Senior Men's LP (starts at 4pm EST)

[jaylee]

Men on U.S. Four Continents Team are @jeremyabbottpcf, @Armin_hammer, @Adaripp...alternates are @BrandonMroz, @DouglasRazzano, @Jonnaye05

http://twitter.com/#!/USFigureSkating/status/31872243856318464

 

[Layfan]

I'll just never like it. It's too easy for skaters to get lucky one day, and it's too easy for the top skaters to get weighed down by the pressure one day. Essentially, we are picking our World teams based largely on luck. Sad, I think.

In this case, this argument would carry more weight if Jeremy "got lucky" more often and had actually medaled at a worlds or an Olympics. As it is, he "gets weighed" down consistently by the pressure of the international competition and there is zero guarantee that he wouldn't flounder his way off the top 10 at this year's worlds. ESPECIALLY if the U.S. had gifted him on the team and pinned their hopes on him that way. Talk about the worst kind of pressure. He'd go into to worlds thinking "wow, I didn't earn this spot and if I mess up what will people think?" Recipe for disaster.

 

[ImaginaryPogue]

Abbott, Rippon and Armin are going to 4CC.

Dornbush, Bradley and Miner going to Worlds.

 

[seniorita]

Absolutely not. What is it about fourth place that people don't seem to get?

Aaaaa I dont like these rules when they dont serve my people
I do, I get the 4th place, on the other hand now can we send Mirai who sits in the 3rd? It is not the 4th.

 

[ImaginaryPogue]

That, and the fact there's a medal attached anyway!

 

[wallylutz]

I'll just never like it. It's too easy for skaters to get lucky one day, and it's too easy for the top skaters to get weighed down by the pressure one day. Essentially, we are picking our World teams based largely on luck. Sad, I think.

The difference between 3rd and 4th is like 0.16 Seriously, is the difference even significant?

 

[ivy]

Thanks for the research wallylutz - much appreciated

 

[Layfan]

Abbott, Rippon and Armin are going to 4CC.

Dornbush, Bradley and Miner going to Worlds.

None of the medalists are going to 4CC? Why I wonder? Did they all decline that fast? And why would they?

 

[Violet Bliss]

Abbott, Rippon and Armin are going to 4CC.

Dornbush, Bradley and Miner going to Worlds.

The 4CC team may arguably be the stronger team! Let's wait for the scores from both competitions. It'd be like another (hidden) competition for these men.

 

[Mathman]

I'll just never like it. It's too easy for skaters to get lucky one day, and it's too easy for the top skaters to get weighed down by the pressure one day. Essentially, we are picking our World teams based largely on luck. Sad, I think.

I may be naive and maybe even historically wrong about this whole topic and the traditions of U.S. Figure Skating.

But it seems to me that the USFSA has always been more interested in running its domestic national figure skating program than in finagling for advantage in international competition.

I like that. There are a hundreds of figure skating clubs in the U.S. and tens of thousands of aspiring skaters. Every one of these youngsters can dream of making it to Nationals, having a skate-of-their-life, and representing the stars and stripes at the world championship.

I think that's kind of cool. (Opee and Aunt Bee think so, too. )

 

[wallylutz]

I'm for sending Dornbush & Miner to World's for the experience. It's not like Abbott & Bradley are going to retain our 3 spots for men at World's anyway.

Well, Abbott and Rippon did get the 3 spots last year. So yes, a case can be made he can do it again if he has already done it. Personally, I think sending Miner over Abbott for 0.16 point, the difference of a single toe, is not a wise decision. Russians would never do that, it's illogical.

 

[#1Kerryfan]

The 4CC team may arguably be the stronger team! Let's wait for the scores from both competitions. It'd be like another (hidden) competition for these men.

We'll see what happens. Again, I'm not sure what I think of the World team. Never even seen Ross skate before. I guess it was all about who had a better day. Again though, I think the strongest team would be Jeremy, Adam and Ryan.

 

[ana]

This two guys Miner and Dormush has not experiences in senior competition. I do not think is a good idea to send them. I hope Jeremy or Adam will be win 4CC.

 

[ivy]

4CC should be fun - if we get to see it! Don't know NBC/Uni Sports is carrying it

 

[ImaginaryPogue]

I hope Jeremy wins. Or Dai.

 

[Mathman]

Please refer to page 15 of the Technical Panel handbook for Single Skating linked here: http://www.isu.org/vsite/vnavsite/page/directory/0,10853,4844-185235-202457-nav-list,00.html

I quote: "Step out or touch down with free foot with weight transfer after first jump plus another jump"

If a skater steps out on the first jump and immediately after that executes another jump, the element does not remain a jump combination and will be called as follows: Short Program: “First Jump + Combo”; the continuation will be ignored by the Technical Panel.
Free Skating: “First Jump + Sequence” (or “First Jump + Second Jump + Sequence” if the definition of a sequence is still fulfilled). The same applies to a jump combination consisting of 3 jumps.

So the correct decision in this case is to simply ignore the 2nd jump performed and the Panel made the right call.

Hope this answers your and IP's question.

Thank you!

(For some reason I can't open this document from the ISU site -- I think my Acrobat Reader is too old.)

 

[wallylutz]

Thanks for the research wallylutz - much appreciated

NP, I alredy know the rules, it only took me like 2 minutes to find the right quotation, so that you guys can read it yourself and not take my words for it.

 

[Violet Bliss]

That would be interesting under 6.0 factored placement judging. Dornbush would have won on the tie-breaker, otherwise places 1 through 6 stay the same.

As for who will be the best on another day, we will have to wait and see. :yes:

Dornbush would have little chance for the podium under 6.0. The top three from the TP skate for the podium regardless of TP placements and for someone out of the first three spots in the TP, it takes some convulated twist of fate and calculation to win or medal.

 

[Mathman]

This two guys Miner and Dormush has not experiences in senior competition.

Everybody's first Worlds is their first Worlds. Let's give them a chance. We can always complain afterwards if they mess up. :yes:

 

[siberia82]

Russians would never do that, it's illogical.

I agree with you, but in North America, the federations form the World team based on Nationals results 99.9% of the time. That's just the way it is. I really don't like this system, but after watching a number of Canadian and US championships over the years, I've know that I simply have to accept it. :disapp: