2020-21 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating | Page 730 | Golden Skate

2020-21 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating

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That IS expressing a preference of when you want RusFed to be dodgy. You literally said you wanted them to act on that shadiness and add Sasha to the World's team

Nope. Just stated that they are shady and this would be one more shady thing to add to the list.

Did I say "Oh they are so unfair and overscored zzz but I want them to add Sasha to the World's team"

No I merely stated that they are as shady af and one more thing is not going to matter in the dodgy list of many things they'll do.

It's not a preference when you accept that an organization is dodgy as heck and are wondering why they aren't just embracing their corruptness in a particular situation for their best outcome.
 
Before pandemic, you could call it "brave" and "heroic" and "gutsy". Now it is freaking irresponsible. She should have been withdrawn if she had temperature. Sixteen year old kid may feel like a hero for going to compete with fever (and if it is true she DID NOT have covid, she is asking for it being out when she is already sick and her body is weakened)... but in these times, she is just irresponsible. Somebody should have put stop on this teenage "heroism".

It is not like World's are likely to happen (and after this schtick Rusfed pulled... it might be another decisive factor of not having it happen, seeing how some feds will disregard any safety measures). So whooopity woo a medal. Hopefully, she did not cause some damage to her lungs and body in general.
 
Nope. Just stated that they are shady and this would be one more shady thing to add to the list.

Did I say "Oh they are so unfair and overscored zzz but I want them to add Sasha to the World's team"

No I merely stated that they are as shady af and one more thing is not going to matter in the dodgy list of many things they'll do.

It's not a preference when you accept that an organization is dodgy as heck and are wondering why they aren't just embracing their corruptness in a particular situation for their best outcome.
Hmm that's fair. It certainly wouldn't be out of character.

But then you can't criticize them for being dodgy at a future event. Why not have them embrace their corruptness at all times, rather than actively working to reform?

Regardless, I think Sasha did the most to make her case here (other than maybe Anna but Anna was already senior number 1 in the absence of Aliona so her position didn't change - Sasha's did, I think) and I DO think she's going to worlds - I think the RusFed has probably pencilled her in. Sasha proved she can be clean here and that was probably the biggest point against her so good for her!! :) (So happy to see that :) )
 
Yeah exactly. People need to understand this ISN'T a personal slight to Sasha. In fact, I'm sure she's already pencilled in for that spot.

EDIT: If fact, other than Anna, I think Sasha did the most at RusNats to help her case. Arguably maybe even more than Anna as Anna was already thought of as senior 1 (in the absence of Aliona.)
It will depend on Sasha's health of course, but although I would like her spot already officially secured, it might be wiser strategically to compete. And show them all another clean skate. Maybe with the same content, maybe adding one jump if it is stable, but please not more. If only she can prove she can be clean consistently, many mouths would be shut.
 
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Hmm that's fair.

But then you can't criticize them for being dodgy at a future event. Why not have them embrace their corruptness at all times, rather than actively working to reform?

I'm very cynical. Could they, would they ever reform? Maybe when the youth of today take over if they're not too jaded by the system they had to claw through.

I must confess at one point I was secretly wondering if Rusfed was opting for some form of herd immunity and to simply replace any skaters that don't survive Covid.
 
It will depend on Sasha' health of course, but although I would like her spot already officially secured, it might be wiser strategically to compete. And show them all another clean skate. Maybe with the same content, maybe adding one jump if it is stable, but please not more. If only she can prove she can be clean consistently, many mouths would be shut.
That's what I'm hoping for actually. For her own personal confidence as well.

I still think the issue with Sasha has been mental in the past. Injuries heal but doubt takes much longer and is harder to overcome in a competition setting. I hope this competition has started to silence the doubt in her own mind, for her own sake (as well as ours).

I want to see more clean skates and happy Sasha afterwards. More difficulty will come - for her and others. That might even be the easiest part; however, believing in yourself and your preparation and skills that's harder.
 
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I'm very cynical. Could they, would they ever reform?

I must confess at one point I was secretly wondering if Rusfed was opting for some form of herd immunity and to simply replace any skaters that don't survive Covid.
I'm doubtful they will or want to, for that matter. That's actually all the more reason to not call for them to make an in character dodgy decision the one time they don't.

Unfortunately, I'm convinced they plan to take only those who survive and view a global pandemic as a test of character rather than a crisis.
 
I would put Usacheva behind both Kondratiuk and Ignatov (because of her technical content, mind you, not because of her components), but apart from that, I am fine with the qualitative order of this list. (Qualitative, because the absolute gap in points between Anna and Misha is too large, IMO).
That's not very close to reality. Even though Misha's technical content is not yet close to the best men in the world because of not having enough quads, he is an accomplished artist with an incredible performance and interpretation ability and great skating skills. Anya is beautiful, ethereal, musical, but nowhere close to Misha in PCS.
This order is just a reflection of how one can't compare the scores given by different panels of judges. And how the current judging system isn't an objective evaluation as it was planned to be, but rather a more complicated ranking tool.
 
