2019-20 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating

[Jontor]

that is interesting...is there seeding for juniors like seniors or was this totally random?

It is based on World Standings. Interestingly Valieva is ranked 110 and Liu 112, while skaters like Ryabova (21) and Andrews (24) are ranked much higher.

 

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[Spirals for Miles]

It is based on World Standings. Interestingly Valieva is ranked 110 and Liu 112, while skaters like Ryabova (21) and Andrews (24) are ranked much higher.

Probably because they get to compete as seniors also (and earn more points because of it). I wish that, for a junior competition, WS could be refactored to only consider junior competitions. It'd make seeding much more reflective of the current junior trends, in my opinion.

 

[Spirals for Miles]

Good luck to Kamila, Daria, and Maiia tomorrow!

And, even though they no longer represent Russia, good luck also to Anastasia Shabotova, Ekaterina Ryabova, and Ekaterina Kurakova!

 

[Happy Skates]

Probably because they get to compete as seniors also (and earn more points because of it). I wish that, for a junior competition, WS could be refactored to only consider junior competitions. It'd make seeding much more reflective of the current junior trends, in my opinion.

I agree, maybe they should use SB for juniors, as its hard to have WS for juniors, a lot of which are just beginning their international careers this season. This way, they wouldn't have to recalculate something for one competition. The WS system for juniors is especially ridiculous in the JGPF sp, where some competitors only have had two JGP events to gain WS points where others have been eligible for CS and even senior championship events along with previous season of JGP and JWorlds. I miss the backwards order of qualification system they used to do.

 

[Elucidus]

You would think that some of the ISU judges and technical specialists would also be able to develop that skill. But I guess not.

That skill is to notice what landing you should check later in slo-mo. Almost all landings I noticed to be suspicious in real time - proved to be URs in slo-mo later. I've never declared any jump to be URed without scrupulous checking in slo-mo or being in exact 90 degree zone. I believe all TP members has the same skill indeed.
Of course they see all of URs perfectly - I have no doubts about that. They just don't bother to act on that knowledge - either ignoring to check suspicious landings of reputable skater or pretending they didn't notice mistake. Exactly because of it one often can see drastic difference in protocols and scores of the same skaters participating in both major tournaments and challengers or senior and junior comps (in smaller competitions TP members usually are less corrupted). Which can give an illusion to newbie fs fan that the certain skaters unexpectedly unlearn how to rotate jumps properly and learn that again later Some tries to explain it with temporary loss of form - but majority prefer to look other way or just don't care

It is based on World Standings. Interestingly Valieva is ranked 110 and Liu 112, while skaters like Ryabova (21) and Andrews (24) are ranked much higher.

Which shows absurdity and built-in corruption of the ranking system based on reputation and careers longevity - which has nothing to do with actual skaters power. Fortunately, many judges realize that too - but still this system should be disposed of, IMO.

 

[brakes]

Good luck to Kamila, Daria, and Maiia tomorrow!

Good luck to all, but for sure Alysa Liu is the favourite of SP with her triple axel.

 

[Mathman]

That skill is to notice what landing you should check later in slo-mo. Almost all landings I noticed to be suspicious in real time - proved to be URs in slo-mo later. I've never declared any jump to be URed without scrupulous checking in slo-mo or being in exact 90 degree zone. I believe all TP members has the same skill indeed.

Of course they see all of URs perfectly - I have no doubts about that. They just don't bother to act on that knowledge - either ignoring to check suspicious landings of reputable skater or pretending they didn't notice mistake...

To me, almost every jump by almost every skater looks suspicious in real time. How could it not? You are twirling at the rate of a thousand degrees per second as you hit the ice.

Furthermore, not only does every jump landing look reviewable to me, when we do see ultra slo-motion replays, they all look even worse than they did in real time.

I think the ISU tech callers and judges take this into account. The sport would be embarrassed if fans knew how much short of full rotation a "triple" or a "quad" is.

 

[Elucidus]

To me, almost every jump by almost every skater looks suspicious in real time. How could it not? You are twirling at the rate of a thousand degrees per second as you hit the ice.

Furthermore, not only does every jump landing look reviewable to me, when we do see ultra slo-motion replays, they all look even worse than they did in real time.

I think the ISU tech callers and judges take this into account. The sport would be embarrassed if fans knew how much short of full rotation a "triple" or a "quad" is.

