Piper Gilles & Paul Poirier

I feel like they are like Savchenko/Szolkowy in pairs; innovative, fresh, bold.

I've really enjoyed their SD mixed with Beatles and baroque music.

Snow63 said:

I never said you misquoted her, I just really don't think she disliked their SD. In fact, there was even some praise from her.

It's not what judges have problem with, although I'm sure it IS affecting their score. It is what bothers me personally. Too many parallel skating and hand-in-hand simple holds.
They WERE technically imperfect, and for once tech panel decided to NOTICE that. Nothing more, nothing less.

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well, i don't usually feel their tech scores are inadequate or too low... this time was no different. what do you think about their pcs, though? as i mentioned previously, my beef with the judging has to do with their pcs (not tech scores), because i don't think the pcs g/p normally receive are sufficiently high. i think that they have merits that other dancers don't have and the pcs module provides many opportunities to reward them for this - yet it just doesn't happen... like you, i was far from overjoyed with their worlds sd, but unlike you, i liked the original rendition of it. i do remember, though, that when the season began, the sd was not very well received... or rather, that the opinions on it were rather mixed. i suspect that most people who really dislike(d) it just don't come to this thread to express their disappointment.

now dorispulaski provided great insight into how the last fd performance might have come across live - esp. the bits about the lift, somewhat repetitive music etc. what if the things she noticed affected how (un-)impressed the judges were with the fd performance (not necessarily the tech content)? do you think that the things you didn't particularly like about them - you mentioned the holds among other things - could have also been what the judges had issues with?

that being said, i do hope their clothing choices - provided they don't breach any rules - have no effect on the scores. if they do, the judges are being superficial and unprofessional. and i'm saying this as someone who has actually judged stage performances/competitions, having to look past the - possibly - godawful garments some performers choose to wear.

the crone/poirier red-blue fd is one of my favourite fd-s of all time. i'm glad there are others who at least remember it - whether they like said fd or not.

I liked the red blue FD! That's why I remember it!

For those who haven't seen it, here it is from 2011 Canadian Nationals:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rWnfkJZk020


An earlier version from 2010 Skate Canada. They qualified for the GPF that season:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MWxa7Y-nrCo

I also liked the original SD with baroque dance included, but always wanted the Lucy in the Sky intro to be longer, to clarify the storyline better.

But in real life, I just loved the new SD!!!

sometimes i forget how young paul is since he's been around that long.. thanks for bringing back some memories

4everchan said:

sometimes i forget how young paul is since he's been around that long.. thanks for bringing back some memories

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I remember him from the 2010 Olympics. Well I happened to tune into ice dancing and saw him skate with his old partner...and I remember thinking he was slightly cute. Lol. did not think that I would ever see him skate in person....never crossed my mind....and then 5 1/2 years later I did at Skate America 2015.

he is very cute

cheerknithanson said:

I remember him from the 2010 Olympics. Well I happened to tune into ice dancing and saw him skate with his old partner...and I remember thinking he was slightly cute. Lol. did not think that I would ever see him skate in person....never crossed my mind....and then 5 1/2 years later I did at Skate America 2015.

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A short video of Piper & Paul: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c_VlS66JCMg&nohtml5=False They look so comfortable

I almost feel like working out after watching them

cathlen said:

A short video of Piper & Paul: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c_VlS66JCMg&nohtml5=False They look so comfortable

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dorispulaski said:

Their new version of their SD was my favorite of the competition! That is a great vid, by the way, and the perspective of the British commentaors interesting. If you are a fan of Piper and Paul, do watch this dance!

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x40ycl7

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I said this during the event on the SD thread here, but I think it bears repeating. And Doris since you were there you can confirm what my feeling was about the FD: it went over the audience's heads. But their career the last three years points out to me a very interesting, if somewhat sad (at least to me) fact: the Ice Dance world wants innovation, yes, but they only want it within a specific "easy to digest" context.

I would wager cold hard cash that if they performed the revamped Beatles SD with their Hitchcock FD they would have been top five here. Why? Because the judges do not respond to modern notions of abstraction. I ADORED both of their programs this year (both versions of the SD, which I'll get to in a minute). The Hitchcock program has a through-line; it tells a story (actually it does more than tell a story, but first and foremost it is a narrative dance with clearly defined characters). That is far more easy for an audience to digest than the idea of finding beauty in movement divested of narrative and character. And this year's FD is a perfect illustration of a relationship between dancers without character (if that makes any sense).

The original version of the Beatles SD was intellectual: its success depends on a large degree to how familiar someone is with baroque court dances and military parade movements. I thought it was a fine satire on the whole idea of the SD. The revamped version of the Beatles SD was emotional, and delight is just as much an emotion as angst. What is absolutely astounding to me is how little they needed to change the choreography for such a radical transformation. I'm not saying one is better than the other; I'm not putting a value judgment on it. What interests me more is that you have essentially the same dance in radically different contexts, and how the judges reacted to it. A PB for the bright and sunny (and yes, easier).

