2020-21 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating

[NadezhdaNadya]

I am just going to say that Veronika's 4T is the best quad I have ever seen so far from a ladies skater. Much better than Tuktamysheva's 4T which was also not pre-rotated.
Also, I am happy that Rozanov left Eteri's team, because now we can see him more often. No more Shadowland for the most handsome man in Russia! I guess he will be at all competitions with Alyona, Alexandra and Veronika. So more videos of him, more pictures of him and maybe even an interview! In Russian or English it does not matter.

 

[IndiaP12]

I am just going to say that Veronika's 4T is the best quad I have ever seen so far from a ladies skater.

Well, to be honest it’s not that aesthetic, her landing is turned in and bumpy - unlike for example Trusova’s which is always smooth and extended. But Veronika has the textbook takeoff technique and the cool entry

 

[Skatesocs]

I'm insulted that someone can possibly think Muravyova's mess was by Lori Nichol.

 

[dhjh811]

I am just going to say that Veronika's 4T is the best quad I have ever seen so far from a ladies skater. Much better than Tuktamysheva's 4T which was also not pre-rotated.
Also, I am happy that Rozanov left Eteri's team, because now we can see him more often. No more Shadowland for the most handsome man in Russia! I guess he will be at all competitions with Alyona, Alexandra and Veronika. So more videos of him, more pictures of him and maybe even an interview! In Russian or English it does not matter.

If she could have a smoother landing, it would be the best quad toe so far from ladies. She does not telegraph the jump at all, which is really surprising. Even a lot of men take their time before doing quads, but she goes into it as if it were a triple jump. I thought she was going to do a triple flip and was surprised when she landed a quad. Her technique on the quad toe is so clean, as is her technique for all jumps. It is so refreshing to not see massive prerotation, it's like I've seen a textbook quad from ladies for the first time. The height is impressive too.

 

[dunffvanstorn]

I'm insulted that someone can possibly think Muravyova's mess was by Lori Nichol.

I thought it was weird when I read it, but Lori choreographed Alysa’s programs, and although Alysa’s programs weren’t bad, Alysa’s skating isn’t as good as the choreography Lori does.

 

[dunffvanstorn]

No one here said that Rozanov is "copying" Eteri programs...
What Flanker pointed out was that it seems, by what we've seen so far, that Rozanov is still heavily influenced by TT style of choreography seeing that even the choices of music are the same as in recent programs by TT skaters, when Rozanov was still a part of that team.
Basically, he either hasn't found his own style as a choreographer (which is fine) or he likes Daniil's work enough to imitate it.

I see similarities in Rozanov’s work and TT’s, and it’s quite obvious why - he learned how to set programs with Eteri.

However, there are some points to take into consideration - Veronika is not the most musical skater, and I see many of her programs’s moments when she’s out of the music where, if she were on the music, the choreography would seem great. Another thing is that her choreography seemed very intricate and fast-paced, and it’s just the beginning of the season. I’m sure her programs will look better by the end of the season.

Many times, the choreographer is blamed when the skater hasn’t reached its peak of stamina during the season. Not every program looks good at its first attempt in competition.

Am I trying to excuse Rozanov for his work with Zhilina and Muravyeva? For me, both skaters had very interesting choreography, but were not fully prepared to deliver it. I can only fully judge it later in the season. I liked his music choices.

And, no, I don’t think he’s imitating Daniil’s type of program that looks the same every time - Zhilina’s SP and FS are absolutely different from each other.

The one choreographer from Pluschenko’s team that I still want to see more from is Mikhailov - he choreographed one of Titova’s programs and it looks really nice.

 

[dunffvanstorn]

Just one more thing I just remembered - TSL is talking about how inappropriate Sweet Dreams is for Veronika.

As I’ve noticed from previous seasons and judgements on “appropriateness”, usually the lyrics of the song are not as clear to the non-native speaker of the language. I had never noticed Sweet Dreams’s lyrics, although I usually sing along with it. The same thing with Big Spender, I just realized it was inappropriate when I watched the musical’s movie. So, to non-native speakers, inappropriateness is not always obvious.

