Kamila Valieva: Anti-doping Case and Follow-ups

[mrrice]

The girl is only 15.....why is she being dragged for this? I just hope this whole thing gets resolved before the Olympics end. Because it must suck that everyone is stuck in limbo about the medals from the team event.

This is exactly how I feel!!!! When you're 15 you are completely reliant on the adults around you. If I were to blame anyone, it would be her coach, her parents, and the Doctor who gave this young girl the injections. When I was 15, if my Doctor said, You need a shot and my parents agree, I get the shot. As for being dragged, sadly, it's her picture that they're splashing all over the papers. Here's another one. https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/wi...igy-kamila-valieva/ar-AATFGzN?ocid=uxbndlbing

 

[Alex Fedorov]

USA Today's Nancy Armour's opinion piece. I agree 100%.

IOC getting what it deserves for not holding Russia accountable for doping | Opinion

Russian figure skater Kamila Valieva believed to have tested positive for trimetazidine, medication used to treat angina that will improve blood flow

www.usatoday.com

Some WADA statistics on the number of detected cases of doping:

2016:

2017:

2018:

and who should have been punished by the IOC based on these statistics? Italy, France, USA? No - only Russia. It was necessary to punish her as severely as possible in 2016 - and then in 2017 103 American, 128 French and 172 Italian athletes would never have taken doping. And so Russia remained unpunished - what else was left for these unfortunate people? Just dope.

 

[Mista Ekko]

This is exactly how I feel!!!! When you're 15 you are completely reliant on the adults around you. If I were to blame anyone, it would be her coach, her parents, and the Doctor who gave this young girl the injections. When I was 15, if my Doctor said, You need a shot and my parents agree, I get the shot. As for being dragged, sadly, it's her picture that they're splashing all over the papers. Here's another one. https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/wi...igy-kamila-valieva/ar-AATFGzN?ocid=uxbndlbing

That's exactly why they have a rule that keeps her safe in a case like this, though with respect to her age,
I wouldn't put it past 22 year old athletes in some countries to not know what their coaches are giving them either.

Regarding the media, it shouldn't be, I think it's happening because the competitions are ongoing
and there was no possible way to see this cat out of the bag as the athlete in question is a unique one.

 

[Mista Ekko]

and who should have been punished by the IOC based on these statistics? Italy, France, USA? No - only Russia. It was necessary to punish her as severely as possible in 2016 - and then in 2017 103 American, 128 French and 172 Italian athletes would never have taken doping. And so Russia remained unpunished - what else was left for these unfortunate people? Just dope.

We get it, you're here to defend Russia, that's fair and the statistics are very interesting,
but maybe a little less defensiveness, I didn't see anyone here charge blindly at Russia yet,
we're all curious as to what's happening with this specific case right now.

And regarding Italy, by the 2nd page Carolina Kostner's name was dropped so...

 

[Fanof]

Yeah I didn't really believe it'll last, but tried for a second there
as long as you're fine with it...

I did think at first that they were lingering with an announcement because they were trying to figure out
how they could possibly word the information without giving the person away, it's probably impossible.

It is not forbidden to reveal the name. It is not mandatory.
"14.3.7. The mandatory Public Disclosure required in 14.3.2 shall not be required where the Athlete or other Person who has been found to have
committed an anti-doping rule violation is a Minor, Protected Person or Recreational Athlete. Any optional Public Disclosure in a case involving a Minor, Protected Person or Recreational Athlete shall be proportionate to the facts and circumstances of the case."

Sorry but given the circumstances (articles in newspapers and websites all over the world), I believe the Public Disclosure would be quite proportionate...

I rather believe that they have to wait for a decision to be made...

 

[Amei]

It is not forbidden to reveal the name. It is not mandatory.
"14.3.7. The mandatory Public Disclosure required in 14.3.2 shall not be required where the Athlete or other Person who has been found to have
committed an anti-doping rule violation is a Minor, Protected Person or Recreational Athlete. Any optional Public Disclosure in a case involving a Minor, Protected Person or Recreational Athlete shall be proportionate to the facts and circumstances of the case."

Sorry but given the circumstances (articles in newspapers and websites all over the world), I believe the Public Disclosure would be quite proportionate...

I rather believe that they have to wait for a decision to be made...

I made the remark when this initially broke Monday night, only minors are protected from being named, there is only 1 minor on the team so omission is the admission of who it is.

 

[flakyy]

It seems odd that the test in question happened back in december. At least the A result should have been there before the games - and if so, one had to be very sure that there won't be any issue OR Kami would have been replaced in the TE. I cannot imagine them putting Kami in with an investigation under way, given the presence of Anna and Sasha and the weakness of US Ladies/Pairs. They would have won easily without Kami after all.

 

[Alchamei]

Some WADA statistics on the number of detected cases of doping:

2016:

2017:

2018:

and who should have been punished by the IOC based on these statistics? Italy, France, USA? No - only Russia. It was necessary to punish her as severely as possible in 2016 - and then in 2017 103 American, 128 French and 172 Italian athletes would never have taken doping. And so Russia remained unpunished - what else was left for these unfortunate people? Just dope.