So, I know that friends of Piper and Paul and Carol Lane read this board. Well here's a suggestion to pass along to them. The judges aren't saying don't be innovative. I think what they're saying is don't be intellectually innovative. The world of ice dance is fundamentally conservative, if not reactionary. Put the innovation for a "serious" FD (if that is the direction you want to take) into a context which has a clear through-line, clear characters, and a clear relationship. I personally find it disheartening that their most successful outing at Worlds was the year they played it the most straight, with dances that no one is going to remember. People WILL remember this Beatles SD. They WILL remember the Hitchcock program. I think that would be a direction worth pursuing for them.

YMMV of course.

WeakAnkles said:

The original version of the Beatles SD was intellectual: its success depends on a large degree to how familiar someone is with baroque court dances and military parade movements..

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YUP... i think that's correct.... I am familiar with baroque music and dance and I thought this was HILARIOUS and so so so innovative and interesting. I still prefer it to the beatles only version however, they did skate the beatles flawlessy.... every movement seemed to match every beat.

I think that you are correct about getting into programs that will be slightly easier to grasp for an audience... it sort of reminds me when the Duchesnays did the mirror program which was badly received, and then just went back to revamp their Mission program to get the points they needed....

I also think Piper and Paul have two options as you have mentioned :

they can be innovative in the same way they have been, and not care about placements.... They will most likely be Canada's #3 team next year... and end closer to 10th in the world....

or they can have the same sort of choreography innovations but transcend theirmaterial into something accessible to the crowd.

they are brilliant skaters with all the technique needed to achieve best results..

the option i really hope we don't get is Piper and Paul doing boring stuff like every other team

Weak Ankles, I mostly agree with you.

I would add a couple things:

SDs by definition need to highlight ballroom dance. The character of the dance should shine through any story you are trying to tell in an SD. Unfortunately, the Montreal school does not subscribe to this concept, and consequently, I mostly dislike their SDs. Please do not follow their lead.

You only have a very short time to impress a skating audience. This is especially so in a short dance. The audience needs time for serious concepts. Save them for the FD. The original SD concept would have worked as an FD, I think.

Costumes should not be a distraction. Simple can be good. The red blue program and Papadakis/Cizeron's FD this season are examples. If your program is about abstract shapes or concepts, simple is definitely better.

If you have a program that needs "program notes," your only text is the costumes. The audience should have a good idea what direction the program is going to take from the moment they see you. The revised SD did that. The old SD required an audience to waste time doing a double take, but it was comprehensible. The FD costumes did not make a clear statement at all, especially at audience POV. The details were invisible or confusing. On no account ever write or draw on your costume.

But mostly, guys, don't get discouraged. A lot of people really enjoy your stuff.

I've been rewatching their FD and I have to say I really love it. I don't understand why the score was so low. The moves are so original and fit the music so well. The only thing I didn't care for were the costumes, they look a bit like a 80's knock off from a Madonna video. But I love what they bring to ice dance. I hope they will be encouraged by their SD's success and keep on bringing original programs.

cathlen said:

This sucks, as I know that all videos on youtube are muted due to copyright. But I found this on dailymotion: http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x40ycl7 Enjoy!

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Thank you soooooo much! Really enjoy the commentary from the Eurosports.

That vid is linked in the OP, in case you want to find it again.

I don't think any teams will handle Hip Hop very well for the SD next year but I guess if there is one team who could do it, it would be Gilles and Poirier IMO. They are quirky enough and can do quite interesting sharp body movements like the ones in this year's FD. If they chose hip hop, I can't even begin to imagine the type of outfits they'd go for

cocotaffy said:

I don't think any teams will handle Hip Hop very well for the SD next year but I guess if there is one team who could do it, it would be Gilles and Poirier IMO. They are quirky enough and can do quite interesting sharp body movements like the ones in this year's FD. If they chose hip hop, I can't even begin to imagine the type of outfits they'd go for

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I agree. Them, Virtue and Moir, and possibly McNamara/Carpenter might NAIL hip-hop. Like I've said before, hip-hop is one of those dances where if you're not hitting sharply, the effect is ruined. With some other dances, you can somewhat get away with it. But with hip-hop, it's all showing.

Does anyone know which remix of "Sweet Dreams" they used for their 2011-2012 debut FD? I've been looking for that mix forever.

A clip about the photo shoot they did for Figure Skater Fitness Magazine

Lester said:

A clip about the photo shoot they did for Figure Skater Fitness Magazine

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I already posted it here in this thread, but there's never enough love for this two

cathlen said:

I already posted it here in this thread, but there's never enough love for this two

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Oh, sorry, I thought I checked for it but apparently I didn't check well enough