2016 World Championships Pairs Free Skate

[dailytg20]

nobody allows anyone to win... the winner needs to take it....

Exactly. Otherwise why even have the event? You could argue Yuzu "allowed" Javi to win only if Yuzu laid out in the middle of the ice and made snow angels until the music stopped, but everyone gave it their all and this is how it all played out.

It's a competition, not a coronation.

 

[4everchan]

I'll express my feelings however I want.

Oh, please. Don't be dramatic.

so I can't express my feelings however I want but you can ? good night Max.

 

[MaxSwagg]

so I can't express my feelings however I want but you can ? good night Max.

I didn't say you couldn't. No, I wasn't frustrated, I was TICKED. Particularly at Yuzu for bleeping this up, though the ice and Denis's outrageous behavior certainly messed with his focus.

 

[bobbob]

I'll express my feelings however I want. It wouldn't matter if I were there or not. I'm getting over it because even legends make mistakes. Of course the ice conditions and Denis situations certainly did not help. Clean superior skater - wins. Disastrous superior skater - allows less superior clean skater to win. It's as simple as that. There is absolutely no way D/R are a superior pair to Sui and Han, StolKlim and V/T. It was a shame mistakes were made and unfortunately a trick team with little respect for the discipline won. The components were too high in both segments (should've been UNDER V/T after the SP) and should have been under 150 in the free skate. No transitions, lots of two footed skating, no interpretation. I will give her credit on the lift positions, though, as some of those have improved.

I agree that if Sui and Han were clean D/R would not have won. The same is not true for any of the other pairs. StolKlim would have needed 158+, not possible. V/T would not have been able to score 155 even with a good program. I do think S/K and V/T are better SKATERS but they certainly were not in a better position to win.

Again, I dont love D/R's skating but they got the job done. As far as I'm concerned, they did not have any two foots (while V/T, S/M, etc did) and decent transitions, though their skating skills as a pair still need improvement as do their overall grace and artistry on the ice. I think their PCS should probably be in the same area as S/K (who had a fall) and S/M, around 71-72.

I'm never a fan of saying someone gave someone else the victory because it is a competition and whoever does the best wins, no one has won yet.

 

[Kinga]

Stolbova/Klimov tempted their karma last season by not going to Worlds, where they were favourites and one of the medals was basically waiting for them. In this sport you should never neglect your chances, because you never know how long can you compete injury-free or when other competitors surpass you. It is not like they had pile of WCh gold medals before to reject a chance for one. Just my two cents.

I hope S/H win their gold soon.
Im also looking forward to better programs for S/M. I appreciate their attempt for a modern version of Solveig song, but gosh, was there a crow tortured backstage every 5 seconds?

 

[Buttercup]

I'll express my feelings however I want. It wouldn't matter if I were there or not. I'm getting over it because even legends make mistakes. Of course the ice conditions and Denis situations certainly did not help. Clean superior skater - wins. Disastrous superior skater - allows less superior clean skater to win. It's as simple as that. There is absolutely no way D/R are a superior pair to Sui and Han, StolKlim and V/T. It was a shame mistakes were made and unfortunately a trick team with little respect for the discipline won. The components were too high in both segments (should've been UNDER V/T after the SP) and should have been under 150 in the free skate. No transitions, lots of two footed skating, no interpretation. I will give her credit on the lift positions, though, as some of those have improved.

You can certainly express your feelings, but you are doing your favorites no credit by making nasty comments about D/R. Meagan and Eric work extremely hard, push themselves to improve their elements and deliver difficult programs (you must have been taking a fridge break if you saw no transitions) that suit their own style. I've never heard of them saying a bad word about anyone in the sport. Their skating may not be your personal preference, but they came to Boston and skated like champions. The Russian pairs did not.

This was a fair result and I am happy for everyone on the podium. The only way it could be improved would be to have a pewter medal so that Stolbova and Klimov could also join in. At least we will always have the GPF performance of their awesome free skate.

 

[solani]

I'll express my feelings however I want. It wouldn't matter if I were there or not. I'm getting over it because even legends make mistakes. Of course the ice conditions and Denis situations certainly did not help. Clean superior skater - wins. Disastrous superior skater - allows less superior clean skater to win. It's as simple as that. There is absolutely no way D/R are a superior pair to Sui and Han, StolKlim and V/T. It was a shame mistakes were made and unfortunately a trick team with little respect for the discipline won. The components were too high in both segments (should've been UNDER V/T after the SP) and should have been under 150 in the free skate. No transitions, lots of two footed skating, no interpretation. I will give her credit on the lift positions, though, as some of those have improved.

