Dutch Figure Skating 2024-2025

[ladyjane]

Ok, so if I've understood correctly, Daria and Michel will not get funding to go to the Olympics unless they get certain competition results this year? And without that funding they can't go (can't crowdfund)? or they simply won't get "permission"?
Also wondering how they are supposed to get these extra results if the qualifier is so early in the season. Because the Dutch Olympic Committee has to state before the qualifier whether or not they're going to use their spot, right?

The only funding Daria and Michel get, is from an independant Foundation which wishes to promote Figure Skating. and maybe a bit from the Federation (for travelling to competitions) . Nothing has changed on that score.

It's a permission thing: the Dutch Olympic Committee wanted them to be 14th here (or higher) and they were 15th. Too low. What happens now is in question as there aren't that many competitions before the qualifier! But you are certainly right about the decision whether they can go or not has to be made before the qualifier.

 

[ladyjane]

To round off small reports from Worlds: Chelsea Verhaegh and Sherim van Geffen were 32nd out of 36 ice dance couples in the RD. But, they were satisfied: they've never had 4 teams behind them before, they felt very much supported by the audience as well as by all kinds of (local) people like volunteers making their way in the catecombs so to speak, and by their coaches, by their Dutch fans, and, best of all, had a lot of fun performing their Elvis Dance. Well done you two!

Here's an article in Dutch which mostly says the same as what I just summarised:

Genietende fans: de brandstof voor ijsdansduo om te blijven doorgaan

<p data-block-key="h0y0v">Als enthousiasme een factor van betekenis zou zijn in de jurering van het ijsdansen, zouden Chelsea Verhaegh en Sherim van Geffen het een stuk verder hebben geschopt op het WK Kunstschaatsen dan hun 32e plaats in het deelnemersveld van 36. Die deerde de twee niet: zij...

www.schaatsen.nl

I allready reported on Daria and Michel's achievement. There's an article about that as well, which mostly summarises what has been discussed earlier on in the thread (except there are no remarks about being annoyed about the Olympic Committee's stance, that's just for us!). They say in their interview that they hope they can get ready to prepare for the OG and some understanding for that by the Olympic Committee. I certainly hope so too. It would be such an honour to have a Dutch Pair at the Olympics (for the first time in history)!

Danilova/ Tsiba voldoet aan internationale eisen voor de Winterspelen

<p data-block-key="intn1">Op het WK in Boston heeft het Nederlandse kunstschaatspaar Daria Danilova en Michel Tsiba als eerste Nederlandse paar ooit voldaan aan de internationale eisen voor een olympisch ticket. Omdat ze geen top-14 behaald hebben, zijn ze nog niet helemaal zeker van Milaan en...

www.schaatsen.nl

 

[ladyjane]

Also today: the Joan Haanappel and Sjoukje Dijkstra memorial trophy in The Hague. A Dutch singles competition in honour of these two giants in FS who both sadly passed away in 2024. I am looking forward to it (it's close-by and nothing happening on the Worlds front either for now).

 

[ladyjane]

Coming back to the Court Case I reported earlier on in this thread. You might recall the judge sent it back to the Skating Federation because of competence issues, and the Skating Federation asked the ISU for Advice. Hanna and Alessio had received Clearance to skate for The Netherlands in 2020 (when there were no Dutch skaters). One of the requirements was the necessity for residency (basically: living in and spending enough time in The Netherlands). For good order the requirements regarding the skating itself were met (gaining more points than their rivals in certain competitions) to be sent out to the European Championships. The ISU has now come forward with the Decision that Hanno and Alessio do not spend enough time in The Netherlands for the clearance to be valid anymore. Here's the source (in Dutch)

ISU besluit: clearance-certificaat ijsdansers Jakucs en Galli niet meer geldig

De ISU heeft bepaald dat het clearance-certificaat van de kunstschaatsers Hanna Jakucs en Alessio Galli niet langer geldig is. Hierdoor kan het Hongaars-Italiaanse ijsdansduo Nederland niet meer vertegenwoordigen bij internationale wedstrijden.

www.schaatsen.nl

It is expected that the Federation will execute this Decision, which means Hanna and Alessio can no longer skate for The Nederlands. Which is a pity. I liked the rivalry between the two couples, as they were really close in capabilities.

 

[DemTuppesSeine]

Coming back to Court Case I reported earlier on in this thread. You might recall the judge sent it back to the Skating Federation because of competence issues, and the Skating Federation asked the ISU for Advice. Hanna and Alessio had received Clearance to skate for The Netherlands in 2020 (when there were no Dutch skaters). One of the requirements was the necessity for residency (basically: living in and spending enough time in The Netherlands). For good order the requirements regarding the skating itself were met (gaining more points than their rivals in certain competitions) to be sent out to the European Championships. The ISU has now come forward with the Decision that Hanno and Alessio do not spend enough time in The Netherlands for the clearance to be valid anymore. Here's the source (in Dutch)

ISU besluit: clearance-certificaat ijsdansers Jakucs en Galli niet meer geldig

De ISU heeft bepaald dat het clearance-certificaat van de kunstschaatsers Hanna Jakucs en Alessio Galli niet langer geldig is. Hierdoor kan het Hongaars-Italiaanse ijsdansduo Nederland niet meer vertegenwoordigen bij internationale wedstrijden.

www.schaatsen.nl

It is expected that the Federation will execute this Decision, which means Hanna and Alessio can no longer skate for The Nederlands. Which is a pity. I liked the rivalry between the two couples, as they were really close in capabilities.

I'm really sad for them now. They posted on instagram not so long ago about the situation and how they feel about it...

 

[ladyjane]

I'm really sad for them now. They posted on instagram not so long ago about the situation and how they feel about it...

It certainly is sad for them. They got so much undeserved hatred on social media (like Facebook) that I felt ashamed to be Dutch.

 

[FlossieH]

Are they potentially eligible to skate for anywhere else?

 

[FlossieH]

I realise that this may sound harsh, but I am going to find it difficult to support Chelsea and Sherim fully when they have deliberately sabotaged another team's career.

 

[ladyjane]

I don't know if they're eligible to skate for someplace else, and I understand why you find it difficult to support Chelsea and Sherim because of this deliberate sabotage. It was framed differently in the Dutch media, so they will still get support. I will continue to follow them as well, but half heartedly as I don't care for their methods either. I'd rather focus on our pair for now who did qualify for the OG on their own merits.

 

[Andrea82]

The only funding Daria and Michel get, is from an independant Foundation which wishes to promote Figure Skating. and maybe a bit from the Federation (for travelling to competitions) . Nothing has changed on that score.

It's a permission thing: the Dutch Olympic Committee wanted them to be 14th here (or higher) and they were 15th. Too low. What happens now is in question as there aren't that many competitions before the qualifier! But you are certainly right about the decision whether they can go or not has to be made before the qualifier.

The document uploaded on the Dutch Olympic Committee website indicates that the score must be achieved in one of the designed competitions between October 2025 and 1 January 2026.
The score seems to be the averagre of the scores achieved by pairs between 10th and 18th position at Worlds if I translated correnctly from Dutch.

https://cdn.nocnsf.nl/media/zm1ftror/kwalificatiedocument-os-milano-cortina-2026-kunstschaatsen-v1.pdf

So they will accept the spot now and eventually forfait it in January.

 

[ladyjane]

Thank you @Andrea82. I hadn't seen that. So, our Olympic Committee can give the spot back any time, and make some other pair happy? How lovely (sarcasm) for Daria and Michel to have this Damocleatan sword above their heads, while they qualified fair and square for the IOC.

 

[FlossieH]

The document uploaded on the Dutch Olympic Committee website indicates that the score must be achieved in one of the designed competitions between October 2025 and 1 January 2026.
The score seems to be the averagre of the scores achived by pairs between 10th and 18th position at Worlds if I translated correnctly from Dutch.

https://cdn.nocnsf.nl/media/zm1ftror/kwalificatiedocument-os-milano-cortina-2026-kunstschaatsen-v1.pdf

So they will accept the spot now and eventually forfait it in January.

