Gabriella Papadakis & Guillaume Cizeron
- Thread starter breathesgelatin
- Start date
- Joined
- Jan 29, 2015
I'm trying to be level headed but I must say, I looove how b**t-hurt some V/M fans are over this.
- Joined
- Oct 8, 2016
Gaby and Guillaume are next week 27 in Grenoble (50 years of Olympic games in this city) and the 28 at home in Clermont-Ferrand for galas.
https://ffsg.org/
And probably after returning to Montreal to prepare Milan.
Then they will still have the tour of the team of France for two weeks I think. Which season !!
https://ffsg.org/
And probably after returning to Montreal to prepare Milan.
Then they will still have the tour of the team of France for two weeks I think. Which season !!
I'm trying to be level headed but I must say, I looove how b**t-hurt some V/M fans are over this.
I know. I can't read the article because i don't have the subscription, and I presume it barely if at all mentions V/M. Yet just Dean's reposting of this has a V/Mite popping up and going "Scott & Tessa have a body of work that incorporates what Papadakis & Cizeron did here; they’ve done glacial balletic beauty (google). They’ve pushed the boundary of ice dance, have charisma & chemistry to spare - they deserved the gold." It's so pathological and pathetic and insecure. And also deluded. V/M have never done what P/C have done; they have never had the depth of artistry; they've never had the level of musicality or interpretation; and they have never had the level of skating skills. Their likely retirement here will be the death of their influence; no-one is doing what they have been doing with their hyper-athleticisation and competitiveness and their superficial level of interpretation; the stiff-backed ballroom derived style they embody has died with P/C and is unlikely to ever be revived in this modern world where personal freedom and expression have become the overriding principles above approval based form and convention without sense or understanding and where value is placed upon idiotic notions of how a woman and man should be; and where incessant, moronic flag waving and personal greed for particular ends is put above artistic purpose and goals.
Meanwhile P/C's influence is everywhere- from Savchenko's wonderful bringing of ice dance transitions in to pairs, to the greater freedom for and attention on the male in the currently upcoming junior ice dancers, to Patrick Chan's free skate last year; to so much else throughout the sport and its individual disciplines. They are game changers who have ditched the thematic approach to the freedance with its often trip to the fancy dress shop for an appropriate costume, in order to create free programmes that are based on a very direct and non-stylised interpretation of the music, and who have released ice skating from the stepford wife and husband 50s ballroom past where in their hands even a rhumba set pattern can become a joyous personal expression of great speed and abandon, where every edge is correct throughout a whole season, and none of the technical precision has been lost, unlike with every other couple who approach the set pattern like an exteriorly enforced handwriting exercise, which they all in turn, even the "great" Virtue and Moir, were less good at.
For me that really is the reason why P/C are so attacked. Because they are undermining what so many people have thought was so good and the apotheosis of what ice dance can be for so long; and with that those peoples' sense of self; such that they think they can hold on to the crumbling fragments of their own beliefs by attacking them. Well, they can't. P/C are the present and the future of skating; and if the can't deal with that, then they need to retire their interest in the sport, just as their now surpassed idols are also retiring.
I also don't understand the need to add everytime a nice thing about them is said. Perhaps it's insecurity or whatever, but why ? The specialist was comparig the 2 programs and actually couldn't be more right, because this is where both teams decided to play different - using their strength as much as possible to ensure the maximum of points and most of all, avoid the comparaison (or one of them was going down). Even the SDs with the same theme are different by musical choices, construction and dance moves.
If the same article was doing the opposite - praising V/M for the man/woman connection, athleticism or whatever you want to say, fine. I wouldn't even try to write something about P/C because I don't see them ever skate to Moulin Rouge or a Musical/Broadway type of program. Most importantly I don't care.
I mean V/M won, what's the need to keep adding how much they can do anything ? Even the concerned people don't need to add what they can do, they've been there for so long. And I thought the main argument was the "versatility" one, so if we were aware of that you certainly don't need to underline it everytime, especially on an article that is comparing 2 programs, not 2 careers - one is clearly shorter than the other.
I have to be honest I do enjoy the comments under the articles too, though
Yes Ice Dance is moving foward, at least I hope so, and in the short amount of time P/C have been at the top, they managed to create something that's their own but to have influence as well. Aliona is a big fan of them and doesn't hide that she gets inspired by what they do. The whole thing about last year's comment when they said that they did not want to make a latin SD look "cheap and cliche" (and not saying that it is actually cheap and cliche but I guess people prefer fake news) is what I like about them : why sugarcoating things that are said a hundred times a day on this forum ? In France, figure skating looks dated even to figure skaters. Old, not current, stuck in time. You have 2 people who try to make the most of it and try to stay true to themselves - they actually rather dance than move for the sake of it. Shae-Lynn Bourne described them as "young, fresh, the same freshness Torvill & Dean had at the time". I think it's great for everyone that we have a touch of modernity into figure skating with P/C, Aliona/Bruno, Sui/Han LP last year, etc. And that they leave they make it to the dance world is just cherry on the cake.
