James/Radford announce partnership | Page 15 | Golden Skate

James/Radford announce partnership

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I think contracts would definitely be a good idea at the pro level.

At the competitive level, I'm dubious that contracts would necessarily be a good idea, at least if the idea is to keep a partnership together when one of the two absolutely doesn't want to be there anymore -- that doesn't sound like a scenario that would breed good competitive results.
 
I really don't know how Radford thought he was going to come out of this smelling like roses if Duhamel was the last person to know. There's no way to slice that that makes Radford look good. She should have been the first to know, not the last.
 
Colonel Green said:
I think contracts would definitely be a good idea at the pro level.

At the competitive level, I'm dubious that contracts would necessarily be a good idea, at least if the idea is to keep a partnership together when one of the two absolutely doesn't want to be there anymore -- that doesn't sound like a scenario that would breed good competitive results.
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Well, it wouldn’t have to be about keeping the partnership together, more about clarity and setting expectations. For example, how much and what kind of notice must you give if you want to leave the partnership? And so forth. I think that makes sense even at the competitive level.
 
Tavi... said:
Well, it wouldn’t have to be about keeping the partnership together, more about clarity and setting expectations. For example, how much and what kind of notice must you give if you want to leave the partnership? And so forth. I think that makes sense even at the competitive level.
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exactly... pairs already have verbal agreements "we are in this for the entire quad" or "we are taking it one season at a time" is something we hear all the time... so it would certainly be helpful for partners to have a contract defining what needs to happen if either skater wants out.... i was not joking when i wrote that for kids, a contract based on respect and loyalty would be something good... I believe the sport needs to show kids how important communication and commitment are , when working with a partner. Who knows? How many times have young skaters been "dumped" by their skating partners and have been harmed by it (rejection feeling, not being good enough feeling, etc). It's important that the sport builds a more positive culture about partnership.
 
TontoK said:
I understand her point of view. Her feelings are hurt. There is some potential loss of income, but the main point she made in the interview was that she felt disrespected. Again, I can understand that, even if I think her own communication decisions were unfair... and I understand some people DON'T think they were unfair. We can agree to disagree.

But I don't think Eric (or Skate Canada) expected anything like the reaction that's occurred. That piece from Dylan and Asher was as fluff as you could get. I'm neither "Team Meagan" or "Team Eric" and I'm certainly not "Team Vanessa" although I've already mentioned a previous personal experience would have me leaning to his side if I took a side. But even I acknowledge that this is a PR nightmare - somebody dropped the ball here big time.

In a few days we've gone from "Canada's New Power Couple" to "that two-timing SOB." And some people are not going to get over that.
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haha... in a few days? you are being generous... it happened simultaneously and why? Well, I wonder what Skate Canada did here... accordingly to the interview, Meagan wasn't consulted, they did not ask her for a statement or anything. Skate Canada obviously knew what was happening, and could have provided support to Eric and Meagan in this process, before everything went public... same with the media, though one media apologized to her since then. Imagine being betrayed also by your own federation.....
 
4everchan said:
haha... in a few days? you are being generous... it happened simultaneously and why? Well, I wonder what Skate Canada did here... accordingly to the interview, Meagan wasn't consulted, they did not ask her for a statement or anything. Skate Canada obviously knew what was happening, and could have provided support to Eric and Meagan in this process, before everything went public... same with the media, though one media apologized to her since then. Imagine being betrayed also by your own federation.....
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My friend, you're surely more clued into what Skate Canada does or does not do than I am.

From a non-Canadian fan of Canadian skaters, it doesn't seem to me like they've done much of anything at all lately. The sport looks to be in competitive decline in one of the most traditional powerhouses in the world, and now, as you say, it looks like they haven't handled things very well with the former champions, who should be glittering jewels in the federation's crown and treated as such. In three years, Canada has gone from an Olympic situation in which they clobbered the rest of the world in the Team Event and took home medals in three of the four individual events to a place where a bronze Team medal is in jeopardy and any other medal will be a bonus. "Ice is slippery" and "anything can happen" caveats apply.

But this is just an outsider's point of view. Perhaps things are going splendidly, and I just don't see it.
 