No. For example, majority of jumps of JWC latest three flights of men's SP were good looking in terms of rotation in real time. Did you watch them? That's the thing - you should look and become used to men's jumps first. Men's triple jumps in general are more rotated than women's triples. After that - when looking to women's jumps - you will notice difference. Majority of women's jumps are borderline at best in terms of rotations. Maybe because you watch ladies skating more often - or maybe because you just didn't care about rotations - you are thinking like all jumps looks suspicious. I assure you that if you begin to dedicate your time to analyze lots of jumps at least for a year after every competition - you will begin to notice URs in real time eventually as well as see properly rotated jumps. Nevertheless I believe all quads and 3As should be checked in slo-mo despite how good they are looking. Since they give too much advantage in terms of scores - they are main podium deciding factors - too important to ignore on the basis of real-time appearance.
Well, I suppose that women's jumps are assessed more lenient than men's in general, to a degree - because of that difference in jumps rotation ability. Still, it seems more obvious in senior ladies judging - exactly because senior ladies begin to lose ability to rotate jumps with age - contrary to men. Maybe that one of the reasons that men's skating judging/calls is much more fair than ladies.

 

[readernick]

To me, almost every jump by almost every skater looks suspicious in real time. How could it not? You are twirling at the rate of a thousand degrees per second as you hit the ice.

Furthermore, not only does every jump landing look reviewable to me, when we do see ultra slo-motion replays, they all look even worse than they did in real time.

I think the ISU tech callers and judges take this into account. The sport would be embarrassed if fans knew how much short of full rotation a "triple" or a "quad" is.

Agree in general... but after watching the Junior men..I don't think a technical panel needs to review rotation of Shun Sato's jumps. It is amazing how much time he has in the air after he finishes rotation. (totally off topic.. this just came to my mind while reading your post)

 

[Lovechihuahua]

Good luck to all, but for sure Alysa Liu is the favourite of SP with her triple axel.

This is Russian ladies thread, if you wanna boast Alysa Liu, then go to US Ladies thread, your assumption of her being the favourite of SP has no place here.

 

[brakes]

This is Russian ladies thread, if you wanna boast Alysa Liu, then go to US Ladies thread, your assumption of her being the favourite of SP has no place here.

Alysa is arguably the greatest upcoming rival for Russian ladies at the moment. Not mentioning her in this thread would be like leaving rain out of weather discussion.

 

[SkateSkates]

Probably because they get to compete as seniors also (and earn more points because of it). I wish that, for a junior competition, WS could be refactored to only consider junior competitions. It'd make seeding much more reflective of the current junior trends, in my opinion.

I never understood why ISU doesn’t award points for Junior Internationals. The only way for Jr age skaters to earn ISU ranking points is through JGPs or JWs. Why not assign a lower point value for placing 1-3 at international events at the junior level? This season Daria won the Denis Ten Memorial but doesn’t get any ranking points for this. Doesn’t really seem fair, plus doesn’t allow for skaters who weren’t on the JGP to ever earn points. They could do something like 100 points for 1st, 75 for 2nd, 50 for 3rd and 25 for 4th?

 

[Lovechihuahua]

Alysa is arguably the greatest upcoming rival for Russian ladies at the moment. Not mentioning her in this thread would be like leaving rain out of weather discussion.

All she said is good luck to all the three Russian ladies, and you deliberately mention Alysa Liu which made zero sense. And I don't care Alysa Liu at all, why would I? She works nothing for me, I only focus on three russian ladies no matther which place they rink in.

 

[brakes]

All she said is good luck to all the three Russian ladies, and you deliberately mention Alysa Liu which made zero sense. And I don't care Alysa Liu at all, why would I? She works nothing for me, I only focus on three russian ladies no matther which place they rink in.

It makes perfect sense, because if Alysa skates cleanly, no luck in the world let Russian ladies beat her in SP.

 

[karina17]

It makes perfect sense, because if Alysa skates cleanly, no luck in the world let Russian ladies beat her in SP.

Kamila botched her loop and didn't perform well at JGPF and Alysa only narrowly beat her in the SP with a clean program, 3A and all. It's a bit of a stretch to say no luck in the world could have Russian ladies beating her in the SP.

 

[brakes]

Kamila botched her loop and didn't perform well at JGPF and Alysa only narrowly beat her in the SP with a clean program, 3A and all. It's a bit of a stretch to say no luck in the world could have Russian ladies beating her in the SP.

I can't recall a SP, when clean 3A skate lost to 2A skate in recent years.

 

[Lovechihuahua]

It makes perfect sense, because if Alysa skates cleanly, no luck in the world let Russian ladies beat her in SP.

Oh yeah? All the three russian ladies have far more superior skating skills, artistry, jumping quailties, etc which should give them more GOEs and PCS. If judging fairly, they all can beat her in SP and alysa liu should not be even in the top five if the janapese and koreans skate clean. I know USFSA will play politics in this competition and will do their best to give Alysa Liu someting, but don't be acting like she deserves it.

 

[Lovechihuahua]

I can't recall a SP, when clean 3A skate lost to 2A skate in recent years.

You don't even understand the contents in SP.
3A is not corresponding to 2A, Alysa Liu also has to jumps an 2A, it is a required element.
3A should be in combo, so it is 3Lz/3F corresponding to 3A, with higher GOE, all the three Russian ladies can have higher TES than Alysa Liu.

 

[Sam-Skwantch]

Nvm