- Joined
- Jun 21, 2003
I absolutely disagree with this statement. You should always, always, always judge the performance that you see on the ice, independently of other considerations.
Flatt should go to school, her peak is already in the past
- Thread starter pangtongfan
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I absolutely disagree with this statement. You should always, always, always judge the performance that you see on the ice, independently of other considerations.
- Joined
- Nov 22, 2010
The idea of "going with the more talented skater in a close situation" is such backward thinking at this point. The new system was put into place to avoid favoritism. Judges are supposed to award points based on the performance that see at that moment, all previous performances and "potential" aside. USFSA had every right to choose Mirai over Rachael when selecting the world team, regardless of their placements and scores.
exactly. I was arguing earlier that any "fudging" should be done by the Committee in determining whether to deviate from order of finish to select the World team. In this case though I think top 2 is fine...although I have reservations about sending Flatt again, Nagasu hasn't really proven with her disastrous freeskates that she'd fare much better.
Rachael's always bugged me a bit, but she's really growing on me. The SP is an improvement, still not wild about the LP, but it was her gala skate at Nat'l that I really enjoyed. It felt strong, mature and free - of course that's easier to pull off in an exhibition number, but I'd like to see more choreography/music selection along these lines if she keeps skating competitively.
One question - I understand she has low back problems that limit her flexibility. Does this also limit the level she's able to obtain in layback spins? And will that always out her at a disadvantage in the SP.
ETA - 2nd question - does anyone know if she can defer Stanford for another year? If she can't I would assume that she can reapply later with a good chance of acceptance - but might that also affect her decision to continue?
One question - I understand she has low back problems that limit her flexibility. Does this also limit the level she's able to obtain in layback spins? And will that always out her at a disadvantage in the SP.
ETA - 2nd question - does anyone know if she can defer Stanford for another year? If she can't I would assume that she can reapply later with a good chance of acceptance - but might that also affect her decision to continue?
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- Joined
- Jun 21, 2003
^ In priciple, it shouldn't matter. You get levels by changing feet, changing direction, changing position, unusual entry, holding a position for so many revolutions -- stuff like that. Having a pretty position and a flexible back might give you higher GOEs, but not a higher level.
For instance, in the short program at the Grand Prix Final, Rachael and Alissa both got level 3 on their layback. But Alissa got all 2's and 3's in GOE, while Rachael got straight 0's across the board.
For instance, in the short program at the Grand Prix Final, Rachael and Alissa both got level 3 on their layback. But Alissa got all 2's and 3's in GOE, while Rachael got straight 0's across the board.
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Here's the video or Rachael's GPF final sp:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cT735H51xNM
The spin, to my eye, isn't a very pretty one, but she does get 3 positions and each for the require revs it appears and earns a level 3. I watched her layback from Nat'ls - only 2 positions there, with the 2nd not held very long - only level 1, but a liittle pos GoE from the judges. Great to know she can get a level 3 layback though!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cT735H51xNM
The spin, to my eye, isn't a very pretty one, but she does get 3 positions and each for the require revs it appears and earns a level 3. I watched her layback from Nat'ls - only 2 positions there, with the 2nd not held very long - only level 1, but a liittle pos GoE from the judges. Great to know she can get a level 3 layback though!
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- Jun 16, 2010
That is not how most countries judge Nationals and not how the U.S even always judges Nationals.
- Joined
- Jun 21, 2003
The more to their shame and to the detriment of the sport.
Seriously. I know comparisons to other sports bother some people but can you imagine any other sport - soccer or track or whatever - declaring someone the winner of a game or race because that person has won more stuff in the past or has been more accurate or faster in practice?
Please. What on Earth would be the point of a competition if everyone doesn't have an equal chance of winning?
- Joined
- Jul 11, 2003
^^^^
I agree, but it can be worse. Sometime ago a judge explained his credit for a missed 3A, because he saw the skater make the 3A during the practice session.
I'm still against judges being permtted at practice sessions.
I agree, but it can be worse. Sometime ago a judge explained his credit for a missed 3A, because he saw the skater make the 3A during the practice session.
I'm still against judges being permtted at practice sessions.
Exactly, I cannot agree more with you. That is the exact explanation Patrick Chan came up with explaining how he won at Skate Canada and judges held him up, as they knew he can do it, watching him in practice. That is a load of crap. While I am delighted about his current form and accomplishment, I still belive the Skate Canada first place was a gift for him.
I was totally in agreement with USFSA's decision about leaving Nagasu of the team for Worlds, as she has proven one thing, that she cannot be trusted. No matter how great potential she has, she is goofing usually one of her programs enough to take herself out of contention. The harsh words Frank had both to her in the K&C and in the press were very conclusive for me. I think he will dump her soon.
Yeah...who was Bob Beamon before he set the unbelievable long jump record in 1968? What if they'd ratified someone else's jump better just because Beamon didn't have the best practices or the best record up until then? Or afterward, either. But on that day, he rocked the track and field world.
I know that sometimes it looks as though a country's federation is shooting itself in the foot by sending the top finishers instead of a historically better skater who had a bad day. But it's a short-term benefit with a long-term downside, because the process becomes tainted by favoritism that can eventually close out promising newcomers. Or oldies who could give the skate of their lives in the Olympics and net their country a medal...like, say, Paul Wylie in 1992.
IA with everything you said. I watched her Nationals gala exhibition and I loved it as well. Barring the GPF, Rachael has made tremendous improvements in her skating, musicality, and spins. Her catchfoot position has improved, so has the flexibility in the ina bauer. She has always had a decent, if not good, layback with genuine turnout--something rarely seen today.
I don't know if she can defer for another year, but if she can't I will miss her. I hope she skates her best at Worlds.
Er, who's Bob Beaman?
:But seriously, I completely agree. Give the Paul Wylies a chance when they earn it!!! :thumbsup:
Interesting point. I haven't really thought it through or heard many arguments for or against but off the top of my head, what you say makes sense.
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Er, who's Bob Beaman?
But seriously, I completely agree. Give the Paul Wylies a chance when they earn it!!! :thumbsup:
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His name is Beamon, a little track & Field history here for ya:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DEt_Xgg8dzc
I am happy Olympia brought this example up, because in track and field, the Nr. 1 Olympic sport in the summer, the US trials are as cruel as they can be, no matter what kind of multiple world champ and record holder you are, and you could be the ultimate favorite even, if you do not show up in form on that particular day (injured or not) it does not matter, you will have to be in the top 3 to qualify for the US team, otherwise you are left home. Period. There are absolutely NO EXCEPTIONS. And that is how it should be in any sport.
Oh, you can't tell that story often enough, Herios; thanks so much for posting the link. I recommend it to one and all for viewing. Beamon broke the existing record by almost two feet, which even assuming help from the wind and the altitude is pretty unbelievable. My favorite moment is when he realizes what he's done, and his legs just collapse from under him. It is one of the greatest events in sports. You don't even have to understand or follow track and field to be wowed by it.
Couldn't agree more. Unfortunately, more easily said than done.
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