Yeah, it's a dire dire situation for her. Not only does she have to make her skating seem less labored, but she would also have to learn to rotate and land her jumps again and execute them well enough to stop getting -GOEs. All of that that would only get her close to a top 6 finish at your average Grand Prix event. What I am getting at is that even if she manages to gel her jump technique with incredibly hard work, (being consistent with a new technique is one of the most difficult challenges a skater has to face) she'll still end up in the middle of the pack and nowhere close to the top because her skating in general is sluggish and uninspiring. (She is very far from looking like she moves with ease, fluidity, and verve. To succeed, a skater has to look nimble and agile on the ice.)
Ladies Free Skate
- Thread starter ImaginaryPogue
- Start date
Yeah, it's a dire dire situation for her. Not only does she have to make her skating seem less labored, but she would also have to learn to rotate and land her jumps again and execute them well enough to stop getting -GOEs. All of that that would only get her close to a top 6 finish at your average Grand Prix event. What I am getting at is that even if she manages to gel her jump technique with incredibly hard work, (being consistent with a new technique is one of the most difficult challenges a skater has to face) she'll still end up in the middle of the pack and nowhere close to the top because her skating in general is sluggish and uninspiring. (She is very far from looking like she moves with ease, fluidity, and verve. To succeed, a skater has to look nimble and agile on the ice.)
Well, as per her sister's posts on Caroline's FB page, Caroline has been working her butt off this off-season on correcting her flip. That her flip now looks perfectly normal compared to the monstrosity it was last season is indicative of how much work Caroline must've put into fixing it; it wouldn't surprise me that her other jumps and elements fell by the wayside as a result. This is the first season since she's started major work on fixing her technique and people are already expecting miracles. Lovely.
- Joined
- Mar 27, 2010
Yep, just search the skaters' names on youtube and look for the latest videos
I'd lay off on the doom and gloom for now. She is only 17 and has shown improvement each time we've seen her. I still say she goes to Rafael! He would FORCE speed and jump technique in her!
- Joined
- Nov 12, 2009
Idk if he'd take her. Plus she JUST made a coaching change, so let's give Tammy a chance before Caroline ditches her for someone else. I just wish Caroline skated for a country that was less competitive because then she would get more experience and chances to compete while she's going through this transitional stage, instead of being overshadowed by other skaters. I hope she can make top 10 at nationals this season but there are a lot of strong ladies this year so even that's not a garuantee. I admire her perseverance though and hope she continues to make good changes.
Three ladies,
(1) best GPF result
(2) best Nationals result
(3) federation recommendation
Mao's in for sure (either #2 or #3). My gut feeing is that Kanako and Miki (#1), who's pretty consistent, will get the go, leaving Akiko out. Too bad. Her programs for this season are not as good as her last, but I enjoy her more than Miki. An upset could leave Miki out and Akiko in, but Kanko's in for sure. She's getting loads of media coverage as the rising star who combines the best out of Yu-na and Mao. Don't think Akiko gets as much love & it's not like the Japanese fed doesn't curb a few rules for a media favorite (Miki & Yukari 2006).
I haven't seen the programs yet, but Kanako got straight +2 GOE (although with 0.7 factor) for her 3T-3T
Does that make her the second lady with a 3-3+2.0 GOE after Yu-na? Congratulations to the medalists, esp. Kanako for her first senior gold!
I am not sure if she combines the best out of the two. Kanako has a nice triple toe but she flutzes and her flip and loop are not as strong either. It has prevented her from going for more difficult 3-3 combos. Also, her posture and lines are not as good as Mao's. However, she does have good speed and a lot of energy. In some ways, she reminds me of Yukari more than Yuna or Mao.
- Joined
- Mar 27, 2010
ITA. She does not have the excellent technique of Yu Na, and doesn't quite have as soft knees as Mao (Kanako's knees are still very good). She also seems to be restricted (kind of like Mirai) to the sugar-overload type of emoting. She doesn't remind me of Yukari, either, because Yukari, IMO, was quite a delicate, precise skater and Kanako is a purely energetic skater.
- Joined
- Feb 17, 2010
I don't know if anyone else noticed this, but it seems like Kanako's flutz is getting better. You could tell she was trying to hold the outside edge longer, and when she did flip over to the inside edge, it wasn't as deep as it was last year.
I agree. The skaters who can do appealing spirals (real spirals imo) incorporated them in the programs and the ones who don't usually leave them out so therefore there's less ugly spirals to view. I do miss seeing the good spirals more often but Michelle and Sasha have moved on so...
I've actually seen the spectacular spirals with the men (Sawyer) and a few of the pairs.
To me, it seems like she's trying to disguise it rather than really fix the issue. It was better here but at NHK, it was the same as always and it showed in the GOE marks. If she were really tackling the issue, the jump would be more unstable (more pops/falls).
Haven't read any of this thread, just arrived back after a 3 hour ride, and here are my thoughts from today's Ladies FS:
Jenna McCorkell -- she has a monster 3L jump, I honestly thought she was going to jump over the fence & land on us! (8^O Seriously, she took it to the edge, right in front of me, awesome to see in person. Btw, I think she was the one that had the long lovely glide spiral into it.
On the downside, it was heartbreaking to see her get absolutely NO presents/gifts from anyone. She's the only lady that didn't receive any. I felt bad, but I only had gifts for my 3 favs (aka Rachael, Caroline, Carolina). Gosh I was I had something to give her. 
On the upside, it was great to see her & her husband Kevin Van Der Perren (along with the Helgesson sister; the one that skated first) all sitting together watching the rest of the event. I kept telling my niece "go up there & get their autographs" because she kept bugging me about them, but alas she was too shy to go up there & talk to them.
Viktoria Helgesson -- Wow, she is impressive in person, not just her beauty (she's a drop dead pure bred Nordic beauty, the real thing), but also her skating! She's a classic skater with beautiful edges & technique. It was a joy to watch her skate!^)
Alexe Gilles -- she has such gorgeous jumps, it's a shame she's turning out to be a headcase. But she has a lightness of being, she makes you smile, she just keeps going like the energizer bunny. Btw, I swear she looks exactly like Carole Lombard (the love of Clark Gable's life), reincarnation anyone? On a side note, as I was leaving my niece spotted Alexe Gilles way up above us, and wanted to get her autograph. So as I was getting pen & paper ready for my niece, whom was once again too shy to approach her, Alexe disappeared.
Mae Berenice Meite -- she's like a magestic amazon out there! Shades of the Williams sisters & Surya Bonaly put together. Her jumps are huge! (8^O
Elene G -- she looked exactly like a cupcake out there. She really has to tone down the fake blonde hair (it's ridiculous when someone isn't a natural blonde & dyes their hair blonde; the only real blondes are the Nordic beauties ala the Helgesson sisters & Alexe Gilles). That said, she really does skate faster than everyone out there, including Carolina Kostner! And she has such a charming personality with a lot of spunk, it makes you smile. Her jumps are textbook perfect, especially the monster 3L, her only problem is doing them on a consistent basis. And on a shallow note, she's so very tiny in person, but the t.v. set makes her appear larger than what she is, having curves is cruel when it comes to television.
Joshi Helgesson -- all I recall about her is that she looks you dead in the eye, she's one of those skaters that isn't afraid to look at the audience, lol.
Caroline Zhang -- what a joy it was to see her skate in person for the very first time!^) She still retains her elegance & charm on the ice. And she really isn't that slow on the ice, only on the 2A.
Carolina Kostner -- ah, she had it in the bag, but crumbled at the end. She really stands alone amongst the rest in terms of posture, straight long legs, height, beauty, dazzling 100-watt smile, elegance, et al. However, she isn't that fast imho, about average like the rest, definitely not a speed demon like Elene G.
Kanako Murakami -- she is my honest humble opinion wayyyyyyyyy overrated. Her legs are raggedy and when she jumps she lands with her chest almost touching the ice, not straight up & down the way one should, just hugely disappointing to see her skate in person. Her win reminds me of those that used to say of the Russians "skating while Russian", however nowadays it's "skating while Japanese".
Rachael Flatt -- WOW, she overexceeded whatever expectations I might have had beforehand! Seriously, in person she's simply A-W-E-S-O-M-E!!!!!
She skates with lots of pizzazz, charm, style, and effervescence. And she skates as fast as the rest, la verdad, it was more than a joy to watch her skate, it was an honor. 
To top it all off, she skated *clean*, was simply perfect. Much much deserved standing ovation, way overdue, Rachael Flatt is simply on another plane than the rest of the girls. In person her aura is crystalline, she makes you smile, and cheer! My favorite by far of this entire Skate America. Now after seeing her skate in person, I say with all sincereity she was robbed of two gold medals in this season's GPs, and also of a higher placing at both the Olympics & Worlds. And I won't change my mind on that.
GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO RACHAEL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
arty:
Jenna McCorkell -- she has a monster 3L jump, I honestly thought she was going to jump over the fence & land on us! (8^O Seriously, she took it to the edge, right in front of me, awesome to see in person. Btw, I think she was the one that had the long lovely glide spiral into it.
On the downside, it was heartbreaking to see her get absolutely NO presents/gifts from anyone. She's the only lady that didn't receive any. I felt bad, but I only had gifts for my 3 favs (aka Rachael, Caroline, Carolina). Gosh I was I had something to give her. On the upside, it was great to see her & her husband Kevin Van Der Perren (along with the Helgesson sister; the one that skated first) all sitting together watching the rest of the event. I kept telling my niece "go up there & get their autographs" because she kept bugging me about them, but alas she was too shy to go up there & talk to them.Viktoria Helgesson -- Wow, she is impressive in person, not just her beauty (she's a drop dead pure bred Nordic beauty, the real thing), but also her skating! She's a classic skater with beautiful edges & technique. It was a joy to watch her skate!
^)Alexe Gilles -- she has such gorgeous jumps, it's a shame she's turning out to be a headcase.
But she has a lightness of being, she makes you smile, she just keeps going like the energizer bunny. Btw, I swear she looks exactly like Carole Lombard (the love of Clark Gable's life), reincarnation anyone? On a side note, as I was leaving my niece spotted Alexe Gilles way up above us, and wanted to get her autograph. So as I was getting pen & paper ready for my niece, whom was once again too shy to approach her, Alexe disappeared. Mae Berenice Meite -- she's like a magestic amazon out there! Shades of the Williams sisters & Surya Bonaly put together. Her jumps are huge! (8^O
Elene G -- she looked exactly like a cupcake out there. She really has to tone down the fake blonde hair (it's ridiculous when someone isn't a natural blonde & dyes their hair blonde; the only real blondes are the Nordic beauties ala the Helgesson sisters & Alexe Gilles). That said, she really does skate faster than everyone out there, including Carolina Kostner! And she has such a charming personality with a lot of spunk, it makes you smile.
Her jumps are textbook perfect, especially the monster 3L, her only problem is doing them on a consistent basis. And on a shallow note, she's so very tiny in person, but the t.v. set makes her appear larger than what she is, having curves is cruel when it comes to television.Joshi Helgesson -- all I recall about her is that she looks you dead in the eye, she's one of those skaters that isn't afraid to look at the audience, lol.
Caroline Zhang -- what a joy it was to see her skate in person for the very first time!
^) She still retains her elegance & charm on the ice. And she really isn't that slow on the ice, only on the 2A.Carolina Kostner -- ah, she had it in the bag, but crumbled at the end.
She really stands alone amongst the rest in terms of posture, straight long legs, height, beauty, dazzling 100-watt smile, elegance, et al. However, she isn't that fast imho, about average like the rest, definitely not a speed demon like Elene G.Kanako Murakami -- she is my honest humble opinion wayyyyyyyyy overrated. Her legs are raggedy and when she jumps she lands with her chest almost touching the ice, not straight up & down the way one should, just hugely disappointing to see her skate in person. Her win reminds me of those that used to say of the Russians "skating while Russian", however nowadays it's "skating while Japanese".
Rachael Flatt -- WOW, she overexceeded whatever expectations I might have had beforehand! Seriously, in person she's simply A-W-E-S-O-M-E!!!!!
She skates with lots of pizzazz, charm, style, and effervescence. And she skates as fast as the rest, la verdad, it was more than a joy to watch her skate, it was an honor. To top it all off, she skated *clean*, was simply perfect. Much much deserved standing ovation, way overdue, Rachael Flatt is simply on another plane than the rest of the girls. In person her aura is crystalline, she makes you smile, and cheer! My favorite by far of this entire Skate America. Now after seeing her skate in person, I say with all sincereity she was robbed of two gold medals in this season's GPs, and also of a higher placing at both the Olympics & Worlds. And I won't change my mind on that. GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO RACHAEL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
arty:- Joined
- Nov 12, 2009
Kanako reminds me a lot of Mirai (with not as good spins). She's fast, a good jumper, very expressive, and fun to watch but her programs are almost always cutesy, and when they aren't, they seem a little boring. Cutesy works for her now because she's so tiny and energetic and cute, but if she has a Meissner or Zhang esque physical transformation in the near future she may find herself in a bit of a rut artistically, and will have no choice but to develop a new style. I mean, besides Leonova, do any skaters continue to the perky cutesy programs past the age of like 16?
- Joined
- Feb 17, 2007
I'm going to have to be blunt here. Caroline is sluggish and does not move effortlessly across the ice for just one reason .... she put on weight. That's bad and that's good. The bad is that a competitive athlete must watch her weight. In very few sports is this not true. I have no idea how her weight got away from her like that.
So where is the good? The good is that this is a problem that can be fixed. Perhaps not easily, but it can be fixed. If Caroline can slim down and tone up, that fixes several of her problems. She will get better rotation on her jumps, more speed, faster spins, faster spirals, more endurance, and the appearance of effortless ease the judges look for. With all the work Caroline has done, I don’t see a single problem a few less pounds can’t fix.
- Joined
- Nov 12, 2009
Mama Zhang is rather stocky, so Caroline may not be able to do much about her current body, sort of like how Rachael can't do much about her body. Caroline could maybe lose a few pounds but it won't change her bone structure, the biggest thing I've noticed is that she's filled out mainly through the but and thighs, making her more bottom heavy which makes the jumps harder. Losing weight won't change the way she is built.
The thing is weight is both a result of genetics and behavior. While Caroline may be genetically programmed to look like her mother, behaviorally she may not be at all like her mother in terms of her workout level and diet.
Which means that we can't know for sure whether she can or can't slim down. (Apology if anyone finds this discussion offensive. It is a difficult issue that athletes have to deal with the pressure of maintaining a body that's much leaner and fitter than that of non-athletes. So that's why this discussion seems like dangerous territory.)
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Nice to see that someone who was actually at the event also feels that Flatt was the best skater. Thanks Cop.
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Elene G -- she looked exactly like a cupcake out there. She really has to tone down the fake blonde hair (it's ridiculous when someone isn't a natural blonde & dyes their hair blonde; the only real blondes are the Nordic beauties ala the Helgesson sisters & Alexe Gilles). That said, she really does skate faster than everyone out there, including Carolina Kostner! And she has such a charming personality with a lot of spunk, it makes you smile.
I am still waiting for Elene to have the skate of her life ;-( But it will come one of these days!
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