2019-20 U.S. Men's Figure Skating

[1111bm]

Congratulations Nathan on winning the Free and taking the gold Medal in France.

Also, loosely related to Nathan's "dubious" scoring at this event: Psst, Shoma's first two jumps both had a full on two-hands-down, head-and-upper-body-bent-over plus step-out mistake, and none of them were called as a fall... but don't tell anyone!

(which is not to say, that I was not utterly heartbroken after Shoma's performance and seeing the state he was in )

 

[mrrice]

Also, loosely related to Nathan's "dubious" scoring at this event: Psst, Shoma's first two jumps both had a full on two-hands-down, head-and-upper-body-bent-over plus step-out mistake, and none of them were called as a fall... but don't tell anyone!

(which is not to say, that I was not utterly heartbroken after his performance and seeing the state he was in )

I haven't said this in a while but...…..KABOOM!!!!!!

 

[discode]

Yeah, wasn't a fall and it's honestly not like it mattered in the end when he won by over 30 points.

Congrats to Nathan and Tomoki.

 

[karne]

The fact that Hanyu and Brown are also constantly overscored is not relevant.

Unclear how anyone could possibly think that Jason is overscored when they go and give Chen four points more PCS than him.

You might not like Nathan, but it isnt a fall. Body is not on the ground and weight was not actually there. He went and skated like it was nothing after the jump.

It is not a fall. Get over it or write a letter to the ISU for your complaint.

Thank you!!!

Well, I hate to break it to you all, but, from the Special Regulations and Technical Rules for Singles, Pairs and Ice Dance:

A Fall is defined as loss of control by a Skater with the result that the majority of his/her own body weight is on the ice supported by any other
part of the body other than the blades e.g. hand(s), knee(s), back, buttock(s) or any part of the arm. For every Fall there shall be a deduction (see Rule 353, paragraph 1.n).

 

[century2009]

Unclear how anyone could possibly think that Jason is overscored when they go and give Chen four points more PCS than him.







Well, I hate to break it to you all, but, from the Special Regulations and Technical Rules for Singles, Pairs and Ice Dance:

Omg. Move on. It is NOT a fall. You dont like Nathan but if Jason, it is ok. We got it. Go write a letter to the ISU about it.

 

[karne]

Omg. Move on. It is NOT a fall. You dont like Nathan but if Jason, it is ok. We got it. Go write a letter to the ISU about it.

Where was Jason ever mentioned in the original conversation? He was not. Someone posted the screengrab of Nathan and said it was a fall. You said it was not a fall (and later made a completely erroneous explanation as to why). I pointed out that according to the rulebook it was. Someone else then flew off the handle and posted screengrabs of Hanyu and Jason.

I live in an opposite timezone to you and sometimes don't get back to conversations here until what seems like some time later. I have provided the excerpt from the rulebook but this somehow translates to my hating Nathan but wanting exceptions made to the rules for Jason.

 

[Mathman]

You dont like Nathan ...

Karne likes Nathan. :yes:

 

[doublequad]

It's a fall. Read the damn handbook.

A Fall is defined as loss of control by a Skater with the result that the majority of his/her own body weight is on the ice supported by any other
part of the body other than the blades e.g. hand(s), knee(s), back, buttock(s) or any part of the arm. For every Fall there shall be a deduction (see Rule 353, paragraph 1.n).

But then again, everything in the handbook is just about ignored, so it doesn't matter either way re the actual scores

 

[alexaa]

Karne likes Nathan. :yes:

Is this a joke???

In this post, which of Nathan’s SA program is jump to jump?
And in other post insisting on a turn out as a step out and demanded a -3 or -4 deduction?

Because when you're getting ninety-****ing-four PCS for skating jump to jump then having a fun ChSq anyway, why bother?

 

[el henry]

I don't know if Nathan's stumble was a fall. He would have won anyway, so I'm not getting upset about it, although I would like to see rulebooks applied correctly.

I have disagreed with opinions about Jason. I cannot remember ever saying to a poster "Oh you just say that because you're a Nathan fan" or saying to a Nathan fan, as was said here about Jason, "Of course it's OK if it's Nathan".

Those statements do nothing to support an argument, in my opinion.

 

[Hyena]

I think you could interpret it as a fall, just like you could have interpreted Alina Zagitova's error on the 3Lz as a fall. But it wasn't called as such in either case, it would have made the difference of a couple points tops (-1 deduction, possibly lower GOE than they already got?), placements are still correct, and the world turns on for all.

