That's not what judges saw.
And i don't see how this support the "now that she left, Zhilina's scores are dropping".
2020-21 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating
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And i don't see how this support the "now that she left, Zhilina's scores are dropping".
if it is fully rotated it's 3.5 revolutions. This looked like less than 3 revolutions but more than 2.5.
I'm not caught up with the new rules on under-rotations and downgrades they changed those in May of this year.
But Zhilina's scores are dropping as another poster already pointed, Akatieva's scores dropped too.
Like i posted, there were some generous calls for Akatieva on the 3a in the short and some of the triples looked suspicious at first sight, but most importantly the GOE were given equally between the two when to me Zhilina is stronger on certain jumps like the quad toe or the lutz.
Akatieva was better artistically and got rewarded for it.
Overall i did say Akatieva deserved to win.
You don't want to be called "fan" but you act like one to me, i must say. Just chill out.
Can you show a 3A that has 3.5 rotations in the air?
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- Apr 26, 2018
Well, I definitely agree with you that Zhilina‘s scores aren‘t dropping - she got pretty high PCS for a flawed SP after all. But I also think she should have won the FS on technical merit, even though Akatieva‘s still the more well-rounded skater. And there‘s no question about her winning the gold at all, imo.
However, I also see Akatieva‘s 4T as UR and frankly, am confused how you posting one blurry picture makes that opinion a “lie“ and pushing it means you‘re “lacking in decency“. That’s just a bit of an overreaction, isn’t it? Also, you didn‘t post her take-off for example, without that reference it‘s hard to judge whether a jump is under or not. In the end it‘s not like it matters a whole lot anyway, Sofia won fairly. It‘s just something to discuss.
I realise you‘re arguing against a special set of arguments (that I, too, disagree with btw) but honestly, talking about “convicting” people for their opinions on an online forum seems unnecessarily dramatic. It‘s just... skating. Reading the last few pages of this thread - test skates will definitely make sure there’s no lack of drama. Not sure whether I‘m looking forward to it or fearing it.
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Yikes...Easier said than done. These increasingly crazy hashtags with TeamTutberidzeForWhatever have literally burned in. But it's not unhealthy, because I found it very amusing how suddenly it ended. And laughing is healthy!
I really hope we can do better than that.Wait. A messed up skate on the weekend and everything flares up again.
Can you show them? Which videos are you talking about?
2.5-3 revolutions is considered <<, so it was rightfully called. 3.25-3.5 would be considered clean, 3.25 would be "q" but they revoked that communication, 3-3.25 would be <, and then less than 3 would be <<, which is what Sofia gave.
I don't think the tech panel actually can call that a 2A. But if they did it would have made no difference - 2A and 3A<< have the same BV. If anything, calling it 2A would have helped her GOE. The << and double-footed landing made the judges give her GOE -5. If it had been 2A, they probably could have given her a -2 or -3, who knows.
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- Apr 26, 2018
That‘s a nice interview. So, Liza already has her 3A back, resurrected her biellman spin and is now training a 4S and 4T? Empress indeed. I just hope Mishin is smart about her layout and we don‘t have to see the return of that dreadful 3Lz+2A sequence.
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- Nov 2, 2013
If 3A is fully rotated it's 2.75 revolutions in the air.
Of course, skaters don't usually pre-rotate the 3A hard. Kihira used to do it way younger but she's not been doing it anymore either. I don't think a backwards takeoff is all that helpful for the 3A.
As for Akatieva's, that looked like a very bad 2A to me. I didn't see a 3A<<, just a very low GOE 2A.
I think we have all gone insane over the past nine months. I never thought I'd see everyone analysing the Moscow Junior Championships so deeply, but here we all are, so hyped about the judging of twelve-year-olds
Just a few more days to test skates! We can make it!
Just a few more days to test skates! We can make it!
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- Feb 10, 2018
Well, I definitely agree with you that Zhilina‘s scores aren‘t dropping - she got pretty high PCS for a flawed SP after all. But I also think she should have won the FS on technical merit, even though Akatieva‘s still the more well-rounded skater. And there‘s no question about her winning the gold at all, imo.