The Skating Lesson posted the video to Facebook, and Meagan posted in the comments section

Hi everyone :) I hope you take the time to watch the video before sharing your comments. Of course, all opinions are welcome, but watching the video definitely helps. I spoke how this is a teachable opportunity for young pairs and dance teams and how if one team signs a contract because of this experience, then me speaking up was worth it. You’ll also see how I stood up for Eric about some of his previous comments that people viewed negatively. I didn’t ask for anyone to feel sorry for me and I didn’t share hate for anyone. We also chatted about some of the potential pairs and how we see the outcome of the Olympics and my love for strong athletic female skaters💪

When someone asked how such contracts would be enforced, Meagan replied:

good question. I think yes some sort of financial penalty. Maybe it’s paying the partner back for choreography or costumes if those were done? Or paying them for the shows missed that were booked?

www.facebook.com

The Skating Lesson

This week, Meagan Duhamel joins us to discuss the pairing of Vanessa James and Eric Radford, how she learned about the team, and why she chose to speak up on social media. We answer all the questions...
www.facebook.com www.facebook.com

ETA: this is the third time in two weeks I have linked to a Facebook post and the link shows up in my post in German. I assure you, I sadly do not know enough German to read Facebook, and the post is in English:biggrin:
 
What a fascinating situation for all concerned.

I can’t help continuously thinking that Megan shares much of her life very openly on the internet and talks a lot. Knowing that, one has to consider that people could feel that anything said to her could then be posted. It puts many in a difficult position.
 
TontoK said:
My friend, you're surely more clued into what Skate Canada does or does not do than I am.

From a non-Canadian fan of Canadian skaters, it doesn't seem to me like they've done much of anything at all lately. The sport looks to be in competitive decline in one of the most traditional powerhouses in the world, and now, as you say, it looks like they haven't handled things very well with the former champions, who should be glittering jewels in the federation's crown and treated as such. In three years, Canada has gone from an Olympic situation in which they clobbered the rest of the world in the Team Event and took home medals in three of the four individual events to a place where a bronze Team medal is in jeopardy and any other medal will be a bonus. "Ice is slippery" and "anything can happen" caveats apply.

But this is just an outsider's point of view. Perhaps things are going splendidly, and I just don't see it.
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i don't think these go together... 1) the team is in a rebuilding phase... and still, Piper and Paul managed to win a medal... and Keegan skated well, MTM placed where they needed to place... and Madeline was wonderful in her first SP....

So, let's not put everything in the same boat... Maybe I should have chosen my words better but from the interview, Meagan did mention that Skate Canada (and the medias) didn't contact her to issue a statement on the new partnership... which is often done usually, like in the article about Buntin/Duhamel, this was originally on the Skate Canada website... so she was probably thinking they could have talked to her, prior to going public. That's all I am saying...
 
So now Eric has to tell his story.
I'm really interested wether Eric has really asked Aljona to skate with him in 2013/14. It's not in Aljona's book (he only asked her what she wanted to do after the Olympics). Meagan said that her coaches told her that he had wanted to skate with Aljona sometime later. But If she knew, why did she seem so shocked by that on Twitter?
And this should have made her suspicous when Aljona and Eric did train together in 2019 in Obersdorf.
Did she talk with Eric about that back then? That would've been the perfect time for a contract.

Eric did shows alone. I'm sure Meagan could do the same. Shows in Canada will definitely want to have her, they wouldn't dare not to after this. And again, why can't they do shows together after the Olympics? Does Eric have a contract with Vanessa now?
A far too long interview, missing some of the essential questions.
 
solani said:
So now Eric has to tell his story.
I'm really interested wether Eric has really asked Aljona to skate with him in 2013/14. It's not in Aljona's book (he only asked her what she wanted to do after the Olympics). Meagan said that her coaches told her that he had wanted to skate with Aljona sometime later. But If she knew, why did she seem so shocked by that on Twitter?
And this should have made her suspicous when Aljona and Eric did train together in 2019 in Obersdorf.
Did she talk with Eric about that back then? That would've been the perfect time for a contract.

Eric did shows alone. I'm sure Meagan could do the same. Shows in Canada will definitely want to have her, they wouldn't dare not to after this. And again, why can't they do shows together after the Olympics? Does Eric have a contract with Vanessa now?
A far too long interview, missing some of the essential questions.
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If Eric wanted to pursue doing shows with Meagan, he would have called her and said : hi Meagan, i want to compete again... I know you are done... How would you feel if I competed again? This being said, I would like to keep skating with you for our usual shows.
That did not happen, did it? :) So, at this point, it's no longer possible.
 
I am also of the opinion that the federation handled this poorly, although the "federation" may be some poor intern with not enough guidance and too much to do.