It's not about one's potential, it's about who can deliver on the day. In every sport. Meagan has come very far with what god's given her (although he also gave her a superiour landing leg ). I liked that they were both happy with the 2nd place after the SP, they know what they're capable of doing. They took high risk (Sui/Han did that as well) and it paid off. We all know that a pair like V/T can still beat D/H, but they have to be perfect if D/H are on. S/H need a less than perfect day to beat them, but they had an off day, so they didn't.
Look at it this way: Roger Federer is arguably the best tennis player of all time. But does he win every match? Of course not. He's only human. And we can only see how great he really is when he plays against someone who really challenges him. And loses and then wins again.

 

[neostra]

I love Meagan so I'm really happy that they got the gold medal and they did deserve that. Despite the fact that I'm not connected to that fs program because I just don't like the song Hometown Glory (I love Adele, but I don't like that song). Sui/Han just had a bad day like Yuzu. Not winning the gold medal doesn't change the fact that they are good skaters. It's competition. Sometimes you win and sometimes you lose. Javi deserved that gold medal with no doubts. (But I really don't like that kind of style.) He had the best fs performance in that competition and that's it. Skaters with the best performance and least mistakes in that competition get the gold medal.

The only pair I felt sorry was Shiaoyu Yu/ Young Jin who were not chosen to compete in the Worlds. Accordingly Wang/Wang were in better condition before the list was decided. Well, who knows? Even though it's unlikely for Yu/Jin to be on the podium, I think there's a good possibility that they'd do better than Wang/Wang. Since Yu/Jin didn't not participate, it's just words.

last but not least, what a day for Aliona. What a determined person she is. Wish the best of her. (Meagan is still my favorite.)

 

[rollerblade]

I agree that if Sui and Han were clean D/R would not have won.

At first glance on the protocols, I thought maybe D/R had too big of a BV advantage that even a clean S/H couldn't overcome. Their SP's PCS were very close, 0.72 difference; so most of the 2+ point SP lead came from TES.

Since I have too much time on my hands, I looked at the protocols again and cross-referenced their 4CC FS. While it looked like they did worse at Worlds, their BV actually went up slightly, thanks to the improved levels in several elements: Twist, Death Spiral, Flying Camel ComboSpin. However, their Pairs Spin actually went down 2 levels. (*No idea why they don't have level 4 in both spins... oversight? mistake?)

If I cherry-picked the planned elements+levels they did from both competitions, they would have a BV of 64.80.... which should give them the win easily with their SP lead. Degree of cleanliness matters though!

Downgrading the throw from 4STh to 3LTh is a loss of 3.2 points in BV.... which means, even if they were clean on their 3S jump, they would have to rely on GOE and PCS to win... which in theory they should! Although I found Samson+Delilah to be zzzzzz compared to their amazing short program.

Guess I answered my own question. Also understood why Meagen+Eric are looking to do 3As next season because they need every BV advantage they can get.

Holy hellballs, levels are so crucial in pairs.

 

[Sugarpova]

awful result for me but I guess Duhamel & Aliona can gloat now
I see D/R fans already do

all my hugs to V/T, S/H & S/K

& yay congrats to I/M!! I almost gave up on them!!:thumbsup:
& M/H programm is a classic! Disco classic

 

[lavoix]

I'm still torn as to whether Stolbova/Klimov should have been on the podium or not. I feel like they somehow did better than Savchenko/Massot in some areas, but worse in others. The difference was rather small, and I guess I'm still in shock to see Stolbova/Klimov (especially Stolbova) have so many mistakes.

 

[QuadThrow]

I'm still torn as to whether Stolbova/Klimov should have been on the podium or not. I feel like they somehow did better than Savchenko/Massot in some areas, but worse in others. The difference was rather small, and I guess I'm still in shock to see Stolbova/Klimov (especially Stolbova) have so many mistakes.

That´s it.

It was close and it should be close. Aljona saved the Bronze with the big Salchow throw in the last second.

 

[Luna Cat]

No. They should've won 2012 Worlds but lost due to S/S favoritism.

V/T didn't win 2012 because they had a very bad short program: http://www.isuresults.com/results/wc2012/WC2012_Pairs_SP_Scores.pdf (that also counts ...)

