2018-19 Russian Ladies' figure skating

[oatmella]

Liza has proven she is a strong competitor internationally - she medaled at GPF among the top ladies that will be at Worlds! Doesn't seem that GPF is taken much into consideration here, but it wasn't *that* long ago.

 

[Lechat]

Liza has proven she is a strong competitor internationally - she medaled at GPF among the top ladies that will be at Worlds! Doesn't seem that GPF is taken much into consideration here, but it wasn't *that* long ago.

Agree, because she failed to qualify at one competition, they pulled her out of the team when zhenia failed so many times. It’s not like she had a meltdown and honestly 1,75 of difference is a joke.

 

[randomfan]

To those who are saying that Liza needs better programs, let me just point out that Evgenia’s programs aren’t exactly great either. Her Tosca SP is decent but there really could be much more going on in the program as a whole (aka no wow factor). Orange Colored Sky had so much potential and she shouldn’t have dropped it IMO (even if portraying the character was difficult at the time). As for the Tango FS, the step sequence is the only part that’s truly good. The rest of it is very dull and the choreography has nothing special. As for Liza, her SP isn’t good either, but at least her FS is entertaining and compliments the music very well. But I guess none of this really matters since Evgenia has the reputation and the clear PCS cushion

Anyways, I’m really disappointed to see that the decision turned out to be this. Liza deserved that spot much more than anyone else (even Evgenia said so), and choosing her clearly would’ve caused the least amount of outcry. While I’m glad that Evgenia will be at Worlds after the rough season she had, I wish the outcome was different...

 

[sunn1ly]

Poor Liza, she deserves to be at worlds this season, this is totally not fair. This is ridiculous, beating some of the strongest competitors and medaling at GP final isn't prove enough . Shame on the coaches who voted her out .

 

[Alexz]

Oh, boy.. sad for Liza.

 

[Lechat]

this makes the decision to leave liza off the team more understandable. i'm sure rusfed wants a win even if their highest scorers have been inconsistent they'll want to do everything they can to keep rika's PCs down

Zhenia beating Rika, are they serious ? Rika wasn’t at her best at GP France but still win when zhenia wasn't on the podium and Liza made the podium twice against Rika.

 

[sx98423]

Zhenia beating Rika, are they serious ? Rika wasn’t at her best at GP France but still win when zhenia wasn't on the podium and Liza made the podium twice against Rika.

No alina is the only who could possibly beat rika if she makes a mistake on the 3A. If zhenya pushes rika out if the last group it could lower rika's PCs. But I guess she got the points to start in the last group from her challenger so the decision to send zhenya doesn't really make sense

 

[Fluture]

Zhenia beating Rika, are they serious ? Rika wasn’t at her best at GP France but still win when zhenia wasn't on the podium and Liza made the podium twice against Rika.

I don‘t think anyone is suggesting that Zhenya could beat Rika. I love her but this isn‘t realistical. She is improving but this is still a transitional season and besides that, Rika has some of the most difficult technical content and her PCS are quickly catching up. I doubt Liza could have beaten her either. Alina is their best bet to do that but she needs to at least skate like she did at the GPF and Rika needs to make some mistakes. I think she‘s totally capable of doing that. It will depend on how Rika skates her SP, truly because Alina can gain a significant advantage there.

 

[Skater Boy]

To those who are saying that Liza needs better programs, let me just point out that Evgenia’s programs aren’t exactly great either. Her Tosca SP is decent but there really could be much more going on in the program as a whole (aka no wow factor). Orange Colored Sky had so much potential and she shouldn’t have dropped it IMO (even if portraying the character was difficult at the time). As for the Tango FS, the step sequence is the only part that’s truly good. The rest of it is very dull and the choreography has nothing special. As for Liza, her SP isn’t good either, but at least her FS is entertaining and compliments the music very well. But I guess none of this really matters since Evgenia has the reputation and the clear PCS cushion

Anyways, I’m really disappointed to see that the decision turned out to be this. Liza deserved that spot much more than anyone else (even Evgenia said so), and choosing her clearly would’ve caused the least amount of outcry. While I’m glad that Evgenia will be at Worlds after the rough season she had, I wish the outcome was different...

