2017-18 State of Russian Ladies skating

[vorravorra]

I meant they should have sent her....last year. She had plenty of success last season and they didn't send her.

It would have had to be by a special decision though as she was way down the list at Junior Nationals and hadn't done her best at Senior Nationals either. She has never been a terribly consistent skater and rarely skates two clean programs, so it isn't really the case of the Fed holding her down and never giving her chances. And now of course we have a bunch of juniors who skate two clean programs as a matter of course. In seniors so far it's only Medvedeva and we'll have to see about Zagitova, and we'll also have to see how many of these girls are still that consistent after age 16, but at the moment it's tough.

 

[tjb]

I love Anastasia but why should they send her to JW? She didn't miss the podium by couple of points at Nationals, she missed it by 15 points.
.

nationals is just one of many competitions. gubanova had a great season last year, while konstantinova's season was a mess, both domestically and internationally. and as a result konstantinova missed worlds podium not just by couple of point, but more than 30. and so did polina

 

[vorravorra]

nationals is just one of many competitions. gubanova had a great season last year, while konstantinova's season was a mess, both domestically and internationally. and as a result konstantinova missed worlds podium not just by couple of point, but more than 30. and so did polina

What was wrong with Konstantinova's domestic season? The only competition she did badly in was Stage I of the St. Petersburg Cup.

 

[puremagic]

It would have had to be by a special decision though as she was way down the list at Junior Nationals and hadn't done her best at Senior Nationals either.

Yeah, but before that Nastya won two JGP stages and also won silver medal at JGPF. What about nationals - she skated there bad in the previous year too. Stanislava, on the contrary, skated very bad at two JGP and skated well at junior nationals, but it was not flawless. Some of her landings still were sloppy and dirty. Her scores at juniors for me were like Sotskova's score. Very strange marks. Considering all of this RusFed could send to JWC the girl who already won two JGP and silver of JGPF, but skated bad at nationals. But nope. They sent Stanislava and they got what they deserve.

But I agree that Angel should take a rest. I don't want to see her tears again. So leave this incredible girl alone. She has her time before the Junior Nationals.

 

[madison]

Yeah, but before that Nastya won two JGP stages and also won silver medal at JGPF. What about nationals - she skated there bad in the previous year too. Stanislava, on the contrary, skated very bad at two JGP and skated well at junior nationals, but it was not flawless. Some of her landings still were sloppy and dirty. Her scores at juniors for me were like Sotskova's score. Very strange marks. Considering all of this RusFed could send to JWC the girl who already won two JGP and silver of JGPF, but skated bad at nationals. But nope. They sent Stanislava and they got what they deserve.

But I agree that Angel should take a rest. I don't want to see her tears again. So leave this incredible girl alone. She has her time before the Junior Nationals.

Probably, RusFed also took into consideration their age. Stanislava can compete in seniors this year, and probably she would do that if the standing at the Junior Worlds would have been better.

 

[puremagic]

Probably, RusFed also took into consideration their age. Stanislava can compete in seniors this year, and probably she would do that if the standing at the Junior Worlds would have been better.

Yes, it make sense...

 

[Bluediamonds09]

So even though it's a fact that neither Adelina or Julia will compete this season on the Grand Prix, Stanislava is staying junior? Just wondering.

Gubanova isn't scheduled for a second jgp, is she? Well, who are the 2 ladies at this week's Riga Junior Grand Prix? Apparently, this week is a battle between only 3 strong competitors: Kihira and two Russians.

 

[vorravorra]

Yeah, but before that Nastya won two JGP stages and also won silver medal at JGPF. What about nationals - she skated there bad in the previous year too. Stanislava, on the contrary, skated very bad at two JGP and skated well at junior nationals, but it was not flawless. Some of her landings still were sloppy and dirty. Her scores at juniors for me were like Sotskova's score. Very strange marks. Considering all of this RusFed could send to JWC the girl who already won two JGP and silver of JGPF, but skated bad at nationals. But nope. They sent Stanislava and they got what they deserve.

But I agree that Angel should take a rest. I don't want to see her tears again. So leave this incredible girl alone. She has her time before the Junior Nationals.

Selecting the team based on Nationals is the rule though. By this logic they should have sent Voronov to Euros/Worlds, but they sent those who took first three places at Nationals. This isn't a conspiracy against Gubanova. А comparison with Sotskova isn't right because Pogorilaya and Radionova placed just below Sotskova, that's not what happened with Gubanova. A lower score for Stasya wouldn't have given Gubanova a medal, there were four skaters between them. Remove Stasya and you'll get Tsurskaya and Panenkova going to JW. Remove Tsurskaya as well, you'll still get Panenkova and Fedichkina. You could argue that it was Panenkova who was robbed, just as she had been robbed of JGP spots - she is the one who skated clean at JN and was consistently clean all season.
For the record, I wasn't too keen on Konstantinova going to JW as I felt she wasn't ready to face that kind of pressure. I just don't get this "Stasya personally robbed Nastya of a JW medal" argument.