However, I also see Akatieva‘s 4T as UR and frankly, am confused how you posting one blurry picture makes that opinion a “lie“ and pushing it means you‘re “lacking in decency“. That’s just a bit of an overreaction, isn’t it? Also, you didn‘t post her take-off for example, without that reference it‘s hard to judge whether a jump is under or not. In the end it‘s not like it matters a whole lot anyway, Sofia won fairly. It‘s just something to discuss.
I realise you‘re arguing against a special set of arguments (that I, too, disagree with btw) but honestly, talking about “convicting” people for their opinions on an online forum seems unnecessarily dramatic. It‘s just... skating. Reading the last few pages of this thread - test skates will definitely make sure there’s no lack of drama. Not sure whether I‘m looking forward to it or fearing it.
Read the first part one more time:
"even convicted of being untrue, don't even have the decency to admit "OK I was wrong"
Do you find it convenient that this pressure keeps going on and on peristently? One argument dropped, another immediately appears. We are not even talking about "lost olympic
golden medal" or something on that level, while the persistency with what particular narrative is kept alive, is completely disproportional to a competition of 12-13 y.o. kids. I know there are other skaters with whom much less is allowed before the torches are ignited and forks sharpened, but the level on which it got with Veronika is so superior to Sofia (because we all know that she was taught proper technique by the perfect coach, who didn't train Sofia at all - which was repeatedly called wrong, the truth is the calls are based on who is in which camp now, not who trained whom four months ago) is unacceptable for me. It's not in the interest of the skaters, it's just "I'm pushing my agenda team A bad teacher, team B good teacher, the skaters are just used as a tool in that.
P. S.: As for the "you didn‘t post her take-off for example", well, it doesn't bother you when there is literally nothing posted yet persistently claimed this is UR/downgrade, this shouldn't receive such GOE etc. without literally anything. That's fine, of course
But to be more precise, Sofia skated in paralel to the boards, so UR would be if the landing was more than a right angle to it.
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- Aug 11, 2018
And again, you yourself publish false information: https://youtu.be/GnLNqrpp4Z8?t=45 ( look at the speed of 0.25 and there will be no doubts )
and you immediately accuse other people of all sins.
And now I'm wondering if you have the decency to admit you're wrong?Read the first part one more time:
"even convicted of being untrue, don't even have the decency to admit "OK I was wrong"
Do you find it convenient that this pressure keeps going on and on peristently? One argument dropped, another immediately appears. We are not even talking about "lost olympic
golden medal" or something on that level, while the persistency with what particular narrative is kept alive, is completely disproportional to a competition of 12-13 y.o. kids. I know there are other skaters with whom much less is allowed before the torches are ignited and forks sharpened, but the level on which it got with Veronika is so superior to Sofia (because we all know that she was taught proper technique by the perfect coach, who didn't train Sofia at all - which was repeatedly cvalled wrong, the truth is the calls are based on who is in which camp now, not who trained whom four months ago) is unacceptable for me. It's not in the interest of the skaters, it's just "I'm pushing my agenda team A bad teacher, team B good teacher, the skaters are just used as a tool in that.
P. S.: As for the "you didn‘t post her take-off for example", well, it doesn't bother you when there is literally nothing posted yet persistently claimed this is UR/downgrade, this shouldn't receive such GOE etc. without literally anything. That's fine, of course
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- Jan 27, 2014
The “q” call was actually reintroduced in a newer communication so it’s been adopted by the ISU and by RusFed—you can see some in the protocols from this comp. (It’s also already being used by USFSA and I assume the other national feds.)
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- Apr 26, 2018
I think the post above yours sums up the whole thing just perfectly. It‘s been a long time since we‘ve had the last competition, there were no shows, no skating news over the whole summer - of course these championships are going to be discussed much more intensely than they would have been after a normal off-season.
