2020-21 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating

[sclloyd]

I am curious to see if international judges start penalizing Kamila’s change of edge in between jumps. That technically makes them no longer combination jumps even if the flow is maintained- that would be scary for Russia if some of her combinations got scored as sequences where the edge change was really noticeable.

As for team predictions I think it’s impossible to judge at this point. Aliona has gone from winning every international title to barely holding on in a season, the same can happen with any of them. Zhenya was the Olympic favorite until she wasn’t.

If Aliona comes back with a 3A and quads which she was training before her injuries and covid, then Sasha is in trouble because she lacks the most in other components and suffers with consistency.

Kamila’s jumping technique caused her injury right before the JGPF last season and even if she’s grown, that doesn’t mean she’s “developed”. We saw that with Alina, she grew and THEN she developed. That could completely affect her skating. Unless she retains a slight frame the way Anna has.

Daria has everything except the jumps, but she is like Aliona. If she gets quads and a 3A then Sasha is in trouble.

Sasha’s PCS IMO have been held down by RusFed but in an international competition would her improvements be noticed? Who knows.

Anna seems like she’s barely holding onto her quads rotation wise. Is that because of her illness or puberty?

Liza has pulled out quads and a 3A and said she intends to include them in the Cup final. Can she develop stamina by Olympic season to be considered? Will those jumps take away from the performance and make her seem lazy? Or will her long standing reputation, consistent improvement, and the inclusion of complex elements give her the spot?

There’s far too many variables. So many things can change in a season. Especially now with the technical upgrades everyone is working towards. It’ll probably be a skate off at the GPF/Euros next year.

 

[Greengemmonster]

I respect your opinion. But, for my personal sanity, I hope no one does Romeo and Juliet again for at least 10 more years.

Haha I generally enjoy Romeo and Juliet and have really enjoyed Sasha's version but I agree!!!! No more!!!!!

I'd tolerate it from Rika (unlikely it would ever happen since she picks really unique music) because she's my baby and I have to but I really don't want to!!!!!

 

[Greengemmonster]

I actually think Kamila is "developed" and was quite surprised to see it because she's still pretty young in age.

Generally I don't like to get into long discussions about this but there have been several competitions where she looks quite "grown" in the mature sense. At least to me. That's why I'm so optimistic about the jumps. She looks VERY different to the little juniors (? are they juniors, I think some are even younger) in the generation below her.

She's got a baby face though with baby expressions (so adorable ) so I suspect that makes her growth look less obvious.

 

[colormyworld240]

I am curious to see if international judges start penalizing Kamila’s change of edge in between jumps. That technically makes them no longer combination jumps even if the flow is maintained- that would be scary for Russia if some of her combinations got scored as sequences where the edge change was really noticeable.

Kamila’s jumping technique caused her injury right before the JGPF last season and even if she’s grown, that doesn’t mean she’s “developed”. We saw that with Alina, she grew and THEN she developed. That could completely affect her skating. Unless she retains a slight frame the way Anna has.

The only thing Kamila's combos would get is a reduction in GOE from the total, it might count as bad landing. I believe invalid combos happen when there is a fall or weight transfer to the other foot. That's why skaters who do 3-turns in between jumps and they still counted as combos. But internationally, her -3T combos gets +3 GOE or higher.

I think it's quite clear from Alina's case that she just gained weight, which is pretty normal for most skaters after they stop training competitively. Anyone who goes from working out 8 hours a day to 1-2 will gain weight, unless you eat a lot less. And she's probably not on an athlete's diet anymore.

 

[Scott512]

It's naive to think that these results won't play a role in deciding the team next year.

I' think Anna and KV are set in stone for bejiing if healthy. They would have to be injured or flopping in their competitions not to go. Sasha of course has a great chance to go if she's healthy. Allioni will be settled in at PA and if she has her 3A back watch out. Dasha and Maya are also in contention on the outside looking in.

Poor Saint Petersburg girls won't even be in contention for the Olympic team. Other than Liza that is. And she would probably be a long shot unless use hating her triple axel and quad.

 

[chasingneverland]

I am curious to see if international judges start penalizing Kamila’s change of edge in between jumps. That technically makes them no longer combination jumps even if the flow is maintained- that would be scary for Russia if some of her combinations got scored as sequences where the edge change was really noticeable.