 

[tars]

Probably, RusFed also took into consideration their age. Stanislava can compete in seniors this year, and probably she would do that if the standing at the Junior Worlds would have been better.

They wanted to give a chance of breakthrough in junior worlds to the skaters eligible for 2018 Olympics. Gubanova can't go.

 

[madison]

Selecting the team based on Nationals is the rule though. By this logic they should have sent Voronov to Euros/Worlds, but they sent those who took first three places at Nationals. This isn't a conspiracy against Gubanova. А comparison with Sotskova isn't right because Pogorilaya and Radionova placed just below Sotskova, that's not what happened with Gubanova. A lower score for Stasya wouldn't have given Gubanova a medal, there were four skaters between them. Remove Stasya and you'll get Tsurskaya and Panenkova going to JW. Remove Tsurskaya as well, you'll still get Panenkova and Fedichkina. You could argue that it was Panenkova who was robbed, just as she had been robbed of JGP spots - she is the one who skated clean at JN and was consistently clean all season.
For the record, I wasn't too keen on Konstantinova going to JW as I felt she wasn't ready to face that kind of pressure. I just don't get this "Stasya personally robbed Nastya of a JW medal" argument.

No, nobody said and thinks this. Just that I felt, and I don't think I'm the only one, that both Sotskova and Konsantinova's scores were inflated without any justified reason, comparing to what they showed at National Russian Champ and Junior Russian National Champ.

 

[vorravorra]

[/B]
No, nobody said and thinks this. Just that I felt, and I don't think I'm the only one, that both Sotskova and Konsantinova's scores were inflated without any justified reason, comparing to what they showed at National Russian Champ and Junior Russian National Champ.

What about Tsurskaya then? She didn't exactly skate her best and still got a bronze medal.

 

[hippomoomin]

What I've noticed is Gubanova seems to be labored in her overall movement in Salzburg, even when she was doing steps. She is soft but she does not look airy.
I love her delicate style, but if she cannot keep up her jumps, she will end up like Serafima, who was praised for her mature skating and skating skill at a young age, but had questionable jumps.

For me, a junior with good presentation will soon lose that advantage, as other skaters in her age group will mature their presentation sooner or later. I think it is the right approach to develop strong jump first, because you can improve your presentation throughout your career, for as long as you skate. If you don't master your jump or fix problems by a certain age, it is much harder to do.

 

[vorravorra]

What I've noticed is Gubanova seems to be labored in her overall movement in Salzburg, even when she was doing steps. She is soft but she does not look airy.
I love her delicate style, but if she cannot keep up her jumps, she will end up like Serafima, who was praised for her mature skating and skating skill at a young age, but had questionable jumps.

For me, a junior with good presentation will soon lose that advantage, as other skaters in her age group will mature their presentation sooner or later. I think it is the right approach to develop strong jump first, because you can improve your presentation throughout your career, for as long as you skate. If you don't master your jump or fix problems by a certain age, it is much harder to do.

Strong jumps at 13 do not guarantee some kind of immunity from puberty though. Especially if you are not naturally predisposed towards being light and thin. And I doubt Gubanova's team made a decision to develop her presentation at the expense of jumps, she is likely just talented that way. Choreo base and SS are something you have to start working on from an early age, you can't catch up on the entire thing after you learn to jump. And plenty of skaters somehow manage to develop all of them in parallel, there is nothing mutually exclusive about them.

 

[[email protected]]

Frankly speaking, at this stage big questions are not about Gubanova but about Stasya Konstantinova who is already 17. Gubanova can rest, she can withdraw from the competitions this season to adjust jumps to her changed body and start fresh when she is ready: she is just 14! Her artistry and unique style won't go away.

With Stasya it's different - she is competing with the girls who are 4 years younger, who skate clean programs and jump quads. Doing her usual self this season will mean very big question marks about her competitive career in the future. If she is a late bloomer, the time has come for her to bloom. Now or never - that's what I think. She could be successful in the past, even in the recent past as she is a special skater with a big presence on ice. And skaters in the past could reach any heights being inconsistent. Not anymore - consistently skating clean - that's the name of the today's game in the ladies' figure skating before they will master quads.

 

[puremagic]

Strong jumps at 13 do not guarantee some kind of immunity from puberty though. Especially if you are not naturally predisposed towards being light and thin. And I doubt Gubanova's team made a decision to develop her presentation at the expense of jumps, she is likely just talented that way. Choreo base and SS are something you have to start working on from an early age, you can't catch up on the entire thing after you learn to jump. And plenty of skaters somehow manage to develop all of them in parallel, there is nothing mutually exclusive about them.