 

[readernick]

The music choices might be interesting, but the choreography (as with Daniil) has seemingly little relationship to the music. It is movement for the sake of points. I don't think Sergei is a great choreographer. I hope Elena starts doing some choreography for that team. I am sure she could be more creative and make choreo that highlights the music and the theme of the program.

 

[Sugar Coated]

Just one more thing I just remembered - TSL is talking about how inappropriate Sweet Dreams is for Veronika.

As I’ve noticed from previous seasons and judgements on “appropriateness”, usually the lyrics of the song are not as clear to the non-native speaker of the language. I had never noticed Sweet Dreams’s lyrics, although I usually sing along with it. The same thing with Big Spender, I just realized it was inappropriate when I watched the musical’s movie. So, to non-native speakers, inappropriateness is not always obvious.

What problem did they have with the lyrics? I actually don’t think the song was meant to be sexually explicit unlike big spender.

 

[lopsilceci]

I also look forward to seeing Elena's choreo.

I'm also curious about how the coaching dynamics will work in that group. Like, will there be a specific task for Elena, Sergey and Plush? Will they all do different things at the same time (as in Team Tut)? Will they each work separately with their own skaters?

 

[brakes]

Two things I still can't get over with time:
- Alina holding back her emotions, unable to celebrate the moment of her Olympic victory and
- these poor kids from Alina's home rink in Izhevsk watching their idol winning and hearing commentator's "it shouldn't be like that" and TAT's disappointed crying. :scowl:

 

[Skatesocs]

TAT's disappointed crying.

 

[lopsilceci]

I see similarities in Rozanov’s work and TT’s, and it’s quite obvious why - he learned how to set programs with Eteri.

However, there are some points to take into consideration - Veronika is not the most musical skater, and I see many of her programs’s moments when she’s out of the music where, if she were on the music, the choreography would seem great. Another thing is that her choreography seemed very intricate and fast-paced, and it’s just the beginning of the season. I’m sure her programs will look better by the end of the season.

Many times, the choreographer is blamed when the skater hasn’t reached its peak of stamina during the season. Not every program looks good at its first attempt in competition.

Am I trying to excuse Rozanov for his work with Zhilina and Muravyeva? For me, both skaters had very interesting choreography, but were not fully prepared to deliver it. I can only fully judge it later in the season. I liked his music choices.

Mmm well, the same thing could be said about any other skater-choreographer pair. Including TT skaters and Daniil.

And, no, I don’t think he’s imitating Daniil’s type of program that looks the same every time - Zhilina’s SP and FS are absolutely different from each other.

I don't know, I mean, we even saw a trademark Daniil 1-second-long-Ina Bauer in Veronika's program.

 

[plushyfan]

You do know that Daria performed Ne Me Quitte Pas first right?

That being said, these three pieces (Samson and Delilah, NMQP, R&J), are all warhorses, and neither Eteri or Plushenko were the first to use them. Plushenko himself skated to Don Quixote, Carmen, Je Suis Malade, Moulin Rouge, Bolero, and Introduction and Rondo Cappricioso, all of which Eteri has used. Does that mean she was copying him also?

Yes, you are right( you forgot the Black Eyes, Adagio , Tosca, Carmina Burana ). It seems Plushenko likes the warhorses likes to use his old musics for the juniors. I would like to see more imaginative ideas from the team.

 

[flanker]

The music drama is a bit irrelevant both sides cause these are not particularly original picks to begin with.

Eteri fans now blame Rozanov for copying, but wasn't there a drama around Romeo & Juliet last month?

Samson & Delilah, Romeo & Juliet,... we've seen hundreds of programs on these music even before Eteri started to get good at coaching, so who cares.

Though like i posted previously i do see the same thought process with the amount of transitions, even not choreographed with the music and with positions not being held cause they give you the points regardless. Yes it does look incredibly rushed, unrefined and sometimes pointless but if it worked for all Tutberidze skaters it should work for Plushenko as well.