I never missed a gymnastics meet in middle or high school even when I had a cold. I relate to Anna not wanting to drop out of Nationals, which is a much bigger competition than any I competed in.
i can also speak to this as a past competitive skater, i never missed even a practice if i wasn't puking. athletes practice and compete ALL THE TIME when sick, as long as they can practice mostly as normal.

people forget these girls live and breathe this sport, this is their existence and all they know, it's all they want, and they are going to do absolutely everything in their power to not miss a competition. this has nothing to do with heroism or anything, Anna is an elite athlete and she's going to do everything in her power to compete. whether or not she should have competed is another question, but i don't blame her at all for pushing herself, i likely would have done the same at that age.
 
Where they proudly declare that yes,"sport = OVERCOMING“ after you skated with an illness
This is the way.
Only with constant physical pain and stress overcoming you can achieve something in a competitive sport. It is not enough but it is required.
Fortunately or unfortunately, but this how it is right now, results speak for themselves.
And because this is against behavior that was successful for human evolution (eat as much as you can, *uck as many as you can (for males), sleep and rest as much as you can) - it is so hard to follow this "new" (on evolution timescale) behavior.

So yes, you have to skate (and train) with illness. Because if you don't and stop on the first drop from the nose or any weakness feeling - others who do will have better results and you lose.

And because obvious disadvantage of such tactic (long lasting damage to health) is also against the final goal of everybody (to win) - the more medicine advance, the better doctors/coaches/sportshumans know which pain/illness/stress is ok to overcome and which is not.
But due to how human body is evolved, best border line here WILL include pain/stress/illness overcome. Our body does not like to train, it wants to eat and have sex.
 
i can also speak to this as a past competitive skater, i never missed even a practice if i wasn't puking. athletes practice and compete ALL THE TIME when sick, as long as they can practice mostly as normal.

people forget these girls live and breathe this sport, this is their existence and all they know, it's all they want, and they are going to do absolutely everything in their power to not miss a competition. this has nothing to do with heroism or anything, Anna is an elite athlete and she's going to do everything in her power to compete. whether or not she should have competed is another question, but i don't blame her at all for pushing herself, i likely would have done the same at that age.
Yeah, I always assumed that the only illnesses that would take me out of competing were mono, strep throat, wooping cough, or a true stomach flu, which thankfully I never got. Injury did end up ending my senior season, but yeah, no sickness led to me not competing.
 
I'm very cynical. Could they, would they ever reform? Maybe when the youth of today take over if they're not too jaded by the system they had to claw through.

I must confess at one point I was secretly wondering if Rusfed was opting for some form of herd immunity and to simply replace any skaters that don't survive Covid.
They could not, would not in a jam. They could not, would not though they are slammed. They will not do it here or there. They will not do it anywhere. ( Agree with your post, I also love Dr. Seuss :hap10:;))
A good time to re-watch that great freeskate programme of Kseniia's at Chelyabinsk JGP 2019.



Ksenia!!! Her programs and Ss are just stunning. Aliona and Ksenia my favorite Russian ladies didn't compete at Russian nationals this year. 😭
 
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Guys, there were at least 2 ladies like Evgenia and Liza, who actually tested positive for COVID quite recently, experienced symptoms (in Evgenia’s case quite complicated ones) , and they went on to compete and perform here, hug and interact with everyone around them. That’s just the ladies, not talking about men, ice dancers and pairs. Gulyakova withdrew from 5th stage along with Kolyada because of the cold.
Tarasova was down with lung inflammation before 5th stage. Those are the cases that happened a lot later than Anna’s sickness.
But the whole fuss here is only about the one who didn’t test positive.
I don’t want to cut any of them slack, but making Anna the centerpiece of irresponsibility is a bit much. She’s likely going to experience some post-effects of pneumonia for quite some time, it’s not something that would be gone in a month.
None of the people I mentioned should’ve come here, I’m in agreement with critics on that one. I just feel like there’s something not right in this massive reaction and singling out Anna in particular.
 
First of all, actually America is a place where people ARE refusing to wear masks and follow proper protocol. At certain rallies and marches (I don't want this to get political but this is taken place against that backdrop and landscape), almost no one wore a mask or complied with protocol. There have been places (college campuses, beaches, large family gatherings etc) where people have partied maskless leading to COVID outbreaks. I certainly would not use that as an example of people following guidelines. Also, in many cases, there are examples of countries NOT following their countries "medical people", as you put it, professional recommendations. It's hard to be able to "see this out" when your recommendations and guidelines are NOT adhered to.

Second of all, I'm the one that used the argument that Anna (and Sasha) witnessed what Evgenia went through during the Olympic season and partially because of that this has become normalized. That was my argument. (I suggest rereading my comments.) I used it to defend Anna and say you can't single her out when there are numerous examples of skating through serious ailments and Anna (and Sasha) would have seen them up close. And they made an impression on them, undoubtedly. (As a side note, we don't actually know if Evgenia thinks skating through a broken foot at Rostelecom was worth it. Evgenia also withdrew from nationals that year so I doubt she would blame Anna for doing the same same. I certainly think Anna would look Evgenia in the eye for doing the same thing, in this case withdrawing and that (2018) was a more crucial year, as it was the Olympic year. This year we don't even know if Worlds is happening. Do you also think Aliona can't look Evgenia in the eye? How silly.)

Thirdly, Anna herself said she did NOT know if she could do it.

Finally, we'll address the departure of Sasha and Aliona. First of all, Anna is NOT them. Second of all, Plushy despite knowing all this DID take actions, although I think not enough. He DID pull Aliona from RusNats despite her just having arrived to his rink. He didn't cater to her wishes, even though by your logic he clearly should have. Keep in mind too that allegedly one reason she left was because she couldn't get her 3A back at Eteri's rink. Well, she still doesn't have it back (no fault of her own, I might add just continuous bad circumstances) and he STILL pulled her from RusNats. He ALSO got Sasha to limit her program content. Despite knowing that Sasha herself said she left Eteri's rink because they limited her quads, he coached Sasha (due to injury but nonetheless) to limit her program to "just" two quads. I believe even with injury, Sasha would have still wanted to do more.

A coach that caters to their students wishes without making decisions and taking responsibility for their skater's well-being is NOT a good coach. (That applies to ALL coaches.) If Eteri did not withdraw Anna BECAUSE she's afraid of Anna leaving then she ISN'T a good coach for Anna (or anyone). (If Eteri didn't withdraw Anna because, with the medical information she had available, she believed it was "safe" for Anna to compete here and she would not endanger her health further, that is a different story.)
No question what Anna and Sasha saw what Evgenia went through 3 years ago had an impact on them. In a way it's understandable.

Coaches are flawed chasing. They are human. Eteri not wanting to withdraw Anna what is risky business no matter what happened. But Anna is now seen In a Different Light kind of in a hero role at least for this event of Nationals and I'm sure she's pumped up by that. Anna rolled the dice and won big. So did EG and TT. but if Anna withdrew then kamila would have won nationals and I wonder what she's thinking about all this.
 
That's not very close to reality. Even though Misha's technical content is not yet close to the best men in the world because of not having enough quads, he is an accomplished artist with an incredible performance and interpretation ability and great skating skills. Anya is beautiful, ethereal, musical, but nowhere close to Misha in PCS.
This order is just a reflection of how one can't compare the scores given by different panels of judges. And how the current judging system isn't an objective evaluation as it was planned to be, but rather a more complicated ranking tool.
Yeah, maybe you are right. I've never understood what people saw in Anna's skating before, but her FS at RusNats touched something inside me and left me in awe. So might be that I'm looking back at her skate with rose-tinted glasses now, but in the spur of the moment and after the emotional high of Sasha's and Kami's skates, it was the greatest ever ladies' FS at least for me. :)
 
Yeah, maybe you are right. I've never understood what people saw in Anna's skating before, but her FS at RusNats touched something inside me and left me in awe. So might be that I'm looking back at her skate with rose-tinted glasses now, but in the spur of the moment and after the emotional high of Sasha's and Kami's skates, it was the greatest ever ladies' FS at least for me. :)
I've watched that three-in-a-row-show so many times now...

And Nugumanova.

I also love the little detail of "The Final Countdown" playing in the backround when the top group begins warm-up. A nice touch by the organizers👌
 
but if Anna withdrew then kamila would have won nationals and I wonder what she's thinking about all this.
What is she going to think?
Of course she wanted to win but second is a great achievement and "good enough" at her current level. She knows that.
She was visibly gutted when Anna ended her program and had gone clean (they panned the camera on her face, like good Russian drama) but when she realized she was on camera she quickly put on a smile and clapped.
I don't think there are any thoughts going on that go beyond what would be logical.

And if you think about it, if she just can maintain her current content and go clean in both programs with 3A in short and two 4T in the long, having the spins and steps that she has, plus the component boost she will get next season to put her on par with Anna & Alena (no matter if that's correct or not) and clearly above Sasha... let's say she has all reason to view Beijing in an optimistic light.
 
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