IOC's banning of Russia from 2018 Olympics

[moriel]

Well obviously the medals were taken away but those athletes did not have their rightful moment the way they should have. It is not “revenge”, it is a suitable punishment, as you know IOC banned the county, but DID NOT ban individual athletes, in my book that is as fair as it gets.

So, again, how it is a suitable punishment to punish some random innocent people?
Yes IOC did not ban them, but now they will not be able to hear their country's anthem and wont see their flag. Now, they will have to go through tons of additional scrutiny and may not get there at all (see all the stuff about getting approved as neutral competitor and the possible visa issues, for example, since there are ONLY TWO MONTHS LEFT, including at least a week of holidays).

Lets take an example, Medvedeva. She was 14 in 2014. Please do tell me how it is fair to her. Specifically.
Now, take an example, Zagitova. Please also explain how this is fair to her.
What did they do wrong? Why cannot they hear their own anthem? Why cannot they compete under their own banner? Why do they need to have a special approve by IOC to compete?

They will not have their rightful moment the way they should have. Explain the fairness and what did they specifically do to deserve it.

 

[Yuzuruu]

So, again, how it is a suitable punishment to punish some random innocent people?
Yes IOC did not ban them, but now they will not be able to hear their country's anthem and wont see their flag. Now, they will have to go through tons of additional scrutiny and may not get there at all (see all the stuff about getting approved as neutral competitor and the possible visa issues, for example, since there are ONLY TWO MONTHS LEFT, including at least a week of holidays).

Lets take an example, Medvedeva. She was 14 in 2014. Please do tell me how it is fair to her. Specifically.
Now, take an example, Zagitova. Please also explain how this is fair to her.
What did they do wrong? Why cannot they hear their own anthem? Why cannot they compete under their own banner? Why do they need to have a special approve by IOC to compete?

The only people they can and should blame is their own countryman, who put them in this situation. It is VERY fair that Russian anthem will not be heard at these games as it was played unjustily in the past! Is it so hard to undersand that the country you try to justify destoryed other athletes lives?
You think Medvedeva is the only athlete in the world who dreamed of the Olympics? I do feel sorry for her and Zagitova but Russia had to be punished and it finally happened.

 

[moriel]

The only people they can and should blame is their own countryman, who put them in this situation. It is VERY fair that Russian anthem will not be heard at these games as it was played unjustily in the past! Is it so hard to undersand that the country you try to justify destoryed other athletes lives?
You think Medvedeva is the only athlete in the world who dreamed of the Olympics? I do feel sorry for her and Zagitova but Russia had to be punished and it finally happened.

Is it so hard to understand that the intitutions you are trying to justify is destroying other athletes lives right now? Also, please read my post. I´m not trying to justify Russia, as you would ignore my arguments at this point. I´m just pointing out that the decision you defend so much is equally unfair.

Again, I do not see how punishing individual athletes from sports who had no doping history except some random misunderstandings aka cold medicine and a doping boyfriend is fair.

 

[Yuzuruu]

Is it so hard to understand that the intitutions you are trying to justify is destroying other athletes lives right now?
Again, I do not see how punishing individual athletes from sports who had no doping history except some random misunderstandings aka cold medicine and a doping boyfriend is fair.

1. I am not justyfiyng anyone, i simply agree with their decision.
2. Medvedeva is able to compete so please do not compare banning a country flag from a competition to an unjust olympic medal depravation because it is simply disgusting.
3. No individual, clean athletes are being punished, just the country.

 

[coldblueeyes]

There was already one thread closed because of politics and bickering, I'd say it's best to avoid having it happening again.

 

[Ares]

To be fair Goldenskate is a figure skating forum and it's natural that people see it through 'figure-skating'-coloured glasses. If you're interested in more sports than figure skating then you probably see the ban in a different light.

Still I find it depressing that this thought about the harm inflicted on non-Russian non-Figure Skaters athletes in the past, their rightful glory never really turned back, their financial & emotional well-being does not apparently cross their mind when as evidenced by their hysterical reactions & arguments.

 

[coldblueeyes]

Still I find it depressing that this thought about the harm inflicted on non-Russian non-Figure Skaters athletes in the past does not apparently cross their mind when as evidenced by their hysterical reactions & arguments.

We do have to agree that this is all a grey-area kind of thing. There's no easy solution one way or the other, and people are going to argue about it either way.

 

[beachmouse]

Precedent for which athletes have 'proven themselves clean' in similar circumstances kind of got hashed out between the IAAF and CAS about standards that had to be met in order for an athlete to compete INA (independent neutral athlete) while the Russian track & field federation proper has been under global suspension for doping issues. There's been a higher standard other than never testing positive- typically the IAAF have given INA status to athletes who spend significant training time outside of Russia and have been subject to the usual anti-doping testing while training in their host country.

In the eyes of WADA, Zagitova is probably okay to go if she wants because she was really too young to be part of anything. Same goes for anyone who was in the junior ranks in 2014 and any other non-Sochi athletes who primarily train outside of Russia. I suspect it's the older athletes who will have harder times 'proving the negative' and getting right with WADA if you go by the precedents from T&F.

I do think that the figure skaters and a few other sports like curling are collateral damage because of problems in too many other sports, and it just reached a point with the IOC where they felt like saying a sledding sport and nordic skiing disciplines ban (where the major Sochi issues seem to have been) was not enough because there were also problems in so many other summer Games sports as well. I'm glad that there is a pathway for athletes in 'low doping risk sports or who can prove they were well clear of issues in higher doping risk sports will allow for competition.

