mind you) killed as many people as all religious people. So they also did more harm than good.

Thanks for sharing some historical tidbid. However, there are many versions of history to the one that you've provided and it is interesting to see the different perspective. However, I have to say after you've provided a wrong and biased translation of the Quran, I'd have to read everything you post with more than a grain of salt.

 

[Mista Ekko]

TEB is cancelled.

Source: http://www.bordeaux.fr/p9690

Wow, Ok


Any other source?

 

[katia]

I don't think they are, because they suffer when they are grouped in with the terrorists. It is one thing to forthrightly state (as we both have in our previous posts) that the majority of organized, religiously motivated terrorism that currently occurs is perpetrated by Islamic groups. It is another to broadly say 'Muslims are terrorists', forgetting that most Islamic people are not in fact terrorists, and also not even showing basic understanding for the terms you are using, since actually Muslim is not the same as Islam.

But nobody is saying that all Muslims are terrorists. On the other hand majority of terrorists are Muslims. One is not equal to other.
It is the same with Nazis, only 10% of Germans were Nazis, but Allies did fought with Germans, didn't they?

 

[gravy]

TEB is cancelled.

Source: http://www.bordeaux.fr/p9690

Interesting.

Thanks for sharing some historical tidbid. However, there are many versions of history to the one that you've provided and it is interesting to see the different perspective. However, I have to say after you've provided a wrong and biased translation of the Quran, I'd have to read everything you post with more than a grain of salt.

Better take it with a pile of salt; it was a direct copy and paste from Wikipedia. :hopelessness:

 

[katia]

Thanks for sharing some historical tidbid. However, there are many versions of history to the one that you've provided and it is interesting to see the different perspective. However, I have to say after you've provided a wrong and biased translation of the Quran, I'd have to read everything you post with more than a grain of salt.

For example?
You mean Wikipedia version is incorrect? What a pity, I thought it did not lies, but if you say so....
Btw, would you provide a correct translation of Quran, if according to you I gave a biased translation.
thank you in advance.

 

[plushyfan]

our political analysts think Russia is in danger, too. Many chechens live their they support the ISIS and the terriorism. Maybe the CoR won't be cancelled.

 

[katia]

Yes, Nationalism is a tool too haha,

Like in that SouthPark double episode "Go god go" which depicts a future world free of religion, Where people just fight about some other crap

Oh, yes, South Park rulez

 

[tulosai]

Wow, Ok


Any other source?

Denis Ten just tweeted they were just told the GP is cancelled.

 

[oriquey]

For example?
You mean Wikipedia version is incorrect? What a pity, I thought it did not lies, but if you say so....
Btw, would you provide a correct translation of Quran, if according to you I gave a biased translation.
thank you in advance.

Peace. I did provide the correct translation to the verse in reply a few pages back.

Here it is again: (2:190) "Fight in the way of Allah those who fight you but do not transgress. Indeed Allah does not like transgressors." It is about self defense but not to fight for the sake of injustice.