What are you trying to do? Desperately defending Mother Russia under all circumstances? I get we don't have all info yet, but don't get so defensive all of a sudden. The fact that other countries also have doping violations doesn't mean a thing if The Russian athlete is at fault.

 

[Pantsu]

No reason for Valieva to dope and even less incentives for Tutberidze to do that.
Timing of the emerging problem is hilarious. Right after the Team event. Not in December or before/after Euros, but right now when it can deal the most damage.

Regardless of how it all plays out, Tutberidze and Valieva will be viewed as cheaters, but such is life.

 

[Mista Ekko]

Regardless of how it all plays out, Tutberidze and Valieva will be viewed as cheaters, but such is life.

Honestly? I think there's an option that the accused who can't be accused could receive overwhelming support in this situation,
mostly due to her age, I just wouldn't be sure about her longevity in the sport anyways due its nature atm.

*And we don't even know how this inquiry will end yet

 

[flakyy]

It seems odd that the test in question happened back in december. At least the A result should have been there before the games - and if so, one had to be very sure that there won't be any issue OR Kami would have been replaced in the TE. I cannot imagine them putting Kami in with an investigation under way, given the presence of Anna and Sasha and the weakness of US Ladies/Pairs. They would have won easily without Kami after all.

Given the depth in Russia, they could have sent whomever they wanted, especially Maya or Liza instead. A lot of ladies there do have proper 3-3s.

 

[Amei]

The girl is only 15.....why is she being dragged for this? I just hope this whole thing gets resolved before the Olympics end. Because it must suck that everyone is stuck in limbo about the medals from the team event.

The Team event - the individual event is in 4 days -- I think that's not necessarily being made as big a deal as the team event (from what I've seen coverage wise) because it's 2 Russians behind her that are favorites to gold and they are coached by the same coaching team. If the 2 other favorites/challengers were from another country or coach - would they have people fighting for them right now, because if a suspension/disqualification happens post-Olympics whoever places second should Valieva win would be the winner and they lose out on that Olympic moment of being crowned champ.

It seems odd that the test in question happened back in december. At least the A result should have been there before the games - and if so, one had to be very sure that there won't be any issue OR Kami would have been replaced in the TE. I cannot imagine them putting Kami in with an investigation under way, given the presence of Anna and Sasha and the weakness of US Ladies/Pairs. They would have won easily without Kami after all.

Agree, and I wonder if this is the actual legal problem, the Russian Fed would have most definitely put another skater in the team event, they probably would have left her off the entire Olympic team, had they known a test taken over a month ago was positive.

 

[bigsisjiejie]

A lot is riding on one very simple question: Was there an anti-doping violation or not?

If the answer is No, then everything else goes away, Russia (or the ROC, whatever) is off the hook, everybody keeps their medals and the athlete involved gets to compete. I expect that Russia has been using every possible excuse and loophole to make this happen. In lock step, the Russia apologists in media, on this forum, and elsewhere are predictably bending over backwards to offer up supportive options (such as the test was a lie, it was in December, migraines, not a performance enhancing drug, it was just a small amount, etc. etc ad nauseum). IMO, most of these all rank on the Irrelevant to Laughable scale....and yet with the IOC (and to some extent, ISU) showing evidence the last decade of being very pliable to Russian pressure, it's still possible we will get a No Violation decision. I'm sure the IOC realizes it has boxed itself into a corner, as a decision letting the Russians off the hook entirely will shred their credibility even further.

If the answer is Yes, then it becomes a matter of degrees of Yes. In some ways, Russia has boxed itself into that same corner, because a Protected Athlete (due to age) is essentially automatically deemed to be not 100% responsible for whatever violation happened, meaning that some adult(s) have to pick up some percentage--probably a great percentage--of the responsibility for the violation. Furthermore, the entire training situation of said Protected Athlete has to be scrutinized closely. This means that the hunt will be on for a scapegoat or two. Parents? Coaches? Doctor? Which adults will end up tainted/sacrificed? Will someone fall on their sword for the good of Mother Russia? Will there be some sort of suspension of the athlete, including or not including further Olympic competition? A removal of Europeans medal? Close examination/more testing of other skaters in that training environment? To maintain credibility with the rest of the world, it would seem the IOC will need to make some ruling that will not be beneficial to somebody in Russian skating circles.

I believe the IOC delay in getting this resolved is due to their frantic search for a compromise that will make everyone happy, and there probably isn't one. But the longer the lack of decision goes on, the more untenable their position will be.

 

[TontoK]

The girl is only 15.....why is she being dragged for this? I just hope this whole thing gets resolved before the Olympics end. Because it must suck that everyone is stuck in limbo about the medals from the team event.

Exactly. She's only 15, and whatever happened should not be laid at her door. That's not to say she should/should not be banned from the Olympics, but we all know, or we SHOULD know, that a 15 year old girl didn't independently seek a disallowed heart medication.

An adult gave it to her.

I don't view this a "doping case" so much as I view it as "child endangerment." And lest anyone accuse me of anti-Russian bias, there are PLENTY of cases of child endangerment issues within American sports, and I am absolutely NOT satisfied that all is being done that could be to combat it.

