Evgenia Medvedeva

[Orlov]

Not everyone likes this photo in Russia. Tbh i can understand it.

Tbh i was realy sad when Zhenya went to Canada (yes, many Russians are unhappy with this and sad), but I completly don't understand why the photo should not like.

 

[Mrs. P]

I didn't enjoy the program as a whole, I don't like programs that have the roots in real events like 9-11 or the Holocaust. I will say that at the beginning of the season I don't think she looked comfortable skating to it but by WTT she learned how to sell it. I enjoyed her W.E. program more - my personal favourite is her AK program from this past season. That's the thing with her is that even is she is not into the music or the program she knows how to sell it

Personally, I loved the choice of music, especially the second one - which has nothing to do with the movie and it's pretty much a completely unknown piece by a completely unknown composer. I think Averbukh has many flaws but he always picks incredibly original music.

So, as a fan, I loved the music - minus the 9/11 sounds, of course, which I thought were insensitive. I liked the choreography fine except for the picking up the phone\carrying the suitcase bits, which were a little too much imo. The second half of the program was the better one for me because I liked the music more and she really seemed to get into the program there, and her skate at WTT was honestly breathtaking.

To be honest, I thought it was a nice program and that she sold it really well. Without those awkward phone moves and the 9/11 sounds it would have been my favorite of hers after WE and Chopin, but because of those details I couldn't embrace it 100%

Thanks to you both.

Yes, the actual music from the soundtrack is really lovely. I feel like they could have gone a different direction of interpretation with the music.

Yes, I agree Averbach does pick really good music and not warhorses either. But I will not miss all the sound effects. The Chopin program IS FINE without the beating heart at the end.

I agree she sells it well. I pretty much went from "I can't with this" to "I don't love it, but I can watch and find things I really enjoy about it."

 

[meowmeow]

i like this program a lot.

 

[flanker]

So can I toss something at you guys?

What did you guys think of her Extremely Loud and Incredibly Close program from the 2016-2017 season? I had a really hard time with it because I am American and the step sequence with all the voiceovers brought back bad memories of Sept. 11 (I was in college and had to write about how it affected students on campus). I know it was an Averbach-driven program, but it was hard to watch especially after her exquisite W.E. free skate, which remains one of my favorites from her.

Honestly, the storyline worked and the music was beautiful and I feel like she could have pulled off the story without the voiceovers (though I'm not sure what you would put there instead). I also think that the step sequence was a bit of a crutch from her truly being able to interpret the music the piece.

I'm kind of glad to hear her say that in hindsight she didn't really love it. Anyway, I tried to be open-minded and am curious about other fans opinions. I'll add that I actually had shown the Russian Test Skates/Japan Open version to a few non-skating friends and I got a range of reactions. Some did feel like it was too soon/poor taste, but others had some good opinions that they felt the bigger problem was interpretation of the pain.

Do you question the movie itself (or any other movie about this, e. g. United 93) the same way?

 

[Mrs. P]

Do you question the movie itself (or any other movie about this, e. g. United 93) the same way?

I haven't seen any of the movies, to be honest (probably because I don't feel super comfortable about watching the types of movies). I know the movie of this particular soundtrack generated controversy, but I haven't seen it so I can't speak to it.

Also, I'm trying to keep it positive -- I want to emphasize that I'm talking about the program. I'm just waiting to talk about how parts of this particular program was tough for me and perhaps get some opinions to broaden my view on it. The program happened, so no point to question whether she should have used it or not.

 

[flanker]

I haven't seen any of the movies, to be honest (probably because I don't feel super comfortable about watching the types of movies). I know the movie the soundtrack for generated controversy, but I haven't seen it so I can't speak to it.

Also, I'm trying to keep it positive -- I want to emphasize that I'm talking about the program. I'm not trying to say that Evgenia's skating is hard to watch, just parts of this particular program for me.