 

[IcyMathStats]

And doing so while being a full-time enrolled student in a highly demanding academic program unrelated to sports. Is there a precedent of a skater with such a long winning streak under similar circumstances?

Congratulations Nathan on winning the Free and taking the gold Medal in France.

 

[Tavi...]

And doing so while being a full-time enrolled student in a highly demanding academic program unrelated to sports. Is there a precedent of a skater with such a long winning streak under similar circumstances?

As a full time Harvard student, Dick Button won 4 US and 4 World titles (every year between 1949-52) and won his second Olympic title in 1952.

 

[TontoK]

I don't know if Nathan's stumble was a fall. He would have won anyway, so I'm not getting upset about it, although I would like to see rulebooks applied correctly.

I have disagreed with opinions about Jason. I cannot remember ever saying to a poster "Oh you just say that because you're a Nathan fan" or saying to a Nathan fan, as was said here about Jason, "Of course it's OK if it's Nathan".

Those statements do nothing to support an argument, in my opinion.

Solid post.

IMO: Nathan should have been dinged with a fall. And so should others who were not.

Jason has absolutely nothing to do with this conversation, so long as we're talking IDF.

Connected: The judging of this event was extremely inconsistent. I noticed it during the SP's. The men got away with murder in terms of uncalled <. Not to pick on a guy when he's down, but Shoma's 3A in the short was an obvious downgrade, and it didn't even merit a <. The judging of the women however, was very, very strict.

Personally, I prefer a strict panel. But, more than that, I prefer consistency of the panel, especially within the same event.

 

[IcyMathStats]

As a full time Harvard student, Dick Button won 4 US and 4 World titles (every year between 1949-52) and won his second Olympic title in 1952.

Thanks Tavi. I'm beyond impressed. Once again, Harvard beats Yale.

:agree:

 

[1111bm]

Omg people, if you look at the protocols from IDF and compare the mistakes skaters such as Nathan, Shoma or Samarin had on some of their landings (and also look at some other competitions from the past) it is clear that the tech panel takes some leeway with how they interpret the regulations and technical rules regarding falls.

Like at IDF they clearly drew the line at 'blades are not touching the ice anymore/knee on the ice' which is why Samarin's tumble on his 3Lz was called as a fall, Shoma's and Nathan's didn't. It's as simple as that.

When some people feel the need to constantly point out every call or scoring, that they find questionable, whenever Nathan is concerned (what a coincidence!), but choose to be quiet or don't recognise whenever other skaters benefit from similar calls/scoring... I think it's clear there's bias and resentment behind such behaviour...

 

[1111bm]

A Fall is defined as loss of control by a Skater with the result that the majority of his/her own body weight is on the ice supported by any other
part of the body other than the blades e.g. hand(s), knee(s), back, buttock(s) or any part of the arm. For every Fall there shall be a deduction (see Rule 353, paragraph 1.n).

I knew this part, but I've never quite understood that description, because going by that, many hand down situations on landings should count as a fall, because there's often at least a split second where that definition applies, at least in the more severe cases, yet you never see them call it as such. :think:

 

[el henry]

Omg people, if you look at the protocols from IDF and compare the mistakes skaters such as Nathan, Shoma or Samarin had on some of their landings (and also look at some other competitions from the past) it is clear that the tech panel takes some leeway with how they interpret the regulations and technical rules regarding falls.

Like at IDF they clearly drew the line at 'blades are not touching the ice anymore/knee on the ice' which is why Samarin's tumble on his 3Lz was called as a fall, Shoma's and Nathan's didn't. It's as simple as that.

When some people feel the need to constantly point out every call or scoring, that they find questionable, whenever Nathan is concerned (what a coincidence!), but choose to be quiet or don't recognise whenever other skaters benefit from similar calls/scoring... I think it's clear there's bias and resentment behind such behaviour...

Can you tell me who are “some people”? Because I have pointed out scores or calls that I find questionable with many skaters, I would like to know if I am included in “some people”, since I have not found my opinions, or those of many here, based on bias and resentment.

It’s difficult to answer when you don’t know the reference. Thanks.

 

[CanadianSkaterGuy]

Karne likes Nathan. :yes:

 

[el henry]

Congratulations to Andrew Torgashev (silver) and Ryan Dunk (bronze) for their placements at the Asian Open, a Challenger event

https://usfigureskatingfanzone.com/...-asian-open-team-usa-competition-central.aspx

Long Program protocols

If anyone finds videos of Andrew T., I will be forever grateful