IOC's banning of Russia from 2018 Olympics

[LadyB]

Bad analogy

That was a human rights salute
A better analogy to that event in history would be something like an LGBT raising their fist on the podium
at the 2014 Sochi Olympics

I think it would be very ill advised for an athlete to protest against Clean Sports

I know emotions are running high but the salute on the podium by Tommie Smith and John Carlos and the pin in support from Peter Norman was an important moment in the civil and human rights movement. People lost life and limb because of de jure and de facto racism for many years.

It is really hard to countenance how this compares. Let's be careful here.

Okay, okay. I didn't choose a good example, I admit. And I apologise when I hurt anyones feelings.

What I meant is that I'm always in support when people stand for the things that they believe in and point out injustice. Yes, Russian athletes should probably venture their disappointment somewhere else, but I'm sure there are loads of Russian fans there as well and they should have their moment together, bearing in mind that some fans and athletes feel humiliated by the neutral flag and missing anthem.

 

[silverfoxes]

Strange. What a hypocrize. Some time ago they used to say that they re re not going as neutral athletes

They do not share a hive mind, they have different opinions, and opinions can change when more facts are considered and more information comes to light. That is not hypocrisy (which I assume is the word you were looking for).

hy·poc·ri·sy: the practice of claiming to have moral standards or beliefs to which one's own behavior does not conform

 

[Purv]

They do not share a hive mind, they have different opinions, and opinions can change when more facts are considered and more information comes to light. That is not hypocrisy (which I assume is the word you were looking for).

hy·poc·ri·sy: the practice of claiming to have moral standards or beliefs to which one's own behavior does not conform

No,no,no,no
Hypocrise
"To critise someone about something, but being a hypocrit because you don't practise what you preach"

They said that they re not goin', but now when this is the only option, they changed their minds..thats hypocrise.

 

[Suze]

After taking an evening to digest the news, I have come to ultimately agree with the IOC's decision. To me, the most important thing about the Olympic Games is that all nations can participate on neutral - EQUAL - ground. That's what gives the Olympic medals their value. All nations participate with a promise to be fair and send their very best to represent them. Now, Russia has broken the promise and the evidence is there. If the IOC had allowed Russia to participate, then it would have done so at the cost of breaking that fragile, essential trust at the core of these games.

I feel terrible for those Russian athletes who did the right thing and are still getting screwed by the decision but I am equally torn for past Olympians who missed their chance at a medal because of state-backed cheating.

That said, this upcoming figure skating competition will be a stained one with some of the world's best not able to deliver their performances... and even for those who inevitably compete anyway under neutral flag... the psychological burden will be a factor that may impact performance.

 

[concorde]

When I think about who has won and medaled in Olympics in the past, I don't think "Russia, Korea, Italy". I think "Sotnikova, Kim, Kostner". So I truly, truly hope they will go.

I think it depends on whether it is an individual or team sport. For individual sports, I 100% agree with your comment. For pairs and ice dance, I have heard heard it both ways - individual last name or counties they represent.

Who won the Team medal? You say the country, not the individuals who make up the team.

 

[Purv]

Trust you? I don't trust anyone who doesn't know how to recognize people as individuals or understand the meaning of the word hypocrisy. So I think we're done here.

what you mean by individuals? Who claimed that he/she is not gonna go or those who didnt bother? I say ABOUT those who didnr wanted to go a few days ago and now saying that they do because they re russians and theywil go as proud Russians. thats THE hypocrise

 

[Mista Ekko]

That said, this upcoming figure skating competition will be a stained one with some of the world's best not able to deliver their performances... and even for those who inevitably compete anyway under neutral flag... the psychological burden will be a factor that may impact performance.

So the only athletes who carry psychological burdens are those who can compete but not wear their flag colours?

 

[pearly]

I think it depends on whether it is an individual or team sport. For individual sports, I 100% agree with your comment. For pairs and ice dance, I have heard heard it both ways - individual last name or counties they represent.

Who won the Team medal? You say the country, not the individuals who make up the team.

Yes, but come on. Team event in figure skating? Yes, we have it now, but it's an artificial event in my opinion. I'll still watch it because hey, it's more skating, just like I watch WTT when there's no more proper competitions. But figure skating is not a team sport. If you want a team event, there's a perfectly good, athletic, attractive and competitive discipline of ice skating.

For ice dance and pairs I think only people who don't follow skating won't make a difference between say Virtue/Moir and Weaver/Poje. And only people who really do follow it will say "Canadians won, the French came second" (or vise versa) - and that is because to them it is very obvious who they are referring to. For pairs a fan won't really know what it means if you say "the Russians won".

Edit: Oh but when we're talking about proper team sports such as hockey, yes, you sure need a team with a team name. But I won't lose much sleep over non-figure skating events these OG, except the Team event.

 

[Yuzuruu]

After taking an evening to digest the news, I have come to ultimately agree with the IOC's decision. To me, the most important thing about the Olympic Games is that all nations can participate on neutral - EQUAL - ground. That's what gives the Olympic medals their value. All nations participate with a promise to be fair and send their very best to represent them. Now, Russia has broken the promise and the evidence is there. If the IOC had allowed Russia to participate, then it would have done so at the cost of breaking that fragile, essential trust at the core of these games.

I feel terrible for those Russian athletes who did the right thing and are still getting screwed by the decision but I am equally torn for past Olympians who missed their chance at a medal because of state-backed cheating.

That said, this upcoming figure skating competition will be a stained one with some of the world's best not able to deliver their performances... and even for those who inevitably compete anyway under neutral flag... the psychological burden will be a factor that may impact performance.