As for team predictions I think it’s impossible to judge at this point. Aliona has gone from winning every international title to barely holding on in a season, the same can happen with any of them. Zhenya was the Olympic favorite until she wasn’t.

If Aliona comes back with a 3A and quads which she was training before her injuries and covid, then Sasha is in trouble because she lacks the most in other components and suffers with consistency.

Kamila’s jumping technique caused her injury right before the JGPF last season and even if she’s grown, that doesn’t mean she’s “developed”. We saw that with Alina, she grew and THEN she developed. That could completely affect her skating. Unless she retains a slight frame the way Anna has.

Daria has everything except the jumps, but she is like Aliona. If she gets quads and a 3A then Sasha is in trouble.

Sasha’s PCS IMO have been held down by RusFed but in an international competition would her improvements be noticed? Who knows.

Anna seems like she’s barely holding onto her quads rotation wise. Is that because of her illness or puberty?

Liza has pulled out quads and a 3A and said she intends to include them in the Cup final. Can she develop stamina by Olympic season to be considered? Will those jumps take away from the performance and make her seem lazy? Or will her long standing reputation, consistent improvement, and the inclusion of complex elements give her the spot?

There’s far too many variables. So many things can change in a season. Especially now with the technical upgrades everyone is working towards. It’ll probably be a skate off at the GPF/Euros next year.

They didn't penalize Kamila for that at the JGPF when they were penalizing EVERYTHING so they likely won't now. Especially as it's likely that she'll have the most RusFed support and will be their #1.

There is a difference between Olympic favourite and not making the team. That's what we're discussing.

I think Aliona needs one quad. However, I don't know how likely that is. Also it's one thing to add a quad. It's entirely different thing to add BOTH a quad and 3A. (That applies for Daria too.)

Also Kamila has already entered puberty (from appearances) and Anna and Sasha look to have grown too. All of kept their jumps (even through the pandemic and injuries and illnesses and training disruptions and in the case of Kamila and Sasha have actually added 3As. Even Anna's jumps look more solid.

People seem to be misunderstanding. This isn't about predicting the OGM it's about predicting the team. And it would take A LOT for Kamila, Sasha, and Anna ALL to not be named. In fact, even with minor injuries they're probably still going UNLESS someone else (basically only Aliona or Daria) beats them and even then there's probably only one spot. Especially because they've already proven capable of landing quads in international competition, which isn't true for the others. And the Evgenia argument actually supports this. She was injured leading into the Olympics but her reputation never left her spot in doubt. Even the year after an injured struggling Evgenia was sent over a resurgent Liza.

 

[chasingneverland]

I' think Anna and KV are set in stone if healthy. They would have to be injured or flopping in their competitions not to go. Sasha of course has a great chance to go if she's healthy. Allioni will be settled in at PA and if she has her 3A back watch out. Dasha and my are also in contention on the outside looking in

Yeah exactly. They're going barring catastrophic injury AND two other teammates landing quads in more than one competition. Just one won't do it because their reputations are better.

 

[dhjh811]

It's naive to think the RusFed won't take all of this into account. And that's why Kamila poses the most threat to Aliona. Because her stock has been hurt the most this season and she didn't get the Worlds title she likely would have last year.

On the other hand, Anna has won yet another RusNats (showing a clean 2 quad FS) and Sasha has landed her 3A and shown a clean 2 quad FS, neither of which Aliona has done. Basically last year Aliona was considering the number 1. This year, while she's probably going to Worlds if they happen there are questions.

That's why looking into the next year hers is the spot that's the most vulnerable and the one that Kamila will most likely take AS THINGS STAND - obviously that can change.

Also as it stands, Anna and Sasha are likely on the world's podium - barring meltdowns, while Aliona would need some help (without her 3As) to outscore Rika. That will also improve their position going into next year.

And Kamila has already shown she can outscore them all.

This is what I used to think, that it would be Aliona vs Kamila if she gets her triple axel back. Now, I'm starting to wonder if it won't be Aliona vs Alexandra fighting for the third spot if Anna and Kamila don't suddenly start flopping next season (highly doubt this will happen)...

 

[Scott512]

It's naive to think the RusFed won't take all of this into account. And that's why Kamila poses the most threat to Aliona. Because her stock has been hurt the most this season and she didn't get the Worlds title she likely would have last year.