I asked the question, because I didn't know from what point of view you approach to it. Perhaps, this question could be asked at any piece of art related (or inspired by) to real event, incl. Picasso's Guernica.

 

[zounger]

I haven't seen any of the movies, to be honest (probably because I don't feel super comfortable about watching the types of movies). I know the movie of this particular soundtrack generated controversy, but I haven't seen it so I can't speak to it.

Also, I'm trying to keep it positive -- I want to emphasize that I'm talking about the program. I'm just waiting to talk about how parts of this particular program was tough for me and perhaps get some opinions to broaden my view on it. The program happened, so no point to question whether she should have used it or not.

The program was great the voice overs bad.

 

[Mrs. P]

I asked the question, because I didn't know from what point of view you approach to it. Perhaps, this question could be asked at any piece of art related (inspired by) to real event, incl. Picasso's Guernica.

Oh okay, thanks for the clarification. To be honest with Sept. 11, the only thing I've looked at is photographs. There's actually a DVD I have of a photo slideshow compiled by students in my university's photography program. A big group of students drove to NY to shoot the aftermath. It is incredibly moving and I love watching it because of the stories they captured. Still even that is hard to watch, even though we're almost 20 years out.

I think the storyline Zhenya was trying to portray was an interesting one. I'm not sure if that music/voiceovers was necessarily the best way to do it.

Going back to the present, I'd love her to explore some programs that were not so much program/story driven. Some of the exhibition programs she did that summer are a step in the right direction.

 

[flanker]

Oh okay, thanks for the clarification. To be honest with Sept. 11, the only thing I've looked at is photographs. There's actually a DVD I have of a photo slideshow compiled by students in my university's photography program. A big group of students drove to NY to shoot the aftermath. It is incredibly moving and I love watching it because of the stories they captured. Still even that is hard to watch, even though we're almost 20 years out.

I think the storyline Zhenya was trying to portray was an interesting one. I'm not sure if that music/voiceovers was necessarily the best way to do it.

Going back to the present, I'd love her to explore some programs that were not so much program/story driven.

Well, of course there is always boundary between portraying real feelings through art and calculation (for whatever purpose, money, success, being called artist etc.). If I consider Zhenya's program as a whole, incl. her own contribution, I think that was the first case, not the second. She really portrayed feelings coming form the hard situation (BTW much better way than it was in the movie) of a kid, who is facing reality, and all those voices, records etc. were part of that reality. So from my point of view, it was art, it hed the place in the program. That's why it had pretty strong impression on me. But of course, it is only my personal opinion.

 

[meowmeow]

i'd say it's about terror attacks in general not exactly 9/11, eteri was suffered from the terror attack in Oklahoma City, so here is the root of the program.

 

[flanker]

i'd say it's about terror attacks in general not exactly 9/11, eteri was suffered from the terror attack in Oklahoma City, so here is the root of the program.

Good point.

 

[meowmeow]

and her daughter has hearing problems so that's why we have 15/16 program

 

[carmina]

Honestly, the storyline worked and the music was beautiful and I feel like she could have pulled off the story without the voiceovers (though I'm not sure what you would put there instead).

IMO music was good but not that perfect and I really didn't like voicevers but I love evgenia and and I can watch anything she skates to
so to be honest I make myself like the program cuz I knew I have to watch it for along time
After having a bad day someone drink wine other eat ice cream or go for a walk - I just watch evgenia
I open her previous programs and watch them- she is my peace-of-mind girl
Even when I am in a good mood I like to watch her
Thats why I want her to win everytime - I dont care if anyone else is better or worse I don't care if it is fair or not
for me she is the best and I want her to be happy , she is happy when she wins so be it

I love to watch her skates to tango or something not moody - but more important thing is I want her to skate what she wants to
I watched and enjoyed Extremely Loud and Incredibly Close - it was like drink a coffee brand for year to me -being a fan is twisted thing

 

[glassanimal]

So can I toss something at you guys?