I couldn’t agree more. I can see that most people feel so sorry for the current clean Russian athletes but nobody seems to remember those who were robbed of the Olympic medals because of the doping athletes. How else the IOC is supposed to punish Russia so that they would actually feel it? Honestly I believe it is a fair punishment, IOC banned the country but not individual athletes. Also I pray to all the gods out there that there will be NO corrupt judges in FS competitions, only then all the athletes, ESPECIALLY FS ladies, have equal chances in the Olympics.

 

[Purv]

I couldn’t agree more. I can see that most people feel so sorry for the current clean Russian athletes but nobody seems to remember those who were robbed of the Olympic medals because of the doping athletes. How else the IOC is supposed to punish Russia so that they would actually feel it? Honestly I believe it is a fair punishment, IOC banned the country but not individual athletes. Also I pray to all the gods out there that there will be NO corrupt judges in FS competitions, only then all the athletes, ESPECIALLY FS ladies, have equal chances in the Olympics.

Exacly all people here are so sorry for not hearing by Russians their anthems, but those whos medals was stolen by russians didnt hear their anthem either. And they have to live

 

[SimplyLex]

Also I pray to all the gods out there that there will be NO corrupt judges in FS competitions, only then all the athletes, ESPECIALLY FS ladies, have equal chances in the Olympics.

This, so much. I just want the judging to be fair. I want to see called edges and pre rotations just as much as UR. I don't want to see 10.00 in composition for backloaded programs. I don't want to see +3 GOE for prerotated jumps.
And this goes for the Russian ladies, just as much as for Satoko, Ashley, Kaetlyn and everyone else.

 

[WeakAnkles]

I understand why the IOC made this decision, I just wish that they could have come up with a way to still punish Russia were it was clear that the IOC won't put up with doping but still allowed Russia's innocent athletes to still be able to compete under their flag and with their anthem.

Because that would be the very definition of a mixed message. The charge is systematic doping coordinated not by individual coaches, etc but by a government. The message they are sending is the IOC will not tolerate that kind of action, and therefore the country as a whole must be punished. They also recognize that many individual Russian athletes competed and continue to compete clean. I think the IOC managed as best they could given the premises for the decision.

 

[MaiKatze]

Some people are too narrow-minded to even consider that, they think that everything resolves around Figure Skating.

To be fair Goldenskate is a figure skating forum and it's natural that people see it through 'figure-skating'-coloured glasses. If you're interested in more sports than figure skating then you probably see the ban in a different light.

 

[WeakAnkles]

It is true I am not Russian but I think it is an honour that olympic hymn is played if you win. I agree national hymn is important for everyone, still the Olympic one should be very honourable. In the end Olympic spirit should be so beautiful. It should be better than the politics of any country.

 

[WeakAnkles]

I disagree. A lot will never know where Medvedeva or zagitova are from.

Oh please, every single television announcer, analyst, print reporter, etc is going to mention where they are from and talk about the decision. It's Big News. So if people don't know where they're from it won't be the media's fault.

 

[pearly]

Who won the Team medal? You say the country, not the individuals who make up the team.

Actually this got me thinking, the team event is one of the few (if not only) event in the Winter Olympics where it really is about the country and not the individual athletes or a team. All proper team sports require you to practice together and work as a team.

The first time I saw Gracie's and Ashley's Twitter pages with their "Olympic bronze medalist" tag I was like "wait, what?" Initially I thought someone has been stripped of their medals, went back and forth checking results from 2014 and 2010 before I realized if was from the team event. For me that medal doesn't really count.

 

[moriel]

I couldn’t agree more. I can see that most people feel so sorry for the current clean Russian athletes but nobody seems to remember those who were robbed of the Olympic medals because of the doping athletes. How else the IOC is supposed to punish Russia so that they would actually feel it? Honestly I believe it is a fair punishment, IOC banned the country but not individual athletes. Also I pray to all the gods out there that there will be NO corrupt judges in FS competitions, only then all the athletes, ESPECIALLY FS ladies, have equal chances in the Olympics.

Ummmm those medals were taken away, no?
Because your logic is rather weird: "ok, so some inoccent guys didnt get their fair medals, so lets make some other innocent guys not have their medals as revenge"

 

[Yuzuruu]

This, so much. I just want the judging to be fair. I want to see called edges and pre rotations just as much as UR. I don't want to see 10.00 in composition for backloaded programs. I don't want to see +3 GOE for prerotated jumps.
And this goes for the Russian ladies, just as much as for Satoko, Ashley, Kaetlyn and everyone else.

Your comment gives me life and restores my faith in FS fans, thank you

 

[Yuzuruu]

Ummmm those medals were taken away, no?
Because your logic is rather weird: "ok, so some inoccent guys didnt get their fair medals, so lets make some other innocent guys not have their medals as revenge"

Well obviously the medals were taken away but those athletes did not have their rightful moment the way they should have. It is not “revenge”, it is a suitable punishment, as you know IOC banned the county, but DID NOT ban individual athletes, in my book that is as fair as it gets.

 

[MaiKatze]

Ummmm those medals were taken away, no?
Because your logic is rather weird: "ok, so some inoccent guys didnt get their fair medals, so lets make some other innocent guys not have their medals as revenge"

When medals get taken away and you get a Gold medal instead of a Silver medal, it's not the same as winning at that moment and standing on top of the podium. The experience of winning, that moment is something you never got to experience, the other athletes were robbed of that moment.
And 'not have their medals as revenge'? I think it's weird how everyone is so sure that Medvedeva will win the Gold medal, not matter what. She's not at the GPF at the moment - because she is injured. She cannot be robbed of a Gold she hasn't won yet.