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- Jun 27, 2012
Yes. This is true. But they have some chats before those weren't shared. Interesting Alina follows Rudkovskaya even right now .
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2020-21 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating
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Yes. This is true. But they have some chats before those weren't shared. Interesting Alina follows Rudkovskaya even right now .
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- Jan 20, 2019
I agree that we either should move the Eteri vs Plush discussion to another thread or just move on to another topic here...
Anyway, the next russian cup stage will be super exciting. We'll have Trusova vs Valieva, Medvedeva vs Konstantinova (I'm grouping them together because we still don't know how each of them will do with their new coaches.)
Is there anyone else that we should look forward to?
Anyway, the next russian cup stage will be super exciting. We'll have Trusova vs Valieva, Medvedeva vs Konstantinova (I'm grouping them together because we still don't know how each of them will do with their new coaches.)
Is there anyone else that we should look forward to?
I think I saw that Petrosyan and Osokina will be competing in juniors but I'm not positive.
The deal is that some people talk like Tutberidze usually takes skaters of the same level than skaters that Plushenko is getting. And i say no, it isn't the same thing. Yes those established skaters still have to work and coach still have work to do, but imo, in order to win things, you get it easier with a skater who is technically or/and artistically strong and was at the top of the game when he/she joined you, than with a 10/11yo with unstable triples. Unless you want to rework everything like Medvedeva-Orser.
Why does it matter?
Bradie Tennell for example, leaving her coach for another didn't cause drama because her former coach wasn't Tutberidze AKA the greatest witch with winning streaks despised by most of fandom but idolized by some people. Her new coach isn't a wealthy former oly champ who is seen like a children savior with medevial hair by some and arrogant coach who still hasn't proven himself by others. Both Russians. Both children who like to fight on social media and media love it. Then people discuss when they almost don't care for the other switches.
Osokina was such an amazing performer that really stole the show I feel at test skates, excited to see if she can steal the show at the cup stages as well.
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- Aug 20, 2019
This discussion comes down to two things: Whether you think that Plushenko shouldn't be able to advertise his new rink and whether you think that Plushenko shouldn't be able to coach whoever he wants just because he's new in the arena.
I think that as a coach, he has every right to approach other skaters and inform them of opportunities. This is what Eteri did to Zhenya to get her to return, and yet this action was not seen as her poaching Zhenya from Orser. And someone on here will say "but Zhenya needed a better training environment". But why did Aliona and Sasha leave if not for the same thing? Plushenko never offered, as far as we're aware, money or sponsorships in exchange for the skaters transferring to them. Sasha, for example, already has an adidas sponsorship. So his claim about not luring skaters away with contracts is completely true. That should be the end of it. I really don't care if he offered his training facilities to Alina. You think that coaches do not want to train top talent?
The second is that Plushenko is somehow doing a disservice by trying to gain a reputation off of "established" skaters as opposed to ones he's made. Well he has only had three years, and he didn't even have a properly sized rink until very recently. So it is impossible for us to declare he has failed in development when there isn't even the time span for him to develop anyone. In the time being, it is not his job to refuse all talents who want to join him just because he isn't "proven". Aliona and Sasha are two of the best figure skaters in the world. They have their options. They chose him. Neither were conscripted, nor forced. It was THEIR choice. To make it as if they were simply stolen removes all agency from them, takes away their agency in deciding what the best training environment is for them, and allows everyone to conveniently ignore that, while a GREAT coach no doubt, Tutberidze's training camp has faults.
The fact that this is even an issue for discussion is ridiculous, and it should be ended. Neither camp is perfect, but at the end of the day, it is not up to them to be unflawed humans it is up to them to provide appropriate training conditions for their athletes. And it is up to us as fans to support athletes who advocate for themselves and to give them the agency to make the decisions that are best for them REGARDLESS of our opinions of who they're coached by.
I think that as a coach, he has every right to approach other skaters and inform them of opportunities. This is what Eteri did to Zhenya to get her to return, and yet this action was not seen as her poaching Zhenya from Orser. And someone on here will say "but Zhenya needed a better training environment". But why did Aliona and Sasha leave if not for the same thing? Plushenko never offered, as far as we're aware, money or sponsorships in exchange for the skaters transferring to them. Sasha, for example, already has an adidas sponsorship. So his claim about not luring skaters away with contracts is completely true. That should be the end of it. I really don't care if he offered his training facilities to Alina. You think that coaches do not want to train top talent?
