Discussion on Versatility
- Thread starter eppen
- Start date
- Joined
- Dec 25, 2012
https://youtu.be/QLutqTMzP44?t=1m22s It's not the exact same thing, but he's done programs like this.
and more recently, https://youtu.be/1WN4UNO-6Ow?t=13s
So, skating to the music using his own style, rock music also fits.
No one can do Javi moves quite like Javi does, so one has to use one's own repertoire of movement and choreo to match the music.
Last edited:
I don't think anyone would be able to skate Hanyu Chopin in the same way. Only if you would take off all transitions he was doing there I would pick Chan
Last edited:
Nobody can skate any program from a different athlete the exact same way. Nobody. And Chan does not have the same lines Yuzu has. To me it's not only the technicals and SS but the visuals and the emotion every skater brings to the ice. They can't be the same. Impossible.
- Joined
- Feb 25, 2014
I love that performance to death.Change is another fun program...starting with mysterious shamisen then bammed pop rock
- Joined
- Sep 14, 2016
Change is another fun program...starting with mysterious shamisen then bammed pop rock
Why do i see this for the first time
I like his "hello i love you" ex :luv17:
You have a point, Javier hasn't done lyrical in competition yet. Yuzuru can do entertaining, but he hasn't done a funny, comical program in competition yet. That's a difficult thing to do and very few dare to do it. Not that I want Yuzuru to do something like that. I like his programs and his artistic vision.
He goes without saying
But I think Takahashi showed a great balance between trying different genres and playing his strengths :yes:
- Joined
- Mar 7, 2015
IMHO
Technical content dominates competitive figure skating so IMHO versatility is not really present.... skaters use the same layouts, moves, jumps, transitions, whatever the music is.... the costume changes, a few arm movements change but the SKATING itself remains based on TES content, which is pretty predictable and straightforward. Entries into jumps, transitions and even footwork contain elements that are reused from year to year.... just one example that everyone can easily visualize : if a skater has a great cantilever, does it mean that it matches the music from year to year? Of course not... but yet, often that move is repeated. Same with Ina Bauer.... ladies with Biellmann spins : what does it have to do with a program that is much darker versus a softer happier program?
The content used by single skaters is mostly there for TES and has often little to do with music choices. Best example is when Kurt Browning got to the pro circuit, then we discovered his versatility, suddenly we discovered he could be a clown, a flirt, a serious skater... etc
What I could say is that some skaters are more apt to repackage their technical material and it can fit to different kinds of music, while others have a harder time because their presence on ice is less adaptable (thinking about Elvis). But does that really constitute versatility? I don't really think so. A more adaptable style could also mean a more generic personal style.
IMHO, the only real versatility in the sport comes from the short dance : there, greatest skaters HAVE to adapt to different style, not only in terms of personality and performance but in terms of technical content.
To me versatility is not only in terms of performance and packaging but also in terms of content.... I'd like to see different set ups into jumps that would match the music better, rather than the ones commonly used by the skaters... etc... I'd like to see different transitions, different spins.... great donut there but does it really fit any music?
Technical content dominates competitive figure skating so IMHO versatility is not really present.... skaters use the same layouts, moves, jumps, transitions, whatever the music is.... the costume changes, a few arm movements change but the SKATING itself remains based on TES content, which is pretty predictable and straightforward. Entries into jumps, transitions and even footwork contain elements that are reused from year to year.... just one example that everyone can easily visualize : if a skater has a great cantilever, does it mean that it matches the music from year to year? Of course not... but yet, often that move is repeated. Same with Ina Bauer.... ladies with Biellmann spins : what does it have to do with a program that is much darker versus a softer happier program?
The content used by single skaters is mostly there for TES and has often little to do with music choices. Best example is when Kurt Browning got to the pro circuit, then we discovered his versatility, suddenly we discovered he could be a clown, a flirt, a serious skater... etc
What I could say is that some skaters are more apt to repackage their technical material and it can fit to different kinds of music, while others have a harder time because their presence on ice is less adaptable (thinking about Elvis). But does that really constitute versatility? I don't really think so. A more adaptable style could also mean a more generic personal style.
IMHO, the only real versatility in the sport comes from the short dance : there, greatest skaters HAVE to adapt to different style, not only in terms of personality and performance but in terms of technical content.
To me versatility is not only in terms of performance and packaging but also in terms of content.... I'd like to see different set ups into jumps that would match the music better, rather than the ones commonly used by the skaters... etc... I'd like to see different transitions, different spins.... great donut there but does it really fit any music?
I don't expect much versatility from young skaters, because the personality is important. Even if we speak just about dancing (not about trying to be an actor).
For many dances a dancer (or a skater) should be really able to become unashamed or stubborn (and etc). Otherwise the movements won't be natural. Of course, even a child can pretend to be a monster, but it doesn't mean, that this child would be able to perform a real program (staying a monster). And you know... so many people are watching. Often even an adult person can't be unashamed, when people are watching.
Just recently Averbukh said it about the girls. He said Sotnikova is able to behave like a champion, other Russian girls can't move like that. Not because of the body. Because of their thoughts and feelings.
Freedom is in one's head. And in one's heart.
I like, that Adelina differs from other girls, but I think she also can't move like Evgenia or Julia move. I don't mean repeating the elements, I mean the nature of movements.
For faves? I haven't started yet.
But if versatility (in style) is really interesting for somebody...
this is what Yagudin has today: his fantastic freedom and his energy.
He really can change the nature of his movements.
I think his "Oblivion" is the most interesting program from one point of view: I'd say even young Yagudin didn't move like this; adult men don't move like this. :shocked: Not every child is able to be so relaxed and careless. I think it is easy to feel how relaxed and musical he is (if the viewer doesn't try to count the points, which he could get in sport):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nua_BkvmHM0&t=3m12s 2014
This is the key to versatility.
For a tough movement the body also should be relaxed in the beginning (if we mean a beautiful tough movement). And the head should be free from fears and from shyness.
It is interesting to compare two Yagudin's numbers to one music ("Red right hand").
Music is the same, but the way he moves is different.
Here his body seems to be very tough. But I'd say some parts of the body are very relaxed (otherwise he wouldn't be so musical). Here he dances to the rhythm.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8aym3syRjvo&t=1m16s 2010
And when he is skating to the same music, his body is absolutely obedient to the melody.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LTilA965aQ8&t=3m04s 2015
No, we don't think, that the choreographer has invented a masterpiece. Those who love Yagudin called this number "shame with a paint". Yet even a Lambiel's admirer says, that the audience is impressed by this simple number and she is also impressed (the Lambiel's admirer). Magic...
A funny thing. It seems, that... despite such an ability to be amazingly relaxed the lyrical programs are not comfortable for him. His lyrical program should be a little bit funny or a little bit dramatic. A spoon of adventures is just necessary. So it is interesting, if they succeed to make him skate something lyrical.
He is not shy to seem cruel or rude, not shy to be obedient or childish. All his nature really changes. And no distance between him and the audience.
Now his skating is not a sport skating, of course.
Yet he had unique (different) programs, when he competed.
Last edited:
- Joined
- Feb 13, 2014
I know someone who could do better comical style than Javi, it's Kovtun: http://youtu.be/MdNvdeIo4Xg
- Joined
- Dec 25, 2012
Last edited:
- Joined
- Mar 23, 2010
He is truly versatile and unpredictably comical, always surprising! I mean.... he certainly made me laugh all the time.
Last edited:
- Joined
- Sep 10, 2014
I know right, Kovtun is so natural when it comes to comical stuff.
Does that make Kovtun the most versatile guy ever?
Similar threads
