2011-2012 Program Stuff

[Violet Bliss]

Ooooh, can you tell us judges' conversations at piano competitions?

Seems to me judges have the same conversations way way more than the same music being used. So they must not easily tire of repetitions.

eta. This coming season judges are in for some treats such as Reynolds' Chrono Trigger and Joubert's Justice.

 

[mousepotato]

It doesn't matter what the expressions are. I disagree with you.

And I with you...

Also, mousepotato, who do you think is more expressive on the ice? I mean, you've defended K/S before, but I can't imagine anyone saying she is a more expressive skater than Tatiana.

I didn't mention K/S in regards to expression; only Volosozhar and Bazarova's lack of. I think many girls are better, Evora, Moore-Towers, Savchenko, Iliushechkina even Gerboldt.

Interesting. It's entirely possible that Tatiana simply looked better when paired with Stanislav than she really was. But I watch Kavaguti with Smirnov, and I think he's considerably better. I'll have to watch some of their programs and focus on her, but while I've found her reserve somewhat fascinating, I wouldn't label it expressive.

I agree, I think people only noticed how great her posture and lines were because she was skating with a truck. Now that she has a partner more in line with her talent one can notice more faults with her. Although if they are a blind uber fan, they won't want to see anything.

I also think Smirnov is better than Kavaguti, I just see her as plateauing and he has yet to peak.

That's really weird. When I watch K&S, I always watch her. I think she's a better partner and basically commands all the attention. She's a bit awkward, but that's all the flaw I can find in her. They said she's faster, stronger, has beautiful line, etc... Look like some experts at home have quite a different opinion.

Smirnov is a great partner, he shows her well.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=imxrnTTBZZk

This program was 3-4 years old, they were just together, and their programs were already superior to V&T's this year. The problem with K&S is their inconsistency. They go so well together. Most commentators (the Brits, Peter Caruthers) agree. I think they are the best pair all around.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mvEdJMaQet8&feature=related

Someone said her line is bad. If Yuko's line is bad, what's good? :think:

K/S Worlds 08 short was even better than how they skated at 08 Euros.

I think people hated Maria Mukhortova’s personality and it made Trankov look better when in reality Maria was just as much of a beautiful skater but I would have rather seen her with Smirnov.

People either don't like Kavaguti's skating or the fact that she is skating with a Russian and their styles are different. I think there was a time between 06-08 where she was better than him but she also had more senior international experience (he had none) she also had Moskvina. He had Nikolai Velikov and he was really neglected, he really didn’t have a lot to go with until Moskvina got a hold of him I think the season 08-09 they were pretty equal but he had since surpassed her in 09-10 and even last season.

K/S has trouble (as does B/L and I/M) that needs to get fixed, like that crashy twist. It did get better last season but still has a ways to go. They could use more height on the throws (although he looks as if he is hardly doing any work.) After Yuko retires I would like to see him continue with a new partner. I just hope they work on getting higher PCS this season.

 

[herios]

When emo Max was with Maria, people blamed Maria for their generic programs. They said because Maria couldn't handle choreography, they can't have a good program. Fast forward to now, emo Max still couldn't come up with a decent short or long program. No transitions, no choreography, nothing. I think he's very limited.
V/T are like the Zhangs, so boring, so sad.

Blame the choreographer, not him.

 

[DianaSelene]

I didn't mention K/S in regards to expression; only Volosozhar and Bazarova's lack of. I think many girls are better, Evora, Moore-Towers, Savchenko, Iliushechkina even Gerboldt.


I agree, I think people only noticed how great her posture and lines were because she was skating with a truck. Now that she has a partner more in line with her talent one can notice more faults with her. Although if they are a blind uber fan, they won't want to see anything.

Actually, concerning Volosozhar I was completely the opposite. When she skated with Morozov, I highly disliked the partnership, I wasn't a fan of either of them and and didn't want to watch them. So I didn't look at her and think that she's amazing compared to the truck. I just disliked them in general. I found her very expressive and a good skater only when she started to skate with Trankov and thought they were a very good match. So, I've only really realized that she is a good and emotional skater a year ago.

It's just that what you answered me when I asked why you thought Volosozhar is non-artistic, your reasoning was her bad seafood facial expressions. But you didn't talk about the fact that maybe you don't like her movements, arms, or overall artistry. I thought that calling a person unartistic solely because of their face made little sense.

But then again, we are entitled to our own opinions. For example, I think Evora and Moore-Towers are not better than Volosozhar artistically. As a matter of fact, I believe that they are the opposite of the word artistic. But not because of their faces. I just don't like their movements.

 

[FlattFan]

Blame the choreographer, not him.

Blame the choreographer, not her.

The point is, there's a pattern. And that pattern has a name: Maxim Trankov.
He might be limited, so they can't give him any choreography.

 

[DianaSelene]

Blame the choreographer, not her.

The point is, there's a pattern. And that pattern has a name: Maxim Trankov.
He might be limited, so they can't give him any choreography.

The key words here are "he might be limited".
Can we really say for sure? Not really. :think:

 

[ImaginaryPogue]

To be fair, mousepotato said "expressive" not "artistic." - Two different things.

 

[DianaSelene]

^
Sorry. I accidentally mixed the words up.