What's so hard to understand with
I'm not comparing them
or
he's still under influence IMO. That's said without positive or negative evaluation, just how it appears
which is obviously accepted even by his fans.

Again, it's (not even) funny to be constantly blamed for being "fanatical ET fan" and all that stuff, while being forced to witness how my (and not only my) words are blatantly twisted, words and intentions I didn't say are being put into my mouth and yet it is somehow claimed I'm "promoting aggression here".

 

[anonymoose_au]

Yes, you are right( you forgot the Black Eyes, Adagio , Tosca, Carmina Burana ). It seems Plushenko likes the warhorses likes to use his old musics for the juniors. I would like to see more imaginative ideas from the team.

This is true, I remember wondering sometimes if Plushy just gets out his back catalogue of program music for his students to pick from.

However, I've enjoyed all of Plushy's program music and thankfully he never skated to POTO so at least we're safe from that!

On topic I'm excited for the Test Skates, what's Sasha's SP music? Will Liza T show a quad - and how will the Beilmann go for her? Will Sofia Samudorova be there (I can't remember if she's on the team).

 

[Alex65]

What's so hard to understand with
I'm not comparing them
or
he's still under influence IMO. That's said without positive or negative evaluation, just how it appears
which is obviously accepted even by his fans.

Again, it's (not even) funny to be constantly blamed for being "fanatical ET fan" and all that stuff, while being forced to witness how my (and not only my) words are blatantly twisted, words and intentions I didn't say are being put into my mouth and yet it is somehow claimed I'm "promoting aggression here".

It is so indeed! Pay attention to how often you speak here about your attitude towards the fans of the “other side” in a derogatory manner. "This is complete nonsense" "This is ridiculous" and so on. I don't think that such communication between people is acceptable in principle, unless you are trying to humiliate your opponent. I apologize for the OT.

 

[nussnacker]

It is so indeed! Pay attention to how often you speak here about your attitude towards the fans of the “other side” in a derogatory manner. "This is complete nonsense" "This is ridiculous" and so on. I don't think that such communication between people is acceptable in principle, unless you are trying to humiliate your opponent. I apologize for the OT.

Calling someone a “fanatic” isn’t acceptable too, and it’s an attack of a person and their character, not of their statements. Saying something is ridiculous or nonsense on the other hand isn’t attacking one’s character, it’s an “attack” of an argument. It’s not the first time you called someone a fanatic either.

When claiming moral high ground, try and follow your own principles first. You know the saying about seeing a fly in someone’s eye, right?

 

[flanker]

It is so indeed! Pay attention to how often you speak here about your attitude towards the fans of the “other side” in a derogatory manner. "This is complete nonsense" "This is ridiculous" and so on. I don't think that such communication between people is acceptable in principle, unless you are trying to humiliate your opponent. I apologize for the OT.

So, nothing of that happened, nobody said what I didn't say, nobody (incl. you) speak about "Eteri's fans" like about a herd (aggressive or fanatical, of course), and how often etc. Is it me who comes at every opportunity to claim "this or that skater (who is not accidentally coached by Eteri) fell during the training" or bring other negative claims based on completely unverified sources? Is it me who at the very first sight claims this or that program (of a non-Eteri skater) is so terrible, etc. No, that's not how I speak about other skaters, coaches and teams, but it's wasting of time to explain that over and over. Notice that I speak about people's claims (and when I call something "ridiculous" or "nonsense", I give arguments why I think so), not about people themselves, you strictly aim at me personally without even bothering with the content or giving counterarguments.

 

[flanker]

Calling someone a “fanatic” isn’t acceptable too, and it’s an attack of a person and their character, not of their statements. Saying something is ridiculous or nonsense on the other hand isn’t attacking one’s character, it’s an “attack” of an argument. It’s not the first time you called someone a fanatic either.

When claiming moral high ground, try and follow your own principles first. You know the saying about seeing a fly in someone’s eye, right?

Thank you.