I hear you. The word deserve can mean so much. I mean on this year's skates I agree Liza. And battling back from being pushed off the team so to speak but the teenage sensations much like Evgenia. But arguably Evgenia deserved OGM - I know lots will disagree but she was dominant then an unfortunate injury. ONe can argue she deserve the top spot. Oddly Russia is so vulnerable; anything could happen to their ladies. They do not have a 2016 or 2017 Evgenia or 2015 Liza who were so dominant.

 

[andromache]

I like Urmanov's take on the decision.

“I understand that the current Russian Cup final was held in order to view three of our athletes at one start - Evgeny Medvedev, Elizabeth Tuktamyshev and Stanislav Konstantinov. And as far as we all know, Medvedev won this tournament. thus it was determined. I see it this way, "said Urmanov.
https://tass.ru/sport/6165829​

This would feel more honest from the federation if they didn't wait a few days after the competition to announce it, unfortunately.

 

[malya]

//from a russian standpoint

Plushenko on 'the choice': he didn't watch so he can't say but the council only does fair decisions.

-> hmm. Mishins 50 year coaching celebration will be lit.

Alina Zagitova also gave an Interview and said she is training normally.


Main opinions among FS fans in russia:

- how currupt is RusFed
- how evil are a select few supporting this
- I always supported every russian athlete, this is the first time that I don't...

My opinion: The goal of this media campain against Alina was to prove this season that she wasn't a deserving winner of the OGM but just a kid coming up and snatching it by luck. Russian speakers were not much for the constant opinions about this but the social media movement led by an very very influencial blogger seems to have pushed the narrative to some people thinking this is a fanw*r against evil Eteri or something.

In an recent Interview where it was strongly suggested there 'could be injuries' this is used to create the new narrative of Tukt vs Alina. Tukt deserves to go, Alina who is shaky needs to prove something yet again.

Some people are trying to promote another *skate off* to maybe sub Tukt and pushing Alina's supposed injury. Why? In a skate off in russia even in a private setting there would be the right people there to try everything Alina bombs again.

Disclaimer: some people /= important people in RusFed or russian FS just bs trying to start a narrative.

//as always: heard something else? Don't believe everybody brainlessly. You can check even the 't*xic' Sports.Ru with google translate. Russian fans are not ev*l.

 

[Arbitrary]

Zhenia beating Rika, are they serious ? Rika wasn’t at her best at GP France but still win when zhenia wasn't on the podium and Liza made the podium twice against Rika.

Easy. If Kihira WD for a reason.

 

[Vandevska]

Interesting interviews with Sergei Dudakov and Anna Pogorilaya:
https://fs-gossips.com/sergei-dudak...28CytFlMuZbyXwqVN52BL2AelIbeawUqs9U_xgJek9JYM

https://fs-gossips.com/anna-pogoril...rt-than-medvedeva-is-1st-tuktamysheva-is-2nd/

 

[oatmella]

I hear you. The word deserve can mean so much. I mean on this year's skates I agree Liza. And battling back from being pushed off the team so to speak but the teenage sensations much like Evgenia. But arguably Evgenia deserved OGM - I know lots will disagree but she was dominant then an unfortunate injury. ONe can argue she deserve the top spot. Oddly Russia is so vulnerable; anything could happen to their ladies. They do not have a 2016 or 2017 Evgenia or 2015 Liza who were so dominant.

Evgenia deserving OGM because of her dominance prior to injury doesn't seem like a good argument.

Actually still don't get the reputation/PCS cushion argument either. Liza did very well on the GP series, with international judging! Sure, Evgenia could potentially have a high score with clean, perfectly executed programs - but we have no evidence or examples from this season. And her PCS cushion is not so high that she can make mistakes and still beat the top competitors - this was was also proven on the GP/ACI.

 

[kwanatic]

I disagree. Liza’s base value and the GOE potential is much higher. Not sure if Evgenia’s component score could compensate for that. Moreover, EM’s current’s programs are less complicated in terms of transitions and entries than in the past, and the program is also part of the component score. Her spins have visibly detereorates as well.

I can accept all kinds of arguments and I wish EM well, but lets not pretend that Salchow and Toeloop are better weapons against Rika than Liza’s 3A and gorgeous Lutz.

Even with a clean skate I can’t see her win against a clean Liza in an international competition...