The second is that Plushenko is somehow doing a disservice by trying to gain a reputation off of "established" skaters as opposed to ones he's made. Well he has only had three years, and he didn't even have a properly sized rink until very recently. So it is impossible for us to declare he has failed in development when there isn't even the time span for him to develop anyone. In the time being, it is not his job to refuse all talents who want to join him just because he isn't "proven". Aliona and Sasha are two of the best figure skaters in the world. They have their options. They chose him. Neither were conscripted, nor forced. It was THEIR choice. To make it as if they were simply stolen removes all agency from them, takes away their agency in deciding what the best training environment is for them, and allows everyone to conveniently ignore that, while a GREAT coach no doubt, Tutberidze's training camp has faults.
The fact that this is even an issue for discussion is ridiculous, and it should be ended. Neither camp is perfect, but at the end of the day, it is not up to them to be unflawed humans it is up to them to provide appropriate training conditions for their athletes. And it is up to us as fans to support athletes who advocate for themselves and to give them the agency to make the decisions that are best for them REGARDLESS of our opinions of who they're coached by.
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- Aug 20, 2019
I will add an addendum to this. An American perspective. Almost none of this drama bothers me, and I think we're missing a larger picture here. Specifically in regard to Russian coaching practices in general.
What specifically sticks out to me is two comments from Kostornaia and Plushenko. "No one chased after me or cursed at me when I failed" from Kostornaia and "We have a very specific discussion when a coach starts at my rink to not raise their hand against an athlete" from Plushenko. Do these statements not bother anyone else? That there is literal physical abuse so prevalent in these rinks that it is strange for Aliona to not be in that environment and that Plushenko has to fire coaches and have specific discussions about it? As an American that is just, very very concerning. Coaches may curse at athletes (though when I played soccer at a very high competitive level, that would get coaches and parents red carded and is definitely not standard) But actual physical abuse, touching the athletes, is never condoned here. I can't in good conscience support any coach who uses these methods with their students, regardless of their results. Someone may say "but they are used to get results" and that may be so, but how many athletes does that same coach see in a day who is not on a podium that they are abusing?
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- Sep 8, 2016
Could someone explain what Hi Sashenka , “gnom gnomich” means?
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- Oct 23, 2005
I’m failing to see how these arguments of “poaching” and “ready made skaters” make any sense if we are respecting the skater’s freedom to make decisions for themselves as individuals. An invitation isn’t a summons. If the skater doesn’t think that the inviting coach’s offer will put them in a better situation then naturally they will refuse. But if they do think they will be in a better situation then they will accept. And shouldn’t that be a good thing? For the skater to decide for themselves what is best for them after being informed of all of their options?
Things like the training environment, having a say in the creative process or the layout of your program, the choreographers you will be able to work with, and your coach’s technique are important points for a skater to consider when choosing their coach. Sponsorships and the coach’s cut of earnings are relevant because skaters need money in order to fund their training and provide a better life for themselves.
The way that I see it if another coach genuinely believes that he/she can offer the skater a better situation then informing them of their interest to work with them is actually the more honorable position, rather than deferring to their current coach who may or may not know what they’re doing or have the skater’s best interest in mind.
Imagine a situation where is skater is struggling physically or financially. Another coach knows exactly what to do to fix their technique, heal their injury, or has interested sponsors that could help them continue, but does not speak up because of some arbitrary morality line dreamt up by fans that the skater must make the first contact. The skater isn’t aware of this coach or the potential solutions, doesn’t realize that they should contact them, contacts another coach instead who makes things worse, jumps around to different coaches, eventually they are forced to retire. And for why? Because random people’s opinions should supersede their individual agency?
I believe that Eteri’s methods are right for some skaters but not everyone and that’s ok. And what works for someone in one moment may not work for them in the next. It is up to each individual skater to decide what is best for them, not their fans and not anyone else. They have the right to know what options are available to them when they are making great sacrifices to their personal lives, physical and mental health, and finances, often for others’ benefit. Any such arguments of “but he/she raised the skater!” takes agency away from the skater and makes it about the coach, as if the skater, a living breathing human being, becomes the personal property of the coach simply because the coach did the job they are paid to do, ignoring all the hard work and sacrifice that the skater put in themselves in order to reach that level.
Skaters are people. Not property to be held hostage for someone else’s benefit, entertainment, or to fulfil whatever fantasies we have of certain coaches or figure skating in the individual categories as a team sport.
