ISU Where Will Worlds BE (formerly) JAPAN QUAKE FOR WORLDS

[Tonichelle]

Do the figure skating tour/trip packages come insured? If not, how much are travellers out if they don't buy their own? I can't even imagine the cost that will be chalked up as a loss financially.

 

[gmyers]

Wally said Russia won one gold at vancouver but they won three but the point was Russia eager to be powerful in winter sports again and that they are! So they want to host everything and maybe comfort with home advantage could help their skaters as well! Bonus! And Russia would be expensive for oridnary fans and maybe the turnout wouldn't be so great because of the expense and it wouldn't make a lot of money but that would really affect any worlds held in 2011 so I think it might be overlooked.

 

[wallylutz]

Do the figure skating tour/trip packages come insured? If not, how much are travellers out if they don't buy their own? I can't even imagine the cost that will be chalked up as a loss financially.

Good question but I don't know the answer since I never had to buy any of such package before - don't need one. They are usually middle-age women, between 40-70 year old, some are as old as 90+ something, I was amazed by that one, she is incredibly knowledgeable and clear even at her almost centennial age. I don't think those are ultra rich people - they have some money but they are clearly very conscious of what they pay and how much they pay and try to find ways to save, based on my interactions with many of them over the years. For example, they will pay for good seats, even at a premium but they will try to save on other things, anyway they could like travel expense. If the tour company fails to fulfill something promised, they will demand that the situation be corrected to their satisfaction - I know because I heard them complaining at almost every single World Championship I have been to. So if I have to take a guess, if the tour company can't fulfill the agreement to bring those people from their home to whatever World Championship for X days at the agreed hotels and provided the agreed event tickets, then they will have to refund those purchases. I don't see how they could do any otherwise because the contract is not fulfilled. Otherwise, the customers could probably dispute the charges with the credit card companies and ask for a refund since not delivering the promised service is one of those clauses where the credit card company will refund you the money. If you are a tour company like Dash Tour, you are probably scared to death as to what would happen next. Even if the event is not canceled, I imagine the fact having to deal with some last minute airfare to Russia, extremely expensive hotels in Moscow and volatile exchange rate would probably make you sleepless already.

I was told by those female fans that the tour companies usually make a big deal about the foreign exchange rate - something I didn't know before because the tour companies don't like to assume too much of possible loss from pre-payment in the customers' home currencies like US and Canadian dollars or even British Pounds if closer to the event date, there is an adverse movement of the hosting country's currency vs. the customers' paid currencies. So they said pre-payment is actually limited to some point but I am not sure how that works and with the World only being canceled one week before, I guess that's a moot point. I can't think of anything else related to the tour company, have to ask someone who have actually bought such package before, maybe some members here at GS has?

 

[wallylutz]

Wally said Russia won one gold at vancouver but they won three but the point was Russia eager to be powerful in winter sports again and that they are! So they want to host everything and maybe comfort with home advantage could help their skaters as well! Bonus! And Russia would be expensive for oridnary fans and maybe the turnout wouldn't be so great because of the expense and it wouldn't make a lot of money but that would really affect any worlds held in 2011 so I think it might be overlooked.

Sorry, I stand corrected then.

 

[Olympia]

I know that a lot of fans would want to attend the "revised" Worlds, but personally, I would be satisfied even if the Worlds was put on before an empty arena, as long as it could take place. (I'm sure local fans and dignitaries would be happy to fill the seats, so that won't be an issue.) Of course, I don't want to make light of the fact that the logistics of refunding money for the Tokyo Worlds will be a nightmare for whatever companies handled the original transactions. They are yet another group of casualties in this catastrophe.

 

[Serious Business]

I understand that hosting Worlds in May will cause some skaters to have to choose between performing on tour or a show or attending Worlds. However, none of the skaters themselves have raised this objection (correct me if I'm wrong though) only Cinquanta did. On the other hand, a number of skaters have spoken up for having the World Championships sooner rather than later. This may not apply to all skaters, but I would guess that most of them would rather have Worlds sooner even if it conflicts with shows than to have to do it at the start of next season. I think most skaters understand this is a most extraordinary circumstance, and that giving up some shows and the income is part of the damage the disaster in Japan has inflicted on them.

 

[seniorita]

Now, Moscow is also an incredibly expensive city. By some credible studies for a few years now, it's probably the most expensive city in the World, if you think Tokyo is already very expensive. Any reasonable 4 star hotel in Moscow would easily run between $350-$500 USD / night and the event lasts a whole week, so you do the math.