As for your question - I don‘t find anything about this situation convenient, if anything it‘s rather amusing to read these “Prince Sergei the handsome guru of skating technique“ posts. They make me chuckle, imo it‘s kind of obvious that some of them are trolling and I don‘t see a need to constantly respond/get so worked up about them.
If we ignore the obvious attempts at trolling, however, I don‘t agree that the majority here is trying to discredit Sofia while lifting up Veronika. On the contrary, I have seen quite a few posts acknowledging Sofia‘s superiority in PCS while simultaneously mentioning Veronika‘s better jumping technique. One thing this thread has taught me is to make a conscious decision which posts/posters to interact with.
As for my opinion on the whole “Rozanov the genius“ debacle? Much of it is blown out of proportion and it both amuses and annoys me how he‘s suddenly seen as the pinnacle of skating technique and choreography. I do think he deserves credit for helping Aliona with the 3A last season, or restoring Veronika‘s 4T so quickly and with such a complex entry. But his programs, so far, are nothing to write home about and they are, in fact, rather inspired by the Daniil school of choreography. On the whole, though, it‘s much too early to judge accurately, it‘s been barely a few months. Let‘s see what he can do in the time leading up to the Olympics. I do think Plushenko has built quite the strong team on paper, Ilinykh and Rozanov seem like a good duo and with Trusova, Kostornaya, Zhilina, Muravieva, Titova and Konstantinova he has promising skaters to work with as well. It could turn out to be extremely effective or...not. But so far it‘s much too early to say, in both directions. Just my two cents on it.
Hey I am new . I think it will take time to see Rozanov is a young coach and that it is premature to evaluate him right now, from what I know he started coaching at Eteri in 2018. Surely the work he has done with these girl is incredible.I think the post above yours sums up the whole thing just perfectly. It‘s been a long time since we‘ve had the last competition, there were no shows, no skating news over the whole summer - of course these championships are going to be discussed much more intensely than they would have been after a normal off-season.
As for your question - I don‘t find anything about this situation convenient, if anything it‘s rather amusing to read these “Prince Sergei the handsome guru of skating technique“ posts. They make me chuckle, imo it‘s kind of obvious that some of them are trolling and I don‘t see a need to constantly respond/get so worked up about them.
If we ignore the obvious attempts at trolling, however, I don‘t agree that the majority here is trying to discredit Sofia while lifting up Veronika. On the contrary, I have seen quite a few posts acknowledging Sofia‘s superiority in PCS while simultaneously mentioning Veronika‘s better jumping technique. One thing this thread has taught me is to make a conscious decision which posts/posters to interact with.
As for my opinion on the whole “Rozanov the genius“ debacle? Much of it is blown out of proportion and it both amuses and annoys me how he‘s suddenly seen as the pinnacle of skating technique and choreography. I do think he deserves credit for helping Aliona with the 3A last season, or restoring Veronika‘s 4T so quickly and with such a complex entry. But his programs, so far, are nothing to write home about and they are, in fact, rather inspired by the Daniil school of choreography. On the whole, though, it‘s much too early to judge accurately, it‘s been barely a few months. Let‘s see what he can do in the time leading up to the Olympics. I do think Plushenko has built quite the strong team on paper, Ilinykh and Rozanov seem like a good duo and with Trusova, Kostornaya, Zhilina, Muravieva, Titova and Konstantinova he has promising skaters to work with as well. It could turn out to be extremely effective or...not. But so far it‘s much too early to say, in both directions. Just my two cents on it.
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- Dec 18, 2014
2.75 (edit: in the air) is q, less than 2.75 is underrotated 3A, less than 2 is downgraded triple jump in which base value is the same as double , which Akarieva got in the free. 3A rotated more than 2.75 is a fully rotated jump in the system, but of course it would get higher GOE if it is rotated 3. You can say that 3A is the only real 'triple jump' while for other triples is enough to rotate more than 2.25 for a toeloop, or a little bit more for harder triples. Thats why the difference in BV for 3A and the rest of triples.
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