It's one of those areas where there really is no perfect solution, and I think the IOC came up with as fair of a plan as they could.

 

[Ares]

We do have to agree that this is all a grey-area kind of thing. There's no easy solution one way or the other, and people are going to argue about it either way.

People are either in denial or completely unacquainted with the fact that it's been proceeded since 2015 already as they seem that they just woke up. Total Ban was actually not outside the realm of possibility, they should be glad (as I am) that they have a pretty good chance for participating as OAR neutral athletes. There is no ban on Figure Skaters from Russia, only their individual decisions and some political intervention can stop them. Yet there are many who just spread gloom & doom - already calling that there won't be Russian figure skaters so they rather blame implicitly, sometimes explicitly IOC or WADA instead of Russia. There were ways for Russia after Rio Olympics to still turn it around in their favour but they did not make enough efforts, instead they kept using their deflection tactics. Too little cooperation, too late and this is the result.

 

[somelikeitpink]

Okay so I don't know Russian but according to this: https://t.co/cyBHTZdApH

Putin will not stand in the way of Atheletes competing under the neutral status?

 

[starla16]

Putin said ts is up to athletes to compete or not
so anyone invited by IOC is free to join:

http://tass.com/sport/979423

will Medvedeva join now ?
I rather like this IOC flag, I hope in future the flags will be abolished. Olympics is suppose to be a unity and an athlete as a unifier without a country affiliation is a perfect idea.

 

[Spirals for Miles]

Oh my goodness I'm so relieved that Putin didn't say that they'd be shunned for competing neutrally. Now I hope that that Zhenya, Alina, and the rest of the figure skaters will go.

 

[coldblueeyes]

I think there's a lot to happen, but I kind of expected a diplomatic decision about this.

Certainly it didn't play into the nationalistic, cold-war mindset some people were suggesting earlier.

 

[LRK]

Well, thank goodness for that! I was utterly convinced he'd forbid them - I'm glad I was wrong.

 

[da96103]

Putin said ts is up to athletes to compete or not
so anyone invited by IOC is free to join:

http://tass.com/sport/979423

will Medvedeva join now ?
I rather like this IOC flag, I hope in future the flags will be abolished. Olympics is suppose to be a unity and an athlete as a unifier without a country affiliation is a perfect idea.

That's good news. I hope the athletes will take this opportunity. After all participation in Olympics is the most important thing regardless of the flag you are in. We would still know they are Russians, regardless of the flag they are under.

 

[pearly]

Putin said ts is up to athletes to compete or not
so anyone invited by IOC is free to join:

http://tass.com/sport/979423

will Medvedeva join now ?
I rather like this IOC flag, I hope in future the flags will be abolished. Olympics is suppose to be a unity and an athlete as a unifier without a country affiliation is a perfect idea.

That is a big relief, hopefully there won't be any pressures on athletes to stay at home to prove a point.

 

[jenm]

I wish the clean athletes would go. For themselves and their future opportunities (endorsements, financial assistance, fame, etc.). It's their federation who screwed them up in this case.
I support IOC's decision of banning the country but letting the individual athletes go. I think that is better than banning them all completely. And I agree that competing under the Olympic flag is a great honor as well.

Even though I'm sad for the clean athletes, I also feel sad for those who were robbed of their respective medals in previous events. They missed their own Olympic moment of standing on the podium with the own flags while listening to their anthem. Not only that, they also missed opportunities of having the endorsements and financial support that comes with being Olympic medallists (of any color). This decision is unfair for the clean athletes, but I think it's the most just if looking at the Games as a whole.

 

[friedbanana]

This is a very tough situation, and I definitely understand the reactions of anger and devastation. However after thinking about it, I think the IOC made a good decision. Doping is not okay, and state-sponsored doping is on a whole other level. There needed to be some type of repercussion, and this particular decision is a clear message for Russia to clean up their system while still allowing clean athletes the opportunity to compete. If Russia decides to boycott, I think rather than directing your anger to the IOC, you should get angry at the people who let this doping mess happened in the first place.

I'm still very sad for the athletes who had no part in this mess, and it's terrible that they are facing the consequences of something they had no part in. I just don't know a better way to deal with this situation. The IOC made a balanced decision imo, so it's up to Russia now. I truly hope that the Russian skaters compete at Pyeongchang.

 

[asp11]

this is a very tough situation, and i definitely understand the reactions of anger and devastation. However after thinking about it, i think the ioc made a good decision. Doping is not okay, and state-sponsored doping is on a whole other level. There needed to be some type of repercussion, and this particular decision is a clear message for russia to clean up their system while still allowing clean athletes the opportunity to compete. If russia decides to boycott, i think rather than directing your anger to the ioc, you should get angry at the people who let this doping mess happened in the first place.

I'm still very sad for the athletes who had no part in this mess, and it's terrible that they are facing the consequences of something they had no part in. I just don't know a better way to deal with this situation. The ioc made a balanced decision imo, so it's up to russia now. I truly hope that the russian skaters compete at pyeongchang.

this!!! ^

 

[starla16]

thinking about it, I really hope the future Olympics the flags will be abolished, Olympics should be about the best athletes in the world united under an Olympic Flag !