 

[colleen o'neill]

Diana Selene .. you had posted a link to a bunch of programs on the Russian Test Skates thread ,but this was sort of buried among so many, I've just found it now ..

http://www.youtube.com/user/mihsersh#p/u/61/6cSXro8_FDg

My goodness, this is such an improvement from his last years programs..much more worthy of his capabilities. There are some really nice choreographic touches.( I hope his costume won't be too fussy ) I'll be looking forward to seeing it when it's more competition ready.

I'm curious, though..someone on FSU was saying " Thanks, Stephane." in commenting on the program. Does this mean we have Lambiel to thank for this wonderful choreographic transformation ? I can believe it of some of those little accent jumps and positions.This is one vampire-ish program that won't have me taking a fridge break.

 

[ImaginaryPogue]

Lambiel was working with Mishin's students.

 

[DianaSelene]

Diana Selene .. you had posted a link to a bunch of programs on the Russian Test Skates thread ,but this was sort of buried among so many, I've just found it now ..

http://www.youtube.com/user/mihsersh#p/u/61/6cSXro8_FDg

My goodness, this is such an improvement from his last years programs..much more worthy of his capabilities. There are some really nice choreographic touches.( I hope his costume won't be too fussy ) I'll be looking forward to seeing it when it's more competition ready.

I'm curious, though..someone on FSU was saying " Thanks, Stephane." in commenting on the program. Does this mean we have Lambiel to thank for this wonderful choreographic transformation ? I can believe it of some of those little accent jumps and positions.This is one vampire-ish program that won't have me taking a fridge break.

I'm not sure if Lambiel did the whole choreography from the beginning to the end but he definitely had a say in this program. Gachinski and Mishin worked with Stephane a lot during the summer on his artistry and some elements (such as spins probably).

From two articles on sports.ru

Mishin: "In Italy, Lambiel had a workshop and worked on step sequences, and entrances to elements. I had no idea that Gachinski would change so much after working with Stephane. He took a big step forward concerning linking elements which are important today."

Gachinski: "The main theme of my program is demons. The music is combined from the movies "Count Dracula", "Interview With a Vampire", and a few other movies. The idea came from Mishin, Kovtun, and Lambiel who worked on it together."

By the way, this is not mine. I just translated it from a Russian website.

 

[colleen o'neill]

Thanks , DS and Pogue..

Well, this is such an improvement over the choreography Mishin's students usually display, (not to mention the music cut) that if Lambiel is the one new element around Gachinski , then he deserves a major share of the credit. I have hopes that we'll see a major spurt of evolution in Russian men's choreography going forward if Artur has a successful season.. Heck , in this program , I can even manage not to be annoyed by the now ubiquitous Russian gloves ( but not in every case)

 

[Violet Bliss]

Stephane Lambiel

 

[colleen o'neill]

And now I'm curious to see his St.James Infirmary SP. I've been a Blues fan since I was a sprout ,and usually I feel Russian interpretations are a bit off.. But if Stephane was involved with that too , things might be different.

 

[f1nnstep]

Czisny

SP: La Vie en Rose
LP: Valse Triste

There were talks about Rahkamo Kokko and their La Strada 1994.

1993 they did Valse Triste and won their first ever medal in Europeans which were held in Helsinki Finland. The year before Umbrellas... V/M had Valse Triste as well. I love to see Czisnys interpretation of Valse triste. She is the one to really catch the tones of the composer Sibelius (Finn as well)

R/K Valse Triste in Helsinki: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rk2LqLNPelc
V/M Valse Triste: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tym1Wfrook8

I'm also very curious about Davis and White 's La Strada

 

[dorispulaski]

Welcome to Golden Skate, f1nnstep!

 

[lionmilk]

Drobiazko/Vanagas also used Valse Triste for their OD during the 98-99 season and it was probably my favorite of the season along with Anissina/Peizerat's Sweet and Tender Beast. It was beautifully choreographed and held your attention from the first movement of her arm to their final pose at the end. But of course they were undermarked...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SwtTioT0tI4


i really love this music.....can't wait to see alissa's version

 

[lionmilk]

Drobiazko/Vanagas also used Valse Triste for their OD during the 98-99 season and it was probably my favorite of the season along with Anissina/Peizerat's Sweet and Tender Beast. It was beautifully choreographed and held your attention from the first movement of her arm to their final pose at the end. But of course they were undermarked...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SwtTioT0tI4


i really love this music.....can't wait to see alissa's version

This is their 1999 worlds OD....along with marks

 

[backhand45]

" Ooooh, can you tell us judges' conversations at piano competitions? "

Piano Competitions ? Really, SkateFiguring. I only talk about my own experiences from the many Dance Competitions I have judged. I have met and spoken with many figuring skating coaches over the years, as they will often attend the Dance Conventions where I am one of the speakers. They often attend the section on what makes a great soloist. They ask me about Music, Costumes, Make Up, Program Pacing, as well as diet and weight loss secrets.

I'm surprised you'd compare my dance experience with that of a music judge. Or was that a Joke ?

 

[f1nnstep]

Drobiazko/Vanagas also used Valse Triste for their OD during the 98-99 season and it was probably my favorite of the season along with Anissina/Peizerat's Sweet and Tender Beast. It was beautifully choreographed and held your attention from the first movement of her arm to their final pose at the end. But of course they were undermarked...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SwtTioT0tI4



i really love this music.....can't wait to see alissa's version

Fantastic - I havent seen this one. I absolutely enjoyed D/V always and I think they were also underrated at their time. Absolutely great Valse Triste.