I dont know what have changed since last year Cup of Russia, but the prices are nothing like that, plus my initial Easter trip was to be in Japan and I had done lots of research about hotels, trains and metro. I compared Moscow to Brussels, Paris and London and I didnt find it such expensive as I was told to expect..as a tourist of course, if I was to buy a house there ..I dont know. I remember commenting it here when i had come back from Cor. As a tourist metro ticket is too cheap for european standars, the 20 tickets around 12 euros(in brussels 10 rides cost 12+ euros, one ride 2 euros) , food and drinks a normal price 10-20 euros unless you go to 5 star Michelen restaurants, and there is always great food on the street! Museums ok, arena tickets were maybe the least expensive I have paid for gp and food and the goodies in the arena were cheap price, taxi (official ones) were around 20 euros from Bellarus (?) train station to arena. Aerostar hotel we had stayed -which is usually the official of megastar arena was around 150-180 twin room, and this was the most expensive in the arena vicinity, there was 4 star hotels with 80-100 euros per double. My highlight: Aerostar coffee and cheesecake 4-5 euros.
Visa costed for me 100 euros because I had a passport delay of last minute but normally up to a week before the visa costs 30 euros.
The best thing to avoid exchange fraud ιis to pay by card or use your bankcard in local atm machines, all in all the last day I had more money that I thought I would have and I spent my rest of budjet in Bosco boutique, that was expensive though!
What else a skating fan wants?

 

[oksanafan]

Apologies, if this has already been posted. The following has been released by the ISU:-

http://www.isu.org/vsite/vcontent/content/transnews/0,10869,4844-128590-19728-18885-312898-3787-4771-layout160-129898-news-item,00.html

Press release reads:-

"Since the outbreak of the crisis, the ISU was and remains in close contact with the Japan Skating Federation (JSF) who in turn did likewise with the competent Japanese authorities. After having explored all possible options to maintain the 2011 ISU World Figure Skating Championships in Japan, the JSF has now informed the ISU that regretfully and reluctantly they must decline hosting the Championships in Japan. Also, the JSF agreed to the postponement of the ISU World Team Trophy initially scheduled to be held in April 2011 to be held instead in April 2012 in Japan at a place and exact dates to be agreed upon. The ISU agrees with this conclusion.

While the ISU gave priority to find a solution to keep the 2011 ISU World Figure Skating Championship in Japan, the ISU fully understands the JSF decision. As we all struggle to come to terms with the unimaginable tragedies following the monstrous earthquake of March 11, the ISU reiterates its expressions of grief and sympathy to all those affected by loss of life, injury and loss of homes. The ISU admires the resilience, strength of character and faith of the Japanese people in recovering from this tragedy.

In light of this catastrophe, the consequences on sports events and in particular the ISU World Figure Skating Championships and ISU World Team Trophy become relatively secondary. Nevertheless, it is the ISU’s duty to find the best possible solution for a possible rescheduling and relocation of the Events taking into account all points of view.

Based on spontaneous proposals from ISU Member federations received to host the Championships and possibly additional Members who might be interested and available, the ISU Council is evaluating the different options taking into account all relevant aspects and points of view. This primarily involves the tremendous logistical challenge to organize and conduct such major Event on short notice. Also, the Council cannot ignore legal and contractual constraints as well as timing conflicts with other skating or sporting events.

Considering the scope and complexity of the situation, quick evaluations and decisions were and remain extremely difficult to make and the ISU counts on the understanding of the Figure Skating community for taking a minimum but reasonable amount of time to reach conclusions in cooperation with the concerned ISU Members and entities.

The ISU Council is conscious that a solution satisfying all points of view is probably difficult to be achieved and begs all involved for their understanding and cooperation in these truly exceptional circumstances.

An update of the situation will be communicated in the coming days.

Ottavio Cinquanta Fredi Schmid
President Director General"

 

[bigsisjiejie]

I'm reading this latest ISU announcement as Worlds in Japan is completely off the table for 2011, and that includes October. So now it would seem there are two remaining options: cancellation or relocation. Corollary is no WTT this year at all--which all things considered, is probably a wise decision.

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

Thank you Oksanafan - I read that this morning. It seems the key paragraph:

Based on spontaneous proposals from ISU Member federations received to host the Championships and possibly additional Members who might be interested and available, the ISU Council is evaluating the different options taking into account all relevant aspects and points of view. This primarily involves the tremendous logistical challenge to organize and conduct such major Event on short notice. Also, the Council cannot ignore legal and contractual constraints as well as timing conflicts with other skating or sporting events.

I think much of the decision lies with the legal and contractual constraints. It's still await and see.

 

[jatale]

It sounds to me like the bureaucrats and all their red-tape are in firm control of the situation, which means any decision will probably come way to late to be of any use. What the ISU needs is a MAJOR red-tape CUTTER in control, so that everything can be expedited with a new Worlds scheduled to occur within 6-weeks from now. It can be done.

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

There is an ISU COUNTCIL dealing with this as well. It's not just Cinquanta. Apparently, they are not in such a RUSH either.