If the same article was doing the opposite - praising V/M for the man/woman connection, athleticism or whatever you want to say, fine. I wouldn't even try to write something about P/C because I don't see them ever skate to Moulin Rouge or a Musical/Broadway type of program. Most importantly I don't care.
I mean V/M won, what's the need to keep adding how much they can do anything ? Even the concerned people don't need to add what they can do, they've been there for so long. And I thought the main argument was the "versatility" one, so if we were aware of that you certainly don't need to underline it everytime, especially on an article that is comparing 2 programs, not 2 careers - one is clearly shorter than the other.
I have to be honest I do enjoy the comments under the articles too, though
Yes Ice Dance is moving foward, at least I hope so, and in the short amount of time P/C have been at the top, they managed to create something that's their own but to have influence as well. Aliona is a big fan of them and doesn't hide that she gets inspired by what they do. The whole thing about last year's comment when they said that they did not want to make a latin SD look "cheap and cliche" (and not saying that it is actually cheap and cliche but I guess people prefer fake news) is what I like about them : why sugarcoating things that are said a hundred times a day on this forum ? In France, figure skating looks dated even to figure skaters. Old, not current, stuck in time. You have 2 people who try to make the most of it and try to stay true to themselves - they actually rather dance than move for the sake of it. Shae-Lynn Bourne described them as "young, fresh, the same freshness Torvill & Dean had at the time". I think it's great for everyone that we have a touch of modernity into figure skating with P/C, Aliona/Bruno, Sui/Han LP last year, etc. And that they leave they make it to the dance world is just cherry on the cake.
- Joined
- Jan 29, 2015
It really is ridiculous, feels like a dictatorship where it's not enough they are the most decorated Olympians in Figure Skating, but everyone should be in complete awe of their superiority. The lady that wrote the article is an art critic and someone who breathes dance, and V/M fans are telling her she either doesn't understand V/M or that maybe she was uncomfortable with V/M's sensuality (yes, I'm sure that was it :sarcasm
.I have to be honest I do enjoy the comments under the articles too, though
My favorite part is them comparing what P/C is doing to V/Ms classical programs, it truly shows that they don't really understand what P/C are doing and how they've been pushing ice dance in the last years. You have everyone, from former champions and coaches to current competitors, in awe of their ability (my favorites are the tremendously complimentary "I want to be them when I grow up" from Charlie White, or how Anna Cappellini was in tears after their FD ended this week), and these folks think V/M have done that perfectly already. They didn't, music is one thing, the interpretation of that music and how they melt within it and chose to present it, is completely different. V/M might've done classical, but never with the contemporary interpretation. Was it beautiful skating? Sure! Did it change the face of the sport and influenced other disciplines? Heck no!
The other thing is (I think it was a comment from one of the B.ESP guys in the past), ice is such a rewarding medium for dancing because it enables this impact-free movement and hypnotic flow, and in my eyes, there's nobody using the medium as well as P/C do. V/M have a lot of energy and attack, but sometimes it feels like they're fighting the ice, taming it for their purpose. P/C just use it without any disruption, the ice feeds their speed and flow and they know how to treat it.
- Joined
- Oct 25, 2017
And I do find this argument about 'versatility' quite problematic. Of course, V/M are more 'versatile'. That's because they've had more opportunities to exhibit versatility given the 13 years they've had on the senior level alone. P/C, on the other hand, have only five years. I found it disturbing when in a video interview of Shae-Lynn Bourne shown here on GoldenSkate the interviewer suggested a scoring on versatility be implemented. That simply is unrealistic! The only way to judge versatility is to compare the team across their own performances across seasons. How would you score a new ice dance team on versatility if they've only had one year of competition? This is like people not understanding 'percentages', 'proportions', or 'ratios' (one of my pet peeves
)!! Besides judging is done on the current program/performance and not on the career, as you correctly pointed out, Anyasnake.And I do find this argument about 'versatility' quite problematic. Of course, V/M are more 'versatile'. That's because they've had more opportunities to exhibit versatility given the 13 years they've had on the senior level alone. P/C, on the other hand, have only five years. I found it disturbing when in a video interview of Shae-Lynn Bourne shown here on GoldenSkate the interviewer suggested a scoring on versatility be implemented. That simply is unrealistic! The only way to judge versatility is to compare the team across their own performances across seasons. How would you score a new ice dance team on versatility if they've only had one year of competition? This is like people not understanding 'percentages', 'proportions', or 'ratios' (one of my pet peeves
I had the exact same reaction ! Poor Junior teams, they wouldn't stand a chance, ever and would have to wait until 28, 30 years old ?
Plus it involves reputation judging and it's a big no :furious:
- Joined
- Nov 8, 2017
Go here: http://archive.is/ZdEob
Tweet from the American Ballet Theater : https://twitter.com/ABTBallet/status/966825227056504833
(Someone should comment that they actually won the Free Dance)
(Someone should comment that they actually won the Free Dance
)
- Joined
- Nov 8, 2017
Is there an article or video somewhere in which V/M acknowledge that the dress misery at least played a part in the SD point gap?
It seems to be simply ignored in the reports that congratulate V/M, which seems very weird to me. It happened, it was a huge part of the SD outcome, so obviously it was part of the total outcome. Logically, it would be mentioned everywhere that at least it made an impact on the scoring, no?
I have not searched extensively but only came across a yahoo item that had Scott counter the claims of unfair judging.
I'm a bit baffled here.
It seems to be simply ignored in the reports that congratulate V/M, which seems very weird to me. It happened, it was a huge part of the SD outcome, so obviously it was part of the total outcome. Logically, it would be mentioned everywhere that at least it made an impact on the scoring, no?
I have not searched extensively but only came across a yahoo item that had Scott counter the claims of unfair judging.
I'm a bit baffled here.
- Joined
- Nov 8, 2017
(Someone didTweet from the American Ballet Theater : https://twitter.com/ABTBallet/status/966825227056504833
(Someone should comment that they actually won the Free Dance
)- Joined
- Oct 25, 2017
I had the exact same reaction ! Poor Junior teams, they wouldn't stand a chance, ever and would have to wait until 28, 30 years old ?
Indeed! Plus, I bet most teams display 'lack of versatility' (whatever that means!) on their first five years of competition (even on the senior level). Comparing V/M and P/C without considering the length of career and the differences in opportunities to prove their worth just doesn't make sense. However, I would just take it as a compliment for P/C to be stacked up against another who have been considered as icons.
- Joined
- Oct 25, 2017
(Someone did
Yay!! I wish they posted a picture of their free dance though.... or maybe a link to their COC free dance.
- Joined
- Oct 25, 2017
Jeffrey Cirio's dance company "Cirio Collective" tweet wishing P/C best of luck on their performance:
https://twitter.com/ciriocollective/status/965397868025663493
https://twitter.com/ciriocollective/status/965397868025663493
https://www.instagram.com/p/BfhoQstAeqq/?taken-by=guillaumecz
I love how Guillaume try to stop everybody from being busy with Gabriellas nip slip.....
And if you look at this photo also https://www.instagram.com/p/BfdAMGXAbZm/?taken-by=guillaumecz is amazing that both of them have a mole on their left shoulder....
They are so matched as if they were Brother and Sister for real :luv17:
I love how Guillaume try to stop everybody from being busy with Gabriellas nip slip
.....And if you look at this photo also https://www.instagram.com/p/BfdAMGXAbZm/?taken-by=guillaumecz is amazing that both of them have a mole on their left shoulder....
They are so matched as if they were Brother and Sister for real :luv17:
- Joined
- May 21, 2014
Exactly, and Christopher Dean put it beautifully too in an article at the beginning of the season "it's like the French are born from the ice". Again, they ice dance. They don't try to adapt floor dancing onto the ice hence the feeling of fighting the ice. Reading the commentaries on the NY times article, it's overwhelmingly positive towards the French. Many enjoy their brand of ice dancing. But overall the expression which sums it all for me is "distractingly performative", I couldn't put it better myself. It is subjective of course but I just don't like that style at all. It makes it look like they work so hard at it and they want you to know. So the recent explanation MR was running so deep with so many layers hence the difficulty to make it work, had me rolling my eyes. The choreo is nothing but obvious just accompanying the lyrics : "Walk the streets for money..." and Tessa mimicking the gesture to throw money on the floor, plus their cunniliftus I mean give me the Danes on the Doors anytime for sexual tension tbh, now that is sizzling without shoving it down your throat.
I missed Anna crying at the end of their performance, I should rewatch. Anna and Lucas have said some lovely things in an article right after the SD. I feel there is a group of skaters who really enjoy each other's company. We see them popping up on instagram preparing the gala and having fun: C/B, H/D, C/L, P/C, yuzu, javi ... I've never been a fan of Anna and Lucas' skating but boy do I like them as people and performers. I will miss them.
I could not find any. Their being silent baffled me at first too. They seemed to be in shock when they found out about Guillaume's hand after the short dance in Helsinki (at the beginning of the press conference). But maybe they just do not want to mention it to respect Gabby? Or they are tired of all this fan war too, I do not know. It would be useful to see the press conference. But I do not believe they damaged her dress on purpose or had anything to do with it.
- Joined
- Oct 25, 2017
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