Kamila Valieva: Anti-doping Case and Follow-ups

[Mista Ekko]

People being self righteous and naive believing there is such thing as clean pro sport amuse me

A recommendation for the silent readers of the thread:

Don't believe a word of it.

 

[HisShadowBG]

Ah the...

"Its not cheating because in my imagination everyone is doing it!!!!"

...argument. How brilliant and original.

I am a school teacher and see that logic every day. Every kid caught cheating on a test insists that everyone else does it to, so they should not be punished. I don't know if they are just messed up enough to believe everyone is as morally bankrupt as they are... or if they are just brazen liars.

Caught with trace amounts of a drug that does not do anything for performance it was quite obvious that this was not going anywhere

 

[Wafflecakes]

It's disgusting to pretend that 60 percent or more of asthma among skiers is the norm.

I would understand the therapeutic exception, when a chess player has a runny nose and receives naphthyzinum. Or when a runner with sensitive skin uses sunscreen. But no, we have people with the hardest, according to doctors, diseases, very often they receive Olympic medals. This is the real doping system legalized by WADA.

And you saw one episode, which may well turn out to be an accident - and you issue peremptory accusations, and then a verdict. If you are so committed to legal rules, then you should know that any accusation requires investigation and evidence. There has been no investigation yet, you have no evidence - so, maybe, it’s enough to repeat Eteri’s guilt, for example, about some kind of “cruel treatment”?

Once again. Russia has access to the exact same exemptions.

They don't use them and that is no one's fault but theirs... and their decision to use other drugs is no ones fault but theirs as well.

 

[Scott512]

apart from the hell she and partially Anna and Sasha had top traverse the last week, the timing made alla the difference in the world.

After and we would had a regular competition which result would be appealed (it happenend more than one time at the olympics).
Not ideal of course but at least everybody would have skated in the best state of mind.

Before and Kamila would have been replaced with an excuse (injury/covid/whatever) protecting the minor from the scandal and letting the other have a regular competition.

The way it was done is really irresponsibile with a minor thrown to the wolves and all the skating events in the dumpster.

I agree with you and I also think the cas ruling covers part of that how she wasn't protected and she's vulnerable.

If the urine sample from KV from December 25th 2021 came back 10 days later as they thought it would they would have pulled her out of Europeans and then done some private testing to see if the ioc would let her in the Olympics but everything would have been on the down low and private because KV is a minor age athlete and nobody would have known anything like you said they could have said she was injured. Now this Phenom is emotionally injured and I don't know what to expect from her in the ladies competition. She is certainly no sure thing for the gold like we thought couple a weeks ago. Anna and Sasha are not at their best either. They all probably can't wait to go home.

 

[Wafflecakes]

Caught with trace amounts of a drug that does not do anything for performance it was quite obvious that this was not going anywhere

She agreed to follow the rules.

She didn't. Doesn't matter how much or little the drug helps.

Consequences follow.

 

[brigit66]

It's disgusting to pretend that 60 percent or more of asthma among skiers is the norm.

I would understand the therapeutic exception, when a chess player has a runny nose and receives naphthyzinum. Or when a runner with sensitive skin uses sunscreen. But no, we have people with the hardest, according to doctors, diseases, very often they receive Olympic medals. This is the real doping system legalized by WADA.

And you saw one episode, which may well turn out to be an accident - and you issue peremptory accusations, and then a verdict. If you are so committed to legal rules, then you should know that any accusation requires investigation and evidence. There has been no investigation yet, you have no evidence - so, maybe, it’s enough to repeat Eteri’s guilt, for example, about some kind of “cruel treatment”?

100 % eteri girls dope, dear....

whatever the reason is that is not the one.
She's participanting subjudice because they did not have a final verdict about her suspension yet

other atheltes couldnt have compete while being suspended when there was investigation... .why she is not while being positive?

 

[NaVi]

Valieva needs to realize it's going to be much harder to come back to skating if her individual Olympic medal is stripped. And they're likely going to be stripped considering how previous cases have gone(though I think she'd have higher than typical chance of success).

Practically every time she'd compete it would be mentioned. It wasn't her fault to be in the position of the Team Tournament, but now she is responsible for being in the Individual Event.

Some insider who knows for a fact whether she was given this intentionally or not needs to intervene and tell her to pull out if she was given this intentionally.

Valieva needs legal advice that cares for her future and not for her coach's or federation's future.

If I was Valieva, even if it was accidental ingestion I would be happy with the Gold medal I'd receive if I won my case. If she wins her case then everyone is going to think she would have won the individual Gold. She has nothing to prove in that regard.

If I was Valieva, I would put out a statement that:
1. Slam being put into this situation without casting blame on anyone specifically.
2. Thanks CAS for agreeing she should have been allowed to compete in the individual event. Mention that because of his case future athletes are less likely to be put in this situation.
3. Mention that if you win your case you'll still have and cherish your Gold medal from the Team Event.
4. Pull out of the individual event so that the medalists can have their moment
5. Say you're leaving immediately to mount a defense. I might include a mention of hoping that providing a hair sample can help prove innocence.
6. Say you hope to be skating at the World FIgure Skating Championships.

 

[leoncorazon]

If your anti-doping system involves multiple unaccountable labs and at least 5 different organizations then you aren’t really serious about stopping the doping.

 

[HisShadowBG]

She agreed to follow the rules.