Anyone know how the COUNCIL operates? Who and what country they are from.

I'm of the ilk that a rush decision could be wrong which would be worse than a no decision.

 

[Mathman]

Anyone know how the COUNCIL operates? Who and what country they are from.

I don't know how they operate, but here are the members.

President
Ottavio Cinquanta Italy

1st Vice President
Figure Skating: David Dore Canada

2nd Vice President
Speed Skating: Jan Dijkema Netherlands

Members:

Figure Skating
Marie Lundmark Finland
Junko Hiramatsu Japan
Phyllis Howard USA
Tjasa Andrée-Prosenc Slovenia

Speed Skating
György Martos Hungary
German Panov Russia
Li Lan China
Roland Maillard Switzerland

 

[Sylvia]

ISU Council members are listed on this page: http://www.isu.org/vsite/vcontent/p...161657-178872-20148-73966-custom-item,00.html

They appear to have more power these days and can make certain decisions without going through the voting of the ISU Congress (held every 2 years).

 

[Violet Bliss]

^^^^ I think the most important members are the lawyers and the accountants, who, alas, are not likely inclined to expedite/rush the process even if the council members put politics aside for the greater good.

I'm still keeping my hope up. Maybe the legalities and the financials have been worked on during these two weeks while they went through, and are still going through, all the formalities.

 

[Sylvia]

Over at FSU someone posted that Russia plans to submit an official bid tomorrow to host 2011 Worlds and they they prefer the end of April.

Finland is also applying to host: http://www.helsinkitimes.fi/htimes/...-world-figure-skating-championships-yle-.html
(One of the ISU Council members, Marie Lundmark, is from Finland and she gave an interview the other day that mentioned Finland's interest in hosting.)

 

[demarinis5]

Thanks for the updates. Good news.

 

[Violet Bliss]

The press release is very lawyer-approved.

Based on spontaneous proposals from ISU Member federations received to host the Championships and possibly additional Members who might be interested and available, the ISU Council is evaluating the different options taking into account all relevant aspects and points of view. This primarily involves the tremendous logistical challenge to organize and conduct such major Event on short notice. Also, the Council cannot ignore legal and contractual constraints as well as timing conflicts with other skating or sporting events.

1. "Tremendous logistical challenge to organize and conduct such major Event (very legalese)on short notice" - it's not the biggest concern of the ISU based on "spontaneous proposals from ISU Member federations received to host the Championships and possibly additional Members who might be interested and available" as it would mostly be the responsibility of the hosting federation. From the number of federations willing and eager to host, these obviously are not as obstructing as generally exaggerated. (Ahem, I had a long piece on how work expands and can therefore also shrink.)

2. "timing conflicts with other skating or sporting events" is similarly more of the concern and decisions by the skaters who haven't really voiced this particular worry. Venue selection, again, is the host's responsibility and so conflicts with events should not be ISU's worries.

3. "legal and contractual constraints". Now this is the real issue and extremely important to the ISU and it also ties in with

4. Financial considerations, which is very loudly unspoken. Not only is the ISU not getting the revenues from most of the sponsors as were, there are now also much added legal spending due negotiations and possible litigations. Hopefully most sponsors will re-sign and TV networks remain committed.

Some legal and financial issues will take time to resolve anyway so let them be dealt with seperately from the main objective at hand which should be to hold the World Championship as soon as it can be done reasonably well.

eta: From
http://www.helsinkitimes.fi/htimes/...-world-figure-skating-championships-yle-.html

Seven other countries have also offered to host the championships.

There are 8 countries bidding to host. This speaks well of the goodwill of the member federations, or the desirability of hosting the Event, or both.

 

[Mathman]

Actually, I am starting to appreciate the method in Cinquanta's madness.

First, by tossing the October option into the hat he blunted in advance the inevitable criticism of whatever decision is forthcoming. (Anything is better than that.)

Second, by forcing the Japanene Federation officially to say that they cannot host Worlds, not now, not then, he has taken the monkey off the ISU's back in terms of possible contract violations.

As for the money that the ISU hoped to make from Japanese television and commercial sponsors, no use crying over spilt milk. Let's start again with a fresh slate and do the best we can.

 

[Violet Bliss]

First, by tossing the October option into the hat he blunted in advance the inevitable criticism of whatever decision is forthcoming. (Anything is better than that.)

True. Clever or maybe a postponement was a legally required option to offer JSF.

Second, by forcing the Japanene Federation officially to say that they cannot host Worlds, not now, not then, he has taken the monkey off the ISU's back in terms of possible contract violations.

This was almost indubitibly a legal song and dance as JSF in turn also had and still has its monkeys on its back.

As for the money that the ISU hoped to make from Japanese television and commercial sponsors, no use crying over spilt milk. Let's start again with a fresh slate and do the best we can.

Exactly.