What did you guys think of her Extremely Loud and Incredibly Close program from the 2016-2017 season? I had a really hard time with it because I am American and the step sequence with all the voiceovers brought back bad memories of Sept. 11 (I was in college and had to write about how it affected students on campus). I know it was an Averbach-driven program, but it was hard to watch especially after her exquisite W.E. free skate, which remains one of my favorites from her.

Honestly, the storyline worked and the music was beautiful and I feel like she could have pulled off the story without the voiceovers (though I'm not sure what you would put there instead). I also think that the step sequence was a bit of a crutch from her truly being able to interpret the music the piece.

I'm kind of glad to hear her say that in hindsight she didn't really love it. Anyway, I tried to be open-minded and am curious about other fans opinions. I'll add that I actually had shown the Russian Test Skates/Japan Open version to a few non-skating friends and I got a range of reactions. Some did feel like it was too soon/poor taste, but others had some good opinions that they felt the bigger problem was interpretation of the pain.

I ultimately wasn't offended, just thought some of it was tacky. Cut the miming/sound effects and it would've been fine, imo. The music and story was beautiful and would've carried her program just fine without real sound effects from 9/11. I mean, has anyone listened closely to them? People screaming? Frantic dispatchers? Rescue workers racing to the scene? (and tragically for many of them, to their deaths) George Bush announcing the attack? Art, of course, is the place where we should be tackling difficult subject matter, and I don't have a problem with themes like 9/11, terrorism, or the Holocaust. However, in an already cautious environment like a figure skating competition, they have to be handled with a certain level of depth, maturity, and respect. Something that Averbukh's shallow miming and tasteless sound effects couldn't fully achieve for me, personally. On top of this, I think it's telling that Evgenia wasn't really jazzed about this program and an athlete should never be made to skate to a program like this without fully being immersed in it's message. They're not little puppets, existing to satisfy the musings of their coach/choreographer.

OT edit: There's a documentary called 102 Minutes That Changed America. It's a collection of live footage and camera recordings from eye-witnesses that perfectly sums up the horror and devastation of that day.

 

[SkySkater]

Personally it was my least favourite of her free skate as for me Anna Karenina will always be very special and I love her charm in W.E whilst I think this one isn't as good. As well for me as a British person watching it now I can't like it that much considering the impact that things like the Manchester Bombing and London Bridge Attrack had on me and whilst I know that these happened after she would have finished skating this program as they were both during the summer because I only watched it this year having those events in my mind kind of tainted my appreciation of the program. However, it was a nice enough program to watch and the actual music is very pretty.

 

[Mrs. P]

Well, of course there is always boundary between portraying real feelings through art and calculation (for whatever purpose, money, success, being called artist etc.). If I consider Zhenya's program as a whole, incl. her own contribution, I think that was the first case, not the second. She really portrayed feelings coming form the hard situation (BTW much better way than it was in the movie) of a kid, who is facing reality, and all those voices, records etc. were part of that reality. So from my point of view, it was art, it hed the place in the program. That's why it had pretty strong impression on me. But of course, it is only my personal opinion.

Thank you for sharing your thoughts! I never felt that Zhenya was being calculating/exploitive and did put her heart into it/the performance and storyline, which is why I felt incredibly conflicted with my feelings about it. I could understand on a very basic level why people felt why the choreography was exploitive, cause I think in some ways it was. I tried, at the time, to critique the program because I felt that was separate about how I felt about Evgenia's skating the time.

I ultimately wasn't offended, just thought some of it was tacky. Cut the miming/sound effects and it would've been fine, imo. The music and story was beautiful and would've carried her program just fine without real sound effects from 9/11. I mean, has anyone listened closely to them? People screaming? Frantic dispatchers? Rescue workers racing to the scene? (and tragically for many of them, to their deaths) George Bush announcing the attack? Art, of course, is the place where we should be tackling difficult subject matter, and I don't have a problem with themes like 9/11, terrorism, or the Holocaust. However, in an already cautious environment like a figure skating competition, they have to be handled with a certain level of depth, maturity, and respect. Something that Averbukh's shallow miming and tasteless sound effects couldn't fully achieve for me, personally. On top of this, I think it's telling that Evgenia wasn't really jazzed about this program and an athlete should never be made to skate to a program like this without fully being immersed in it's message. They're not little puppets, existing to satisfy the musings of their coach/choreographer.

OT edit: There's a documentary called 102 Minutes That Changed America. It's a collection of live footage and camera recordings from eye-witnesses and perfectly sums up the horror and devastation of that day.

Thanks for the documentary recommendation! And I do share many of your feelings. The idea of hearing George W, even for a second, in a figure skating competition was not that appealing to me.

I'm just very grateful that she took ownership of her Olympic programs and brought us Anna Karenina. Honestly, that program brought the best of her performance and storytelling. I look forward to see how she explores these aspects in this season's programs.

 

[Fluture]

Personally, I liked the second half of the program a lot more than the first. The voice overs... when I first heard them, I was shocked. It was a mixture of „is she really doing that?“ and admiration at the same time because she was daring. She dared to skate to such a controversial program with controversial music choice and she sold it. I watched the program and after I‘d done that, I watched it again. And again. I still don‘t know how I feel about it. I find it incredible and breathtaking and emotional but it also makes me feel uncomfortable in a way no figure skating program has ever made me feel. I seriously and honestly don’t know whether that’s a good thing or not.

The program itself is very, very Averbukh style. I’m one of those who really dislikes him as a person but usually adores his programs. Extremely Loud and Incredibly Close reminded me a bit of Yulia Lipnitskaya‘s Schindler‘s List program from the Olympics. A very sensitive topic interpreted by a very young skater. I still feel that Yulia‘s program was more subtle than Evgenia‘s and that‘s probably why I never had any problems of loving it and simply feeling absorbed and moved watching it. With Zhenya‘s... it feels a bit much. A bit forced in a way (even though that‘s a hard word), as if he was trying too hard to send a message in creating this program.

 

[Orlov]

So can I toss something at you guys?

What did you guys think of her Extremely Loud and Incredibly Close program from the 2016-2017 season? I had a really hard time with it because I am American and the step sequence with all the voiceovers brought back bad memories of Sept. 11 (I was in college and had to write about how it affected students on campus). I know it was an Averbach-driven program, but it was hard to watch especially after her exquisite W.E. free skate, which remains one of my favorites from her.

Honestly, the storyline worked and the music was beautiful and I feel like she could have pulled off the story without the voiceovers (though I'm not sure what you would put there instead). I also think that the step sequence was a bit of a crutch from her truly being able to interpret the music the piece.

I'm kind of glad to hear her say that in hindsight she didn't really love it. Anyway, I tried to be open-minded and am curious about other fans opinions. I'll add that I actually had shown the Russian Test Skates/Japan Open version to a few non-skating friends and I got a range of reactions. Some did feel like it was too soon/poor taste, but others had some good opinions that they felt the bigger problem was interpretation of the pain.

I already wrote on this forum that FS first appeared in my life after accidentally watching exactly this video in 2017. I did not know about Zhenya before. And I had a reaction like John Preston (from "Equilibrium") - it was the most beautiful and heartbreaking thing that I saw in my entiry life. Yes, I understand reaction of Americans, but it's also telling others about this sad page of your story, tbh, all I knew about this before - it's one paragraph from the history textbook, sorry. After watching this video, I read Wikipedia, i had sadness and empathy. I hope this will partially justify this program in your eyes.

For me, it is also important that Eteri survived in Oklahoma City bombing in 1995. (Yes, Averbukh is choreographer, but we know that Eteri also responsible for the accents and emotional content). Even 20 years later, she remembered (there are eng sub) the exact time of the attack - "it was 9.04". When she said in an interview - "...you open your eyes and become looking around, but world has just changed around you. Everying is different." - I remembered how the feeling of irreversibility literally fell on me somewhere in the middle of Zhenya's program. Ughh... my english is bad and it's hard for me to express my thought properly. I want to say that Eteri is not some kind of casual person without respect and without memories. For me, it's important. Sorry, if I was inappropriate or hurt feelings.