We're talking about a clean Evgenia Medvedeva who, with that same little 3S-3T combo, has scored (on a low average) 220+ total points for 3 seasons in a row prior to last fall. I'm wondering where y'all have been for the past couple of years...

No, Evgenia hasn't been skating nearly as well this season but if she were to have resurgent performances at worlds after having struggled this season, the judges would most definitely score her the way she used to be scored or at least very close to it which would likely eclipse everyone but Rika.

Liza T on the other hand has scored over 220 once in her career...at the Cup event she just completed in Russia. If you take her two highest scores from the season (76.17 - NHK, 144.67 - GPF) you get a total of 220.84. Maybe give her a point or two for being clean puts her around a max score of 223+ which Evgenia has surpassed at least a dozen times (I'm not exaggerating, look it up). Liza's jumps are amazing but her spins, steps and PCS are not in the same league as other top competitors and never have been. Plus Evgenia has a zillion more reputation points than Liza has and, as unfair as that is, it really does make a difference in this sport which relies so heavily on reputation scoring.

Do I think it's likely Evgenia will deliver two clean performances like she used to at worlds this year? No. Do I think Liza was the safer choice this year? Yes. Only time will tell if the RusFed made the right choice or not...

 

[Arbitrary]

//from a russian standpoint

- how currupt is RusFed

Not too much. Say, the local police is openly considered much more corrupted.

I have another possible reason to prefer MED vs TUKT. MED is still younger.
Not that it will help but if she does everything she can at the top level, she may finish among first 8-10 places. May be just enough for three slots.
But even single slightest misfortune in SP and she in the pen-ultimate FP group or worse. Bye-bye third slot.

Personally I have nothing against Samodurova. I just don't see her above 11th place at the WC. She was very lucky at EC but the luck is short tempered.

And... having both MED & ZAGI means much more pressure on both of them. They may pretend anything but they cannot tolerate be close one to another. And RusFed may apply a small administrative pressure as usual but only for one of them.

SP is critical, but the starting position is even more. If ZAGI skates SP before MED and succeeded, MED may pop everything. And vice versa.
All of them are mentally unstable with those circumstances.

 

[oatmella]

I'm not sure prior dominance, even if it was for years - is that relevant here or in other situations.

We haven't seen clean Evgenia in over a year anyways.

 

[Arbitrary]

I'm not sure prior dominance, even if it was for years - is that relevant here or in other situations.

We haven't seen clean Evgenia in over a year anyways.

When she crashed at the RusCup FP it looked bad. Her knee was beaten bad and the stockings were teared open. It happened I watched LIVE and was sure for a moment she's in no condition to continue.
She hardly stood up quckly enough to continue.

 

[anonymoose_au]

Utterly devastated for Liza.

I don't know if I can even watch the Ladies competition at Worlds knowing she's at home.

The Russian Figure Skating Fed is the WORST.

 

[rlopen]

Not too much. Say, the local police is openly considered much more corrupted.

I have another possible reason to prefer MED vs TUKT. MED is still younger.
Not that it will help but if she does everything she can at the top level, she may finish among first 8-10 places. May be just enough for three slots.
But even single slightest misfortune in SP and she in the pen-ultimate FP group or worse. Bye-bye third slot.

Personally I have nothing against Samodurova. I just don't see her above 11th place at the WC. She was very lucky at EC but the luck is short tempered.

And... having both MED & ZAGI means much more pressure on both of them. They may pretend anything but they cannot tolerate be close one to another. And RusFed may apply a small administrative pressure as usual but only for one of them.

SP is critical, but the starting position is even more. If ZAGI skates SP before MED and succeeded, MED may pop everything. And vice versa.
All of them are mentally unstable with those circumstances.

Huh? Y’all really hate Samodurova that much? If she goes clean (which she essentially has since the GP started) she should get a score in the 210’s which should put her at the very least in the top 8 unless everyone goes super clean and has the performances of their life. Honestly she probably is the safest pick out of Medvedeva, Zagitova, and her. Zagitova should also place (at worst) in the top 10 even if she has a super terrible skate. And if she doesn’t...well she’s a lock for a medal. But Samodurova is almost a guaranteed top 8 spot at World. Now it’s up to one of Med/Zagitova to place in the top 5. One of them has to go clean. (Watch now that I say that Evgenia and Alina go 1 and 2 and Samodurova places out of the top 15.)