 

[MaxSwagg]

V/T didn't win 2012 because they had a very bad short program: http://www.isuresults.com/results/wc2012/WC2012_Pairs_SP_Scores.pdf (that also counts ...)

...so that justifies the PCS inflation?

 

[Luna Cat]

Stolbova/Klimov tempted their karma last season by not going to Worlds, where they were favourites and one of the medals was basically waiting for them. In this sport you should never neglect your chances, because you never know how long can you compete injury-free or when other competitors surpass you. It is not like they had pile of WCh gold medals before to reject a chance for one. Just my two cents.

I hope S/H win their gold soon.
Im also looking forward to better programs for S/M. I appreciate their attempt for a modern version of Solveig song, but gosh, was there a crow tortured backstage every 5 seconds?

I think S/M will have better programs in the future. This season they didn't had money for a good choreographer because the French federation didn't release Bruno for a looooong time and last summer/autumn S/M didn't know if they can skate competitions this season. I think they invest the price money from Europeans and Worlds for Brunos release (they have to pay a part of the 10000 Euros which the French fed wants of their own) and for better choreography in the next season.

 

[Luna Cat]

...so that justifies the PCS inflation?

V/T get from some judges only -1 in GOEs for a fall in the short ?!? and won the free with 8 points more than S/S. It was tight yes, but if you count short and free program together the final result was ok.

At this worlds I was happy that also two-footed landings didn't get +1/+2 in GOEs ...

 

[TheGrandSophy]

I didn't have time to give my impressions yesterday so here goes.

V&T were disappointing to me. The fluidity they are known for was just not there. They felt slow and laboured in places. And they made mistakes. My seat companions (made friends whilst there, yah!) and I thought they'd get an Olympic Champion boost from the judges, but were convinced it was fair when they didn't. Others were better on the day.

St/K again made mistakes. Parts were lovely. However, one of my neighbours made the good observation that this is a programme that needs to be clean to create the impression. And they also didn't have anything 'extra' technically.

S/M were great. Some of their elements were so impressive. The music was obviously chosen to give space for just focusing on elements rather than needing intense expression. The strategy worked although I didn't love the programme. Preferred their SP.

T/M's elements are extremely impressive. They made mistakes in the FP, but that is undeniable. Now they really need to work on audience engagement.

I wanted S/H to win so badly. Their SP is in my top 3 of the week. Mesmerising! However, unfortunately, they made mistakes. They were great though and the crowd loved them. We oooed at some choreo that was just stunning.

My nearest neighbour was not a lover of D/R. She thinks they are usually sloppy and unrefined. I like their hard work and grit, but they've never been faves. However, in that FP? They had a moment. We all 3 agreed they were amazing. My immediate neighbour said she'd never seen them skate with such precision. It galls me that people try to take from their achievement. They grabbed the initiative and skated lights out. I am so pleased for them although sad for S/H.

Worthy medalists! Congrats to them all!

 

[flakyy]

I'm still torn as to whether Stolbova/Klimov should have been on the podium or not. I feel like they somehow did better than Savchenko/Massot in some areas, but worse in others. The difference was rather small, and I guess I'm still in shock to see Stolbova/Klimov (especially Stolbova) have so many mistakes.

I simply don't get the PCS for S/M. In the SP there was an elegant lady and a tall guy standing aroung, looking at her somehow astonished and throwing her around, if needed. It's not so terrible as it was with Volosozhar/Morozow, yet similar to Yankowkas/Coughlin, but that's not a well balanced pair. S/K made mistakes and were clearly not fit, but their programs were the best, IMO. :roll9:

 

[Osmond4gold]

Sui and Han did allow them to win. Just like Yuzu allowed Javi to win. Don't be ridiculous.

So... last year after D&R won, you diminished their win stated that the only reason was that the "quality of the event was low" (your words, 04-03-2015, 02:57 AM #7). Now that all major teams have returned to competition, and D&R have won back to back world titles, you believe S&H allowed them to win...

You are killing me Max, . Is there no end to your denial?

 

[MaxSwagg]

So... last year after D&R won, you diminished their win stated that the only reason was that the "quality of the event was low" (your words, 04-03-2015, 02:57 AM #7). Now that all major teams have returned to competition, and D&R have won back to back world titles, you believe S&H allowed them to win...

You are killing me Max, . Is there no end to your denial?

It was low quality. So was the skating here. That's typically how subpar skaters win.