I have just done the maths. That would require a score of 188.47, which would be a huge PB and would require them to perform more difficult elements. Much as I would love them to prove your fed wrong, I can't see it being achievable.

 

[ladyjane]

I have just done the maths. That would require a score of 188.47, which would be a huge PB and would require them to perform more difficult elements. Much as I would love them to prove your fed wrong, I can't see it being achievable.

I am disgusted. Not with you, with our Olympic Committee. I thought the Swedish one was an issue, but the Dutch one is worse. how can they expect such a thing?

 

[aroundtheworld778]

I have just done the maths. That would require a score of 188.47, which would be a huge PB and would require them to perform more difficult elements. Much as I would love them to prove your fed wrong, I can't see it being achievable.

What could they realistically improve to get that score? Supposing they have an amazing summer of training...
Also, if they forfeit a spot in January, does it go to whoever places 4th at the Beijing qualifier?

 

[Miriam090]

I have just done the maths. That would require a score of 188.47, which would be a huge PB and would require them to perform more difficult elements. Much as I would love them to prove your fed wrong, I can't see it being achievable.

By my calculation it's 173.89, which is far more achievable (although still a stupid condition).

 

[pesto]

I have just done the maths. That would require a score of 188.47, which would be a huge PB and would require them to perform more difficult elements. Much as I would love them to prove your fed wrong, I can't see it being achievable.

That can't be right. 10th place is 183.01.

My calculation agrees with Miriam's calculation.

 

[pesto]

That's less than their SB at NHK. It really is nutso. They've proved again and again they are of an adequate standard.

 

[Casualsportsfan]

I am disgusted. Not with you, with our Olympic Committee. I thought the Swedish one was an issue, but the Dutch one is worse. how can they expect such a thing?

(I have taken a step back from the forum to focus on my own life, but I'll still pop up for some topics)

I have seen that kind of more stringent qualification critieria in swimming for example (that's one of the sports I follow most). It's only 1 example but I know it happened routinely in our history, I'll check further if needed, but basically :

Swimming at the 2020 Summer Olympics – Men's 50 metre freestyle - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

For that the event, there was a set qualification time, and what my country did set up for the event :

https://www.europe1.fr/sport/natation-florent-manaudou-valide-sa-qualification-pour-les-jo-de-tokyo-sur-50-m-4032658

It's in French, but in short the time that was setup to qualify, was harsher to the point that it equalled to the time needed to qualify for the FINAL of the event, like being the 8th fastest in the world. Pretty sure I could dig more examples, but I prefer to keep it short, I felt it looked pretty bad.

I'll sum up my opinion in a single sentence, a federation can get away with being more picky with qualifying standards if it has strength in depth, like Canada (in order to stay with Pair skating), but not in the case of Netherlands when there's litterally one single pair (Danilova/Tsiba) because the other one (Osipova/Epstein) split

 

[FlossieH]

What could they realistically improve to get that score? Supposing they have an amazing summer of training...
Also, if they forfeit a spot in January, does it go to whoever places 4th at the Beijing qualifier?

Higher value jumps e.g. 3Lz instead of 3S (but could be risky if they can't land the jump consistently), higher level on StSeq, level 4 death spiral or higher value one, higher value jump sequence in free. All of these carry a risk of a lower score, though, if they aren't executed cleanly.

That can't be right. 10th place is 183.01.

My calculation agrees with Miriam's calculation.

I misread the earlier post and calculated the average between 1st and 18th, not between 10th and 18th. Miriam's score is correct, but still needs a completely clean skate and favourable judging.

 

[aroundtheworld778]

Higher value jumps e.g. 3Lz instead of 3S (but could be risky if they can't land the jump consistently), higher level on StSeq, level 4 death spiral or higher value one, higher value jump sequence in free. All of these carry a risk of a lower score, though, if they aren't executed cleanly.


I misread the earlier post and calculated the average between 1st and 18th, not between 10th and 18th. Miriam's score is correct, but still needs a completely clean skate and favourable judging.

Whew.. 174 is very doable for them. They will get it unless they get injured.