2018-19 Japanese Ladies' figure skating

[rosy14]

...and in the midst of this discussion Rika's PCS just plummeted as low as 64.48 at the Challenge Cup even with a clean skate with one 3A. Judges are weird creatures.

Actually she didn't have a clean skate: she went for the 2a, ok, she had un underrotated tripleT in the combo, but above all she made a big mistake on the second spin. So the PCS, which were however the highets, were more or less fair (well, not those by the American judge).

 

[Nocturne]

Actually she didn't have a clean skate: she went for the 2a, ok, she had un underrotated tripleT in the combo, but above all she made a big mistake on the second spin. So the PCS, which were however the highets, were more or less fair (well, not those by the American judge).

I think you are a bit mistaken here. Champs was stating Rika's PCS of the free skate in which she was really almost clean (except an UR on the 2L on her 3-jump-combination), but you are talking about her mistakes in the SP. Rika tried the 3A in warm ups and landed 2 so she did not intentionally go for the 2A in the SP.

Besides, she didnt get the highest PCS in either segment because Wakaba got more PCS in both SP and LP. Rika was seemingly clean so I think 64 is really way too low. But it was a challenge cup in which scores tend to not get so high. It was alright.

 

[champs]

You can't always trust PCS at Senior Bs because they artificially set the ceiling lower. See: Satoko's PCS at Bavarian Open.

As if to say PCS at the major comps make sense and are any more authentic

 

[champs]

I think you are a bit mistaken here. Champs was stating Rika's PCS of the free skate in which she was really almost clean (except an UR on the 2L on her 3-jump-combination), but you are talking about her mistakes in the SP. Rika tried the 3A in warm ups and landed 2 so she did not intentionally go for the 2A in the SP.

Besides, she didnt get the highest PCS in either segment because Wakaba got more PCS in both SP and LP. Rika was seemingly clean so I think 64 is really way too low. But it was a challenge cup in which scores tend to not get so high. It was alright.

Yep, thanks for the clarification. Btw "clean" in the context of figure skating is never clearly defined and I use it in a very vague manner anyway.

 

[lzxnl]

As if to say PCS at the major comps make sense and are any more authentic

Well, the PCS at the major competitions are what determines results at major competitions, so I guess they're a better predictor of Worlds results?

 

[zanadude]

I personally think it is rather pointless to discuss who is the most naturally talented, when all of them reached a level at which talent alone isnt enough anymore.

I dosagree. Some skaters will never have a quad or triple axel no matter how much they try, because they simply lack the ability to physically do such a jump.

 

[lzxnl]

I dosagree. Some skaters will never have a quad or triple axel no matter how much they try, because they simply lack the ability to physically do such a jump.

How do you distinguish between physical ability and talent?

 

[sk8ath]

I dosagree. Some skaters will never have a quad or triple axel no matter how much they try, because they simply lack the ability to physically do such a jump.

Even some of them are capable with jumping difficult jumps, they may be not able to do so due to their training conditions and lack of resources.
You know some top ladies in Japan even don't have a real home rink...

 

[zanadude]

How do you distinguish between physical ability and talent?

Might be easier to use a different sport to illustrate.

Dribbling a basketball takes talent. Through hard work, someone without talent may come to do it well, but not as well as someone with talent that puts in the same amount of work.

Palming a basketball with one hand takes physical ability. Your hand is either big enough to do it, or it's not. No amount of training will change that.

 

[CanadianSkaterGuy]

Well, the PCS at the major competitions are what determines results at major competitions, so I guess they're a better predictor of Worlds results?

Rather ironic that the senior Bs have more sensible down to earth scoring. Remember when the top skaters going clean got 8.5/9.0s? Now it's like, "oh you fell twice? Okay, fine... I'll give that a 9.25!"

Same with overly generous GOE - oh you stepped out of that jump or stumbled in your footwork? Fine, just a +1/+2 then.

 

[lzxnl]

Rather ironic that the senior Bs have more sensible down to earth scoring. Remember when the top skaters going clean got 8.5/9.0s? Now it's like, "oh you fell twice? Okay, fine... I'll give that a 9.25!"

Same with overly generous GOE - oh you stepped out of that jump or stumbled in your footwork? Fine, just a +1/+2 then.

I don't think you can really say CC was that realistic with scoring, at least technically. The two URs called on Rika, I cannot see them. Then, Rika didn't even make any mistakes (aside from a wobbly spin) and got a 64 PCS, whereas Wakaba had one jump combination and popped a 3F and got higher. I'm sure those classify as serious mistakes disrupting the flow of the program (you have less jumps...)

 

[katymay]

I would say Wakaba is superior in both aspects. Wakaba is faster and more powerful with quicker feet and better upper body control and natural rhythm. Right now Kihira is basically Mei Mihara with a 3A, which isn't a bad thing btw. This year Wakaba has been dealing with injuries and had a terrible year so it doesn't really matter right now. But at Worlds if all 3 Japanese ladies are clean and Rika doesn't do any 3A, It would be Satoko, Kaori, then Rika in that order and I doubt you would argue that.