On the other hand, Anna has won yet another RusNats (showing a clean 2 quad FS) and Sasha has landed her 3A and shown a clean 2 quad FS, neither of which Aliona has done. Basically last year Aliona was considering the number 1. This year, while she's probably going to Worlds if they happen there are questions.

That's why looking into the next year hers is the spot that's the most vulnerable and the one that Kamila will most likely take AS THINGS STAND - obviously that can change.

Also as it stands, Anna and Sasha are likely on the world's podium - barring meltdowns, while Aliona would need some help (without her 3As) to outscore Rika. That will also improve their position going into next year.

And Kamila has already shown she can outscore them all.

Let's just hope we have a worlds this season. That will answer some questions it will solidify satia in have a new environment and we will know it Liza or alyona go to the competition.

 

[Scott512]

Yeah exactly. They're going barring catastrophic injury AND two other teammates landing quads in more than one competition. Just one won't do it because their reputations are better.

Anna sasha and KV have a head start competing for the Olympic spots.

We could use some help for the Olympics and the world if covid takes a freaking hike..

Hard to believe these skaters of monkeys good as they have this season while having an entire off season messed up.

 

[NaVi]

Channel One Cup received really good ratings: https://mediascope.net/data/

The ladies free skate got a 4.5 rating with 667.6 thousand Moscow viewers. Extrapolating that to Russia's total population(subtracting about 6 million to account for those under 4) results in about(and I may be wrong) 6.2 million viewers. The same percentage rating would result in about 14 million viewers in the US. And I'm not sure if that's measuring online streaming(an article I read through translation makes me think it does not but I'm not sure) .

The ladies freeskate was the 4th highest rated program(the pairs lead-in was the 9th) and the jump contest was the 8th highest rated event. All in all 9 slots were taken up by figure skating with ice dance taking up the rear in 35th and 38th place.

American networks would be happy with anything that got 6.2 million viewers and would kill for something that gets 14 million. The only women's non-Olympic event that gets more than 14 million viewers is the Women's World Cup Final when the US plays in the final. The WNBA Finals barely gets half a millions viewers, Serena Williams gets a few million viewers for her finals matches, the US Gymnastics championships get a few million viewers though the Olympic trials for gymnastics get about 7 million viewers.

 

[alexocfp]

Channel One Cup received really good ratings: https://mediascope.net/data/

The ladies free skate got a 4.5 rating with 667.6 Moscow viewers. Extrapolating that to Russia's total population(subtracting about 6 million to account for those under 4) results in about(and I may be wrong) 6.2 million viewers. The same percentage rating would result in about 14 million viewers in the US. And I'm not sure if that's measuring online streaming(an article I read through translation makes me think it does not but I'm not sure) .

The ladies freeskate was the 4th highest rated program(the pairs lead-in was the 9th) and the jump contest was the 8th highest rated event. All in all 9 slots were taken up by figure skating with ice dance taking up the rear in 35th and 38th place.

American networks would be happy with anything that got 6.2 million viewers and would kill for something that gets 14 million. The only women's non-Olympic event that gets more than 14 million viewers is the Women's World Cup Final when the US plays in the Final. The WNBA Finals barely gets half a millions viewers, Serena Williams gets a few million viewers for her finals matches, the US Gymnastics championships get a few million viewers though the Olympic trials for gymnastics get about 7 million viewers.

Wow, so figure skating in Russia is a major sport.

This is only an exhibition too.

 

[Dawn825]

Never fear, Starr Andrews appeared for 3 seconds in a Super Bowl commercial, so the US is all over it

 

[alexocfp]

Never fear, Starr Andrews appeared for 3 seconds in a Super Bowl commercial, so the US is all over it

Maybe if the US maketed their skaters....

I live about six miles away from the NYC skate club but you don‘t know it exists.

 

[readernick]

Currently there are tennis tournaments (Australian Open, ATP Cup just finished), there was handball world championship, there are skiing competitions (some of them is Sweden), and if ISU was able to organize speed skating competitions (world cup in january, world championships are just about to start, there are short track events), then why figure skating should be halted.