 

[scotsworth]

So can I toss something at you guys?

What did you guys think of her Extremely Loud and Incredibly Close program from the 2016-2017 season? I had a really hard time with it because I am American and the step sequence with all the voiceovers brought back bad memories of Sept. 11 (I was in college and had to write about how it affected students on campus). I know it was an Averbukh-driven program, but it was hard to watch especially after her exquisite W.E. free skate, which remains one of my favorites from her.

Honestly, the storyline worked and the music was beautiful and I feel like she could have pulled off the story without the voiceovers (though I'm not sure what you would put there instead). I also think that the step sequence was a bit of a crutch from her truly being able to interpret the music the piece.

I'm kind of glad to hear her say that in hindsight she didn't really love it. Anyway, I tried to be open-minded and am curious about other fans opinions. I'll add that I actually had shown the Russian Test Skates/Japan Open version to a few non-skating friends and I got a range of reactions. Some did feel like it was too soon/poor taste, but others had some good opinions that they felt the bigger problem was interpretation of the pain.

Zhenya herself said in a recent interview she didn't really like the program at first, but that it grew on her and she appreciated how much success she had with it.

To me, it really skated (no pun intended) close to a line of artistic versus tacky.... too close for comfort. I think the problem in figure skating is Zhenya was competing under the banner of Russia with a program heavily featuring a national tragedy from another country (not her own). That's why the American ladies in particular (Ashley Wagner I think specifically) really didn't like it. And I can understand that.

Plus, the fact that the main people behind the program were like "it's not about 9/11" actually made it a bit worse for me... because it seems careless to take audio directly from such a huge event and then claim that the message of the program isn't about it. Starts to feel exploitive in a way... like you're using the tragedy for the emotional weight it gives the performance but then saying "yeah but it's not about that"

It was beautiful, and clearly a fantastic program, but not one I think Zhenya would have chosen herself had she had full control. Personally, I'm happy it's in the past.

 

[glassanimal]

I already wrote on this forum that FS first appeared in my life after accidentally watching exactly this video in 2017. I did not know about Zhenya before. And I had a reaction like John Preston (from "Equilibrium") - it was the most beautiful and sad thing that I saw in my all life. Yes, I understand reaction of Americans, but it's also telling others about this sad page of your story, tbh, all I knew about this before - it's one paragraph from the history textbook, sorry. After watching this video, I read Wikipedia, i had sadness and empathy. I hope this will partially justify this program in your eyes.

For me, it is also important that Eteri survived in Oklahoma City bombing in 1995. (Yes, Averbukh is choreographer, but we know that Eteri also responsible for the accents and emotional content). Even 20 years later, she remembered (there are eng sub) with the exact time of the attack - "it was 9.04". When she said in an interview - "...you open your eyes and become looking around, but world has just changed around you. Everying is different." - I remembered how the feeling of irreversibility literally fell on me somewhere in the middle of Zhenya's program. Ughh... my english is bad and it's hard for me to express my thought properly. I want to say that Eteri is not some kind of casual person without respect and without memories. For me, it's important. Sorry, if I was inappropriate or hurt feelings.

I hear ya, and I’m glad art and shared experience can connect us all, regardless of where we’re from. Like I said in my previous post, the music, story, and general theme of uncertainty in our world is beautiful; most of the program was fine. It’s just hard to justify the 9/11 sound effects specifically, as the event was horrifyingly devastating, chaotic, and apocalyptic in scale. You wouldn’t see Hanyu skate to a program with actual sound effects of people screaming during the equally apocalyptic 2011 earthquake/tsunami that hit Japan... I love Evgenia, and she definitely sold what she was given. I just disagree with her program’s orchestrators, if you know what I mean.