If the American model is any indication, Kamilla will be held accountable. She'll shoulder the blame and the shame. And the adults involved will move on to other children.

When did we start to view children, American or Russian, as commodities?

 

[Draculus]

I didn't see that anyone mentioned this so just my cents:
Actually, the reason behind can be just an error. Either just human error, even most qualified professionals can make mistakes.
Or error due to not enough qualifications. Or for whatever reason and then fear and attempt to hide it.

For some reason most people assume that ALL doctors that can give something to Kamilla are all very high qualified professionals with state of the art knowledge who never made mistakes and always have full knowledge of what they are doing. Or having courage to confirm mistakes if they find it.

I think nothing is true. Neither qualifications, no courage.

 

[GS Forum Staff]

сегодня на утренней пресс-конференции:

https://tass.com/world/1400673

"
«Я не собираюсь комментировать всевозможные спекуляции, которые я также видел. Вчера у нас была определенная ситуация, которая имеет юридические последствия. уместно», — подозревается Адамс, подозревается, что « подозревается дело о допинге — это полная спекуляция». ..
"

This post is appearing in the Forum in Russian. Could you please translate the posted portion into English? Thank you.

 

[lariko]

Okay, then I misunderstood the concept of a "medical exemption." Excuse me. When did Kami have COVID? Quite a while ago, I think. If it was a year ago, then that was while treatment protocols for COVID were not as developed as they are now. Since I'm not a doctor, I don't know if there is another equivalent substance not on the banned list that could have been given for the therapeutic purpose. I guess we'll see what happens. Thanks.

If she was prescribed it, it should have been self-disclosed prior to taking and they should have applied to use it. There are legal ways to take medications that lit up on scans if they are medically necessary.

In this case, the trace amount might point to the practice of micro-dosing, when the dose is adjusted to have marginal benefit, but remains undetectable. But it always runs a risk of detection because it’s hard to predict individual metabolic rates.

If there is evidence of wrongdoing, I hope there is serious consequences for the staff of the school and Kamila sits out some time from competition. Yes, she is a minor, but no consequences means that violation will be repeated on other minors.

 

[bigsisjiejie]

It seems odd that the test in question happened back in december. At least the A result should have been there before the games - and if so, one had to be very sure that there won't be any issue OR Kami would have been replaced in the TE. I cannot imagine them putting Kami in with an investigation under way, given the presence of Anna and Sasha and the weakness of US Ladies/Pairs. They would have won easily without Kami after all.

The positive result from the A sample probably came back not long after the test was taken, maybe late December/early January. The testing of the B sample likely occurred in January, not sure when the results would have come back, possibly before the Olympics started, but maybe not. I cannot fathom a circumstance where the coaching team AND the Russian Skating Federation would not have known about the A sample. Europeans happened, then the Russian Olympic team was named. Leads me to believe that the results of the B sample were not available (or had not yet been tested) before the team was announced. In effect, putting Valieva on the team was a gamble--that either the B sample would test negative, or the result could be suppressed from outside parties. A gamble which has now blown up in their faces. Putting Valieva in the Team Event at the Olympics probably made this blow up earlier than it would have had somebody else skated the TE....but I think the positive sample and accusations of doping violation was going to come out eventually.

 

[CellarDweller]

To be perfectly honest, I don't know what to think about this.

Given that other athletes have been disqualified for using this drug, I would assume they have to keep that in consideration with their decision.

I lay no blame at Kami's feet for this. She's only 15. All the adults in her circle must've known that this drug is on banned list, and if she is being prescribed this drug for medicinal purposes, they needed to have their paperwork in order to make sure that Kami's ability to compete was protected.

Like others have questioned here, I would like to know why if this result was found in December, was is it only coming to light now? Makes no sense to me at all whatsoever.

Whatever the outcome, I wish only the best for Kami. I also hope that she has a supportive circle of people around her that are helping her to deal with the negative attention that is swirling around her now.

 

[drivingmissdaisy]

Exactly. She's only 15, and whatever happened should not be laid at her door. That's not to say she should/should not be banned from the Olympics, but we all know, or we SHOULD know, that a 15 year old girl didn't independently seek a disallowed heart medication.

An adult gave it to her.

I don't view this a "doping case" so much as I view it as "child endangerment." And lest anyone accuse me of anti-Russian bias, there are PLENTY of cases of child endangerment issues within American sports, and I am absolutely NOT satisfied that all is being done that could be to combat it.

If the American model is any indication, Kamilla will be held accountable. She'll shoulder the blame and the shame. And the adults involved will move on to other children.

When did we start to view children, American or Russian, as commodities?

It's tough. I agree with most of what you're saying, but I do think you have to remove athletes of any age from an event if they test positive for certain substances. I thnk it's more about running a clean event than punishing anyone in particular. OTOH, if a minor tested positive in December for a medication that increases stamina, perhaps any benefit has lapsed by February and it's an even playing field. There is a lot to consider and I'm glad I'm not any part of making these decisions. The worst part is that a lot of people will be furious no matter the outcome, and it's terrible for the sport.