We would have already heard about others skaters with beautiful skating skills from Urmanov/Turenko group but nope... So it's just Nastya's talent. And now I wonder, what if she really moved to Buyanova. Look at Sontikova's skating skills, look how Sotskova improved her skating, also I saw recently videos from Radio trainings - she improved her skating skills too. I guess Nastya with her talent will learn to fly on the ice if she will face with Buyanova's skating coach. But main thing now it's save her jumps. So I just want to this girl be fully prepared for Russian Junior nationals, where she will face with very strong skaters (I hope with Anna Scherbakova too) and there will try to prove her place under the sun. If not - she will have the whole year to finally decide to change her coach.

 

[vorravorra]

So even though it's a fact that neither Adelina or Julia will compete this season on the Grand Prix, Stanislava is staying junior? Just wondering.

Gubanova isn't scheduled for a second jgp, is she? Well, who are the 2 ladies at this week's Riga Junior Grand Prix? Apparently, this week is a battle between only 3 strong competitors: Kihira and two Russians.

Yes, Stanislava is staying Junior and it's still anybody's guess who'll end up at CoR. We'll have Fedichkina and Panenkova in Riga. It will be very interesting to see how Panenkova does internationally. Gubanova is currently scheduled for the 6th event in Croatia, but they are constantly rearranging things. There is even talk that they might give a spot to Kostornaya at the 6th (and then possibly 7th) event, and that may be taken from Gubanova if it happens. They can't give Kostornaya any of the earlier events since she is not listed as a substitute.

 

[vorravorra]

We would have already heard about others skaters with beautiful skating skills from Urmanov/Turenko group but nope... So it's just Nastya's talent. And now I wonder, what if she really moved to Buyanova. Look at Sontikova's skating skills, look how Sotskova improved her skating, also I saw recently videos from Radio trainings - she improved her skating skills too. I guess Nastya with her talent will learn to fly on the ice if she will face with Buyanova's skating coach. But main thing now it's save her jumps. So I just want to this girl be fully prepared for Russian Junior nationals, where she will face with very strong skaters (I hope with Anna Scherbakova too) and there will try to prove her place under the sun. If not - she will have the whole year to finally decide to change her coach.

Nastya's main problem is jumps, not SS, so I am not sure that Buyanova is the best coach. It isn't like Masha's jumps got any better under her.

 

[puremagic]

Nastya's main problem is jumps, not SS, so I am not sure that Buyanova is the best coach. It isn't like Masha's jumps got any better under her.

It will be a little bonus. Her skating skills now like 85 out of 100. Mistress Buyanova will give her another 15 points. About Maria's underrotation jumps... It's problem of her growth, I guess, not Buyanova's. Mishin can't fix lutz/flip - Nugumanova and Lozko as examples. So other option is only Eteri. Look at Tarakanova. She always fell at her lutz or flip. Always. At almost every competition. But she moved to Eteri and... I noticed this is probably some kind of secret advice which Eteri knows. And Yata said very interesting thing:

I was watching a couple of her older videos and she fixed the axis of her jumps. That alone is a huge help plus she's only been there for 3 months. It's truly something what Eteri's accomplished.
Of course, this will help Nastya mentally too, just such a fantastic burst onto the international scene.

So or mistress Buyanova, or Eteri.

 

[Bluediamonds09]

Panenkova is one of Eteri's girls. (5th in junior nationals last season). I'm predicting that Panenkova will win, making her the THIRD IN A ROW of Eteri's students that win this season. Of course, Rika kihira could land her 3A.

 

[Tolstoj]

Nastya's main problem is jumps, not SS, so I am not sure that Buyanova is the best coach. It isn't like Masha's jumps got any better under her.

Yeah considering she trains and lives in St. Petersburg she should join some of Mishin's camp and work with him on the technique of some of the jumps (Lutz, flip and maybe even salchow)

I don't think she should change the coach because part of the reason why she is so lovely to watch is the fact that her coach didn't compromise on her artistry.

Mishin can't fix lutz/flip - Nugumanova and Lozko as examples. So other option is only Eteri. Look at Tarakanova. She always fell at her lutz or flip. Always. At almost every competition. But she moved to Eteri and... I noticed this is probably some kind of secret advice which Eteri knows. And Yata said very interesting thing:

Anastasiia is struggling for a different reason: she has to change the way she attacks these jumps while Nugumanova and Lozko's main problem was the height.

Panenkova is one of Eteri's girls. (5th in junior nationals last season). I'm predicting that Panenkova will win, making her the THIRD IN A ROW of Eteri's students that win this season. Of course, Rika kihira could land her 3A.

Rika is definitely one of the strongest competitor, so it won't be easy and if she lands the 3A and the rest clean the gold will be her for sure.