She didn't. Doesn't matter how much or little the drug helps.

Consequences follow.

Yeah and the court ruled in her favor so all is fair and square

 

[jenaj]

As best I can tell from a quick read is being a minor is the ONLY reason she gets to compete. Though I’d be surprised if we see her best work now.

So- yeah- raise the age if that will avoid this mess is the future.

No medal ceremony if she lands in the top 3 speaks for itself. And of course- still no medal ceremony for the teams.

This is absurd imo.

Also, the irreparable harm the panel referenced would be depriving her of medal. I doubt if the decision would have been the same if she wasn't the gold medal favorite. What they ignored, of course, was the irreparable harm to the team medalists, who would not receive their medals until the Valieva case was resolved, along with the other medal winners and fourth place finisher in the individual event.

 

[Wafflecakes]

Yeah and the court ruled in her favor so all is fair and square

No it didn't.

It said she can compete until a full hearing is held since she is 15 and minors get special treatment. It said nothing about guilt or innocence.

 

[McBibus]

comparing simone and norwegian atheltes to valieva.. is quite desperate. Kamila has none history of not being healthy. She is not asking of medical exemption.Sh is not sick OFFICIALY> You re delusionl russian. You cannot be positive on drug test out of nowhere and then say" oh, sorry simone is taking too fake medicines so I have right to compete"! Your mumbling is ridicolous. . Thank god valieva will NOT HAVE her medal, any color. No one wil give it to her. She wil be fake winner

The big problem with medical exempion is that they become so many in the last years that I do not believe them anymore, even if I am well aware that doing that I'm unfair to those who really have a condition that needs special treatments.
The abuse should be stopped.
So said, when criticizing a rule or a custom is better to stay away from names because is not the singles we are talking about.

 

[bluwaters]

The whataboutism in this thread is astounding.

 

[[email protected]]

Or have you already decided everything and just want a lynch trial?

It's a rhetoric question.

 

[Wafflecakes]

The whataboutism in this thread is astounding.

Yup the amount of...

ROC didn't cheat because X also happened once! (usually X isn't even cheating)

I wish the mods would just ban whataboutism in general.

 

[Plisskin]

Mods, are we really going to allow this disparaging rhetoric of ADHD to continue to occur in this thread? I hardly see how this follows the rules that was set in this forum.

 

[Mista Ekko]

The basic logic indicates that what happened is a tragic accident because it makes no sense for the Eteri-team to use this drug even systematically (which was not because in this case there were numerous positive trials) and even more so to use this one-time. Alexey, I'am, samkrut are trying to tell you all this simple thought.

can you vouch for that statement a 100%?

Because I've been hearing the opposite.

EDIT: You know what? never mind, I'm gonna ask my pharmacist friends.

 

[Greengemmonster]

Valieva needs to realize it's going to be much harder to come back to skating if her individual Olympic medal is stripped. And they're likely going to be stripped considering how previous cases have gone(though I think she'd have higher than typical chance of success).

Practically every time she'd compete it would be mentioned. It wasn't her fault to be in the position of the Team Tournament, but now she is responsible for being in the Individual Event.

Some insider who knows for a fact whether she was given this intentionally or not needs to intervene and tell her to pull out if she was given this intentionally.

Valieva needs legal advice that cares for her future and not for her coach's or federation's future.

If I was Valieva, even if it was accidental ingestion I would be happy with the Gold medal I'd receive if I won my case. If she wins her case then everyone is going to think she would have won the individual Gold. She has nothing to prove in that regard.

If I was Valieva, I would put out a statement that:
1. Slam being put into this situation without casting blame on anyone specifically.
2. Thanks CAS for agreeing she should have been allowed to compete in the individual event. Mention that because of his case future athletes are less likely to be put in this situation.
3. Mention that if you win your case you'll still have and cherish your Gold medal from the Team Event.
4. Pull out of the individual event so that the medalists can have their moment
5. Say you're leaving immediately to mount a defense. I might include a mention of hoping that providing a hair sample can help prove innocence.
6. Say you hope to be skating at the World FIgure Skating Championships.

I love this. This is very reasonable. I could not get over Kamila being caught in this awful situation and was hell bent on wanting her to skate and win (while feeling guilty about my thoughts) but your post makes a lot of sense and has allowed me to make peace with my thoughts. Thank you.

Unfortunately I do not think a 15yr old will have the foresight or even the courage to defy the coaches and the Federation. But how epic would it be if she did this. Fighting drama with even more drama that will make her shine.

 

[lariko]

My hope is that none of skaters from Turberidze's school are invited in the GP next year.

It's a commercial tournament, so ISU should have a full control over it. This school caused 2 GP stages to go with less competitors than announced when they knew 100% that an adolescent skater couldn't compete (and Russia/other countries had a few men who could sub), had a public tragedy unfold on ice with another adolescent, and topped it off by using the third adolescent's age to make a mockery of two FS events in the Olympics, potentially stripping the countrymen of their medals too.

Tutberidze this year systematically damaged Russian and international skating far, far more than anyone else.

 

[CanadianSkaterGuy]

I am so curious what the vibe will be from the audience during the women’s SP, especially when the Russians skate.

I can’t imagine the audience would give Kamila the same reception as the team SP. And I’m sure there will be a fair amount of booing/protestations. As I said, I would just turn my back while Valieva skated. This is going to be uuuuugly.