I am not suggesting that I think it should be cancelled. I am just stating that the lack of a coherent plan by the ISU means that it could be cancelled if rules change in Sweden. The ISU has no plan in place if Sweden decides athletes need to quarantine. The ISU needs better protocols if they want to ensure this goes forward.

It seems we have found common ground: I agree that they are human girls caught in an awkward situation. I also agree that readernick does not seem to mind much. She didn't even bother responding to my post. This is definitely something to emulate if you want the conversation to come to an end.

For clarity's sake (we seem to struggle with that when it comes to each other's exact meanings) I almost always respond when someone replies to me. Even if it is just a brief random comment or an emoji or something. That's just me. Not trying to get the last word. It just feels polite.

I also want to clarify that I wasn't hating on tights. They are very important part of the costume. It's just they fall in the category of things I don't know enough to have an opinion about. Fortunately for this thread there are lots of those topics here.

Since you like people to respond to your posts, I will. I would say that I don't appreciate the suggestion that it is impolite to let an argument go. I think it takes maturity and self control to do so. Reactions often result in more fruitless discussions. You are obviously welcome to hold another opinion. I have expressed opinion and I still hold that. It is fake drama. If you disagree, that's ok. But, I don't think it is impolite to ignore a response which will just continue an argument that will likely have no positive outcome It is usually the best thing to do. In regards to the original situation, if people want to continue to discuss it that is, of course, their right. However, I would ask them all if they aren't holding these wonderful young ladies to an impossible standard. People who are sick and tired often come across in an inelegant way. Perhaps you have never said something slightly rude when exhausted or sick, but I certainly have. It bothers me how some people on this site spend so much time defending their favorites against even mild constructive criticism ( not talking about you) and have no compassion or humanity toward those who aren't their favorites. Neither of these ladies are my favorite skaters, but they both deserve a little understanding. That's my view and that's the last time I will discuss this topic. Please don't think it implies disrespect if I don't reply. Take care.

 

[Minz]

Maybe if the US maketed their skaters....

I live about six miles away from the NYC skate club but you don‘t know it exists.

No, I don’t. And I live in Manhattan.

 

[readernick]

I actually think Kamila is "developed" and was quite surprised to see it because she's still pretty young in age.

Generally I don't like to get into long discussions about this but there have been several competitions where she looks quite "grown" in the mature sense. At least to me. That's why I'm so optimistic about the jumps. She looks VERY different to the little juniors (? are they juniors, I think some are even younger) in the generation below her.

She's got a baby face though with baby expressions (so adorable ) so I suspect that makes her growth look less obvious.

Kamila does have the most adorable baby face. I want to hug her when she looks upset. She looks about 5. However, I do think it is impossible to know how and when growth and development will occur and how they will affect each individual. I won't speculate, but I think any assumptions of who will be the Olympic champion could easily be proven wrong.

 

[Minz]

Wow, so figure skating in Russia is a major sport.

This is only an exhibition too.

Maybe that’s becuase Russia actually markets it and capitalises on it. Unless I want some new system to watch replays like every year that I probably have to pay quite a bit for, I have to watch half of ice dance, then half of pairs, then the other half of ice dance, then the other half of pairs to watch ice dance at nationals. It’s crazy. With Russia, it’s FREE on YouTube, often with English commentary, it’s easy to access AND I can watch ANY TIME I WANT TO.

 

[Amei]

Maybe that’s becuase Russia actually markets it and capitalises on it. Unless I want some new system to watch replays like every year that I probably have to pay quite a bit for, I have to watch half of ice dance, then half of pairs, then the other half of ice dance, then the other half of pairs to watch ice dance at nationals. It’s crazy. With Russia, it’s FREE on YouTube, often with English commentar, it’s easy to access AND I can watch ANY TIME I WANT TO.

The US did as well when figure skating was popular in the US.

 

[alexocfp]

Maybe that’s becuase Russia actually markets it and capitalises on it. Unless I want some new system to watch replays like every year that I probably have to pay quite a bit for, I have to watch half of ice dance, then half of pairs, then the other half of ice dance, then the other half of pairs to watch ice dance at nationals. It’s crazy. With Russia, it’s FREE on YouTube, often with English commentar, it’s easy to access AND I can watch ANY TIME I WANT TO.

Explains why more people in Russia (With almost 100 million people less) watched this event than the nba finals in the USA.

Think about that for a second.

Staggering.