Things like the training environment, having a say in the creative process or the layout of your program, the choreographers you will be able to work with, and your coach’s technique are important points for a skater to consider when choosing their coach. Sponsorships and the coach’s cut of earnings are relevant because skaters need money in order to fund their training and provide a better life for themselves.
The way that I see it if another coach genuinely believes that he/she can offer the skater a better situation then informing them of their interest to work with them is actually the more honorable position, rather than deferring to their current coach who may or may not know what they’re doing or have the skater’s best interest in mind.
Imagine a situation where is skater is struggling physically or financially. Another coach knows exactly what to do to fix their technique, heal their injury, or has interested sponsors that could help them continue, but does not speak up because of some arbitrary morality line dreamt up by fans that the skater must make the first contact. The skater isn’t aware of this coach or the potential solutions, doesn’t realize that they should contact them, contacts another coach instead who makes things worse, jumps around to different coaches, eventually they are forced to retire. And for why? Because random people’s opinions should supersede their individual agency?
I believe that Eteri’s methods are right for some skaters but not everyone and that’s ok. And what works for someone in one moment may not work for them in the next. It is up to each individual skater to decide what is best for them, not their fans and not anyone else. They have the right to know what options are available to them when they are making great sacrifices to their personal lives, physical and mental health, and finances, often for others’ benefit. Any such arguments of “but he/she raised the skater!” takes agency away from the skater and makes it about the coach, as if the skater, a living breathing human being, becomes the personal property of the coach simply because the coach did the job they are paid to do, ignoring all the hard work and sacrifice that the skater put in themselves in order to reach that level.
Skaters are people. Not property to be held hostage for someone else’s benefit, entertainment, or to fulfil whatever fantasies we have of certain coaches or figure skating in the individual categories as a team sport.
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- Jun 21, 2003
Since no Russian speaker answered, I'll take my shot at it. I think it's just a shout-out to Alexander (Sasha) Plushenko, the "little gnome." That's his Instagram handle.
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- Mar 16, 2019
His mother gave him a pet name, which roughly translates as gnome/dwarf + the same paternal name. „-Ich“ - is s respectful manner of addressing someone usually older (or respected, or teachers) by their patronymic, one of the ways. But in this case it’s sort of a comical way of saying it.
(I.e. Evgeniy Viktorovich, which means Evgeniy‘s dad is Viktor, you would address him respectfully with his first name and patronymic .)
Mikhailov didn't work with Eteri. Plushenko can tell whatever he want, the matter is ONLY his name is on the screen. Look at the tens of his giant portraits which are all over the training rink walls as if he is some kind of local Kim Jong-Un. This man is narcissistic egomaniac.And? because that isn't changed. Was Mikhaylov next to her name?
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- Jan 14, 2020
I think @* ~ RussianBleux ~ * and @sclloyd have said a good final word. There is really nothing more to say.
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- Jun 27, 2012
sure.
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- Feb 13, 2019
I think you don't know who Evgheni Vicktorovich Plusenko was and who he is! To document you:
Evgeni Plushenko - Wikipedia
I don't know what Kim Jong-Un did for Korea, but I know what Plushy did for his country. The academy is built with his money. And he is proud of who he was and who he is ... Children can look at the wall and they can see why they have to work hard!
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- Feb 13, 2019
I apologize!And yet things are still being said
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- Mar 16, 2019
It was never said Eteri initiated anything with regards to return of Evgenia. Daniil said that Eteri informed him that the meeting was about to happen, but it never said anywhere she asked for it.
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- Mar 16, 2019
It is bothersome, if it’s the way things are translated in English. „Chasing“ and „cursing“ aren’t correct translations. It almost always bothers me how some things are mistranslated or misinterpreted in English. Никто не гонит - can be translated in 2 ways, either rushing a person (?), or telling them to go off ice(less likely), imo, but chasing is the wrong way to translate it. Гонится - would be chasing, but without the latter two letters it has a different meaning. Neither is swearing/cursing for the other word. It’s more like when your teacher says „I told you to do this! Why aren’t you doing this?“, sort of being told off, not referring to the use of swear words.
Like the time people like to discuss Eteri’s words about „Once you’re off podium, you’re no one“, as if it means you’re a nobody without a medal. It’s not what it means, it means „in order to win your next medal you have to work as hard as if you never won anything, don’t let yourself think that having a medal will help you to win your next one.“
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