I said ten screens ago, and I say again now, in these situations, I have always seen a quote from the former partner. "I have heard that Skater X has teamed with Skater Y and I wish them well". Always. Unless of course they do not wish them well, in which case, that would be a good thing to know too ;)

I get the impression Skate Canada just thought, wow, no voice will be found wanting in the chorus of praise. And they thought wrong.:shrug:
 
el henry said:
... I said ten screens ago, and I say again now, in these situations, I have always seen a quote from the former partner. "I have heard that Skater X has teamed with Skater Y and I wish them well". Always. Unless of course they do not wish them well, in which case, that would be a good thing to know too ;) ...
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Do you have links to any specific examples?

I did look up the USFS announcement of Alexa Knierim/Brandon Frazier's new partnership (which you repeatedly have cited), and it does *not* really have any quote from Haven Denney (or from Chris Knierim, for that matter).

In the USFS announcement, Brandon and Alexa both spoke appreciatively of Haven and her support -- but USFS did not have a quote from Haven.


Several days ago, I posted in the U.S. Pairs thread about my respect for Haven for being supportive of Brandon and Alexa.
I am not doubting that Haven was supportive of them.
I believe 100% what Brandon and Alexa said about having Haven's support.

But to me, Brandon and Alexa's appreciative comments are not the same thing as USFS obtaining a direct quote from Haven.
 
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The article I posted earlier was actually originally posted on Skate Canada's website.
If you look up Craig Buntin on wikipedia, it is the source given for his retirement news.
That statement was originally posted on Skate Canada's website years ago.. It's obviously been taken down now, but it is on web archives.
Here is the article again, and it shows as written "by Skate Canada"
 
4everchan said:
i don't think these go together... 1) the team is in a rebuilding phase... and still, Piper and Paul managed to win a medal... and Keegan skated well, MTM placed where they needed to place... and Madeline was wonderful in her first SP....

So, let's not put everything in the same boat... Maybe I should have chosen my words better but from the interview, Meagan did mention that Skate Canada (and the medias) didn't contact her to issue a statement on the new partnership... which is often done usually, like in the article about Buntin/Duhamel, this was originally on the Skate Canada website... so she was probably thinking they could have talked to her, prior to going public. That's all I am saying...
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As I said, mine is an outsider's point of view. But of course I defer to more informed opinions.

That said, I believe that Canada should always be reloading, not rebuilding. The history is simply too strong for the pipeline to be as thin as it has been of late. The 2018 team was legendary - World Champions (past or future) in every discipline. Who was in charge of development during those glory years?
 
4everchan said:
The article I posted earlier was actually originally posted on Skate Canada's website.
If you look up Craig Buntin on wikipedia, it is the source given for his retirement news.
That statement was originally posted on Skate Canada's website years ago.. It's obviously been taken down now, but it is on web archives.
Here is the article again, and it shows as written "by Skate Canada"
Click to expand...

But Craig's retirement is the focus of the Skatebuzz article from Skate Canada, which is titled: "Three-time Canadian Champion Craig Buntin retires from competitive figure skating."
The focus of the article is not Meagan's new partnership.

I would be interested to see Skate Canada's announcement of Meagan/Eric's new partnership, and whether a quote from Craig was included? (Or a quote from Eric's former partner?)
Even if we were to presume that it did, that would be one instance from over ten years ago of a new-partnership announcement including a quote from an ex-partner. Which IMO would not demonstrate any pattern.

FWIW, here is Skate Canada's 2014 announcement of the new Moore-Towers/Marinaro partnership.
There was no mention by name of their ex-partners, never mind quotes from the ex-partners.


I know that the end of the Moore-Towers/Moscovitch partnership had been announced previously (and that some fans considered it controversial).
I do not remember whether the Purdy/Marinaro partnership already was known to have ended before the announcement of the new KMT/Marinaro partnership?
 
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TontoK said:
As I said, mine is an outsider's point of view. But of course I defer to more informed opinions.

That said, I believe that Canada should always be reloading, not rebuilding. The history is simply too strong for the pipeline to be as thin as it has been of late. The 2018 team was legendary - World Champions (past or future) in every discipline. Who was in charge of development during those glory years?
Click to expand...
Michael Slipchuk has been the head of high performance at Skate Canada for a long time.... he is still in charge. I appreciate your positive comments about Canadian history of success in figure skating.... Canada is often referred as one of the big 4 nations of the sport... However, with a population inferior to California alone, it is normal that behind the great champions, there are gaps. The pool of athletes is so much smaller than in other big countries. This being said, Ice dance has brought a line of champions (or world medalists) with Bourne & Kraatz, Dubreuil & Lauzon, Virtue & Moir, Weaver & Poje and now Gilles & Poirier... and behind them, there is huge hope for Lajoie & Lagha (former world junior champions)... Men have been very successful from Orser to Stojko and Browning, to Buttle and Chan... however Reynolds suffered injuries, Nguyen a growth spurt and Keegan would be considered a late bloomer... the last 3 guys have managed top 5-6 at worlds however... but honestly, with Chen and Hanyu on top, anyone is relegated to a fight for bronze... Ladies : Gabby was going to be the main contender for Canada, following Kaetlyn's retirement, but injuries and injuries and more injuries have just messed up her rhythm badly... and finally, pairs... well... Moore-Towers& Marinaro, after Korea were holding the fort but without much firepower.. perhaps that is why Skate Canada seems very happy about this new partnership. So, I apologize for the long paragraph about successful stories in Canadian skating... this has been a very strange quad for sure. I don't think however, that the federation is not nurturing talent. For a while, Canada benefited from the momentum of the 2010 Vancouver games, with a culmination in 2018. We can see how Russia has improved towards Sochi and from it. Korean ladies are doing well. Let's see how skating evolves with games in China and then Italy. In any case, I wouldn't attack the head of high performance or the federation for lower results... it's a Canadian reality in pretty much every sport. The possibilities are there to make it to the top of the world, but behind that special athlete, there is often not many immediate followers.
 
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ice coverage said:
Do you have links to any specific examples?

I did look up the USFS announcement of Alexa Knierim/Brandon Frazier's new partnership (which you repeatedly have cited), and it does *not* really have any quote from Haven Denney (or from Chris Knierim, for that matter).

In the USFS announcement, Brandon and Alexa both spoke appreciatively of Haven and her support -- but USFS did not have a quote from Haven.


Several days ago, I posted in the U.S. Pairs thread about my respect for Haven for being supportive of Brandon and Alexa.
I am not doubting that Haven was supportive of them.
I believe 100% what Brandon and Alexa said about having Haven's support.

But to me, Brandon and Alexa's appreciative comments are not the same thing as USFS obtaining a direct quote from Haven.
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You won't find them "skaters found a new partner" articles. You have to go back to the original "skaters from original pair end partnership" article. The older article will have the "wish them well" message. Mervin Tran has lots of these. Here's an example

Olympians Castelli, Shnapir announce end of figure-skating partnership (May 2014)
Two-time U.S. pairs champions Marissa Castelli and Simon Shnapir, who finished ninth at the Olympics, have ended their partnership.

Castelli, who is from Cranston, and Shnapir helped the United States win a bronze medal in the first Olympic team event, and their top 10 placement at Sochi was considered a big step internationally.

“I am very proud of the accomplishments Marissa and I have had over the past eight years,” Shnapir said. “I wish Marissa the best of luck with her future as I look forward to starting a new chapter in my skating career.”

Both skaters are looking to continue their careers with another partner. Shnapir has been trying out potential partners in Indiana this week.

“It has been an amazing journey and I wouldn’t change it for the world,” Castelli said. “We will always share our amazing accomplishments with each other. I appreciate everything Simon has done for me and wish him the best in his future endeavors. I will continue skating and hope to be back performing in front of a crowd soon.”
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The Providence Journal: Local News, Politics & Sports in Providence, RI

Get the latest breaking news, sports, entertainment and obituaries in Providence, RI from The Providence Journal.
www.providencejournal.com www.providencejournal.com


a few months later

Marissa Castelli finds new figure skating partner (June 2014)
Marissa Castelli, the Olympic figure skater from Cranston, has found a new pairs partner. According to IceNetwork.com, Castelli will compete with Mervin Tran, a former world championship bronze medalist.

Castelli and Simon Shnapir, who won the gold at the U.S. championships this year and a bronze in the team competition at the Sochi Olympics, ended their partnership in May.

According to the IceNetwork.com story, Tran has sought his release from Skate Canada; Castelli insisted in the story that she will only represent the United States.
Click to expand...

The Providence Journal: Local News, Politics & Sports in Providence, RI

Get the latest breaking news, sports, entertainment and obituaries in Providence, RI from The Providence Journal.
www.providencejournal.com www.providencejournal.com
 
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