Once upon a time I was sure Wakaba would win the Olympics. Huge jumps, massive speed. A Midori Ito type athlete. She has had some brilliant skates, I wish she would find her way back to those brilliant moments. It is sad to see what should have been.

 

[rikaquegira]

So... Wakaba is the first alternate for Worlds???
I adore her but isn't she injured and like, not doing well this season at all? Why isn't Mihara the first alternate?? god forbid one of the three Ladies can't make it to Worlds, I would trust Mihara more at this point.

also Kaori is out there doing not one, not two, not three, not four... but TEN double axels back to back! (she does seven without anything between the jumps, amazing!)


https://twitter.com/sy25031232/status/1100347512437714945?s=20


oh, this is from Benoit Richaud's Instagram story so they're working on the choreo, probably. He also posted a video of her choreosq, they didn't change anything, not that I noticed. But good to know they're working on the program, any minor change can make a great difference ie. changes in expression, commitment, little improvements here and there... very important!

also, Rika will be back to Colarado camp, I think she'll spend a week or so there. Probably will work with Tom Dickson on her FS again? I hope so!

 

[Baron Vladimir]

Rather ironic that the senior Bs have more sensible down to earth scoring. Remember when the top skaters going clean got 8.5/9.0s? Now it's like, "oh you fell twice? Okay, fine... I'll give that a 9.25!"

Same with overly generous GOE - oh you stepped out of that jump or stumbled in your footwork? Fine, just a +1/+2 then.

It is because B competitions starting point is on a lower level on the scale, so even when scoring goes up it ends on a bit lower level, comparing to the competitions where starting point is higher. General expectations of B competitions is lower and that influence the judging in general. Its a typical problem in judging/scoring of every other humans work tho.

 

[mermaidfestavol3]

So... Wakaba is the first alternate for Worlds???
I adore her but isn't she injured and like, not doing well this season at all? Why isn't Mihara the first alternate?? god forbid one of the three Ladies can't make it to Worlds, I would trust Mihara more at this point.

also Kaori is out there doing not one, not two, not three, not four... but TEN double axels back to back! (she does seven without anything between the jumps, amazing!)


https://twitter.com/sy25031232/status/1100347512437714945?s=20


oh, this is from Benoit Richaud's Instagram story so they're working on the choreo, probably. He also posted a video of her choreosq, they didn't change anything, not that I noticed. But good to know they're working on the program, any minor change can make a great difference ie. changes in expression, commitment, little improvements here and there... very important!

also, Rika will be back to Colarado camp, I think she'll spend a week or so there. Probably will work with Tom Dickson on her FS again? I hope so!

Re: alternates I think they are just in alphabetical order on last name.

Re: Kaori I am super excited to see the FS again. I hope that 4CC will motivate her to do the very best she can, I think she could definitely get a medal if she goes perfectly clean (and maybe gets a lenient call on her 3Lz lol)

 

[believed]

So... Wakaba is the first alternate for Worlds???

Isn’t it by alphabetical order?

 

[rikaquegira]

oh, thank god!
my mistake then, sorry!

 

[rikaquegira]

Re: Kaori I am super excited to see the FS again. I hope that 4CC will motivate her to do the very best she can, I think she could definitely get a medal if she goes perfectly clean (and maybe gets a lenient call on her 3Lz lol)

I highly doubt it, they almost always call her lutz, either a ! or a downright edge call(which is fine because it really is a flutz). But I think she can do very well either way. It's the only "bad jump" she has, all of her other jumps are pretty great. :agree:
I think she needs to make sure her levels are all 4 because if everyone skates fairly well, I think it might come down to the details.
Same goes for Rika, especially for Rika even, because she tends to lose level on the StSp and that's something she can't afford if Alina is "clean as whistle" as the British like to say.

 

[malya]

With the russian ladies drama I just had a thought that the japanese fed also had reasons to doubt their worlds assignments.

Satoko did mediocre in Germany and Mai was amazing at the 4CC and maybe might have the better momentum.

I'm glad they didn't and don't think they have any reason to
Japan will get 3 spots and medal(s?) with any lineup.

 

[rikaquegira]

With the russian ladies drama I just had a thought that the japanese fed also had reasons to doubt their worlds assignments.

Satoko did mediocre in Germany and Mai was amazing at the 4CC and maybe might have the better momentum.

I'm glad they didn't and don't think they have any reason to
Japan will get 3 spots and medal(s?) with any lineup.

There's no way they're not sending Satoko, unless she's injured she'll be there and will most probably deliver. Satoko had been a Fed favorite for a while now.
The way I see it now Satoko's no longer Japan number 1(that's Rika) and not even number 2(that's Kaori) but she's still a strong number 3 until further notice.
Mai, as always, is number 4. :hopelessness:

But yeah, thank god Japan's situation is much less complicated. It's not complicated at all, actually. Rika is internationally unbeaten, Kaori is National Champion and did very well at the GP, Satoko also did well and is National bronze medalist. The only one who could've complicated the decision for Worlds this season was Wakaba but she got injured and had a tough season. Mai continues to be consistently unlucky and always an "almossssst got it" case. So the decision is pretty straight-forward.
No more 2018 Olympic team nightmares.