2020-21 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating | Page 506 | Golden Skate

2020-21 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating

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Magill said:
We don't even know if anything really happened to affect them. It is all just gossip and I would not be surprised at the slightest if lots of black PR was involved, too They were all BFFs for life under Eteri and then got hateful and revengeful divas all of a sudden when moved? Really? How probable is it, judging by your own life experience? As for me, I think neither was or is true. No BFFs then, no mean and hateful divas now. That they have separate coaching teams, not a big deal and probably just best for them..
Lots of bad gossip started when Rozanov stopped working with Sasha cause everyone thought he had been the main reason for her changing coaches. Still it turned out it was ... well, sort of the other way round. :biggrin: Sasha just went to Plushenko for Plushenko. That sounds logical and I find it hard not to believe it. Alyona in her dark hour probably followed Rozanov who had been her fave coach who had given her 3A last season - so she got him,. I tend to believe Sasha relied on Rozanov to start with, as she needed some familiar face in the new environment. Now watching K&C etc. I tend to think she developed a great working relationship with Dima and having Plushy by her side, she just did not need Rozanov any more so she gave him up with no second thought. Similarly with Elena, maybe she just preferred working on her ice dancing skills with Dima and did not get on too well with a lady coach, nothing to do with Alyona again. Who knows? Especially that she has had her SS classes outside of AoP. It might have been just too much and too many experts going in too many directions so she had to choose - and she did.
And as far as we know, Alyona came to AoP really needing help with overcoming her injury and getting back in form again, especially getting her 3A back (and maybe gaining something more:biggrin: ). Just natural that Rozanov was asked to focus on her.
Probably Sasha was not head over heels to be back with Alyona again, but I don;t think she really cared for it as much as everybody wants us to believe. Just a bit of disappointment in the gossip department, but who cares?
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Well, being fair, *some specific* fans started calling Rozanov a turncoat for taking on Aliona, back when people started first noticing he‘s not working together with Sasha anymore.
So the whole talk about tensions between Aliona and Sasha have began and derived because of the Rozanov, Ilynykh situation, it didn’t come out of nowhere and wasn’t related to either leaving Eteri.
The situation does appear strange to outsiders, but no one truly knows what’s going on between them. Might as well be that it’s not due to any personal relationships, but rather pure technical/coaching mismatch: perhaps Alexandra wasn’t satisfied with Rozanov coaching her, like in case if he put restrictions on number of quads as they did in her previous team, and she felt like it’s not working out for her with him. Perhaps Ilynykh‘s coaching wasn’t sufficient for her, Lena is still super young herself, just 26, and Sasha wanted a different more experienced opinion?

As I said before, I wouldn’t make too much of it. Perhaps Sasha prefers it this way, perhaps it’s Aliona, perhaps their parents, perhaps it was just Plushenko’s decision, no one knows. If they’re ok with it, then it’s all that matters.
Let’s hope both do well and surprise us in a few days.
 
But then again, facial expressions aren't the only way to appear to truly be "emotional". I find it just as beautiful when skaters emote via body movements, when their arms begin to lift more hesitantly at softer sections of the music, or when they leap with confidence at a musical accent. Those little things can really immerse one into a performance, even if their face stays relatively blank throughout. Besides, since we are watching skating, and the movement of the skates on the ice, as well as the movement of the entire skater, not just their face, it seems only right to detract the focus from just facial expressions and expand the magnifying glass to the entire skater. Rika has really great SS, which makes her performances flow a lot better. For that reason, her programs feel really natural and you never get bored or feel like something is out of place. That's why I think she's a good skater, even in the performance aspect, she may not be putting her entire heart into making facial expressions, but her movements fit the music, and her skating is never empty. That's how I feel about Kostornaia too. She does better in facial expression areas (last few seconds of Twilight are a delight), but still, she does more of the emoting through fast but flowing movements and arm choreography. That doesn't mean she's a bad performer, it just means she performs in a different style.
 
Just because you talk to each other or are nice to each other, this doesn't mean that you're "friends". These skaters are normal teenage girls, not some saints who can't have bad thoughts or behavior :rolleye: Why do people try to find excuses for them all the time, it's ridiculous
 
While I don't think that Sasha and Aliona have personal problems, there does seem to be some tension in that group. We even saw it in public at test skates.
They don't have to be actual friends on or off the ice, but at least in TT it did seem like there was a healthy competition going on in trainings and the three girls got along, joked around and hung out sometimes outside of training.

At AoP it seems like, for whatever reason, they are doing everything they can to make sure Sasha and Aliona don't even have to see each other around.
I still find it strange that Rozanov was completely removed from Sasha's ISU profile, where he was previously listed as the choreographer since he choreo'd Sasha's programs this season. Now, for some reason, they changed it to Elena Ilinykh... but she doesn't even work with Sasha anymore either :oops:

We'll see how the AoP team handles the first Sasha vs Aliona competition.
 
vesperalvioletta said:
If something happened, I feel like it must have been between Europeans and when Sasha left, because they seemed perfectly amicable at Euros based on on-camera footage. Sasha's dad seems pretty intense about her career, which is fair, but if it's drama between the parents, it makes me sad that its affected the girls.
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I noticed at Euro's that Sasha seemed to be staying away from the others. Anna and Aloyna seemed to be pal'ing around, but it was obvious that Sasha was unhappy about something. I said then that Trusova was on her way out.
 
If I may wage in on the Sasha Aliona situation. As many has said now and then towards the end of last season Sasha seemed to be on a downward spiral and was if not unhappy then at least more tense and not as bubbly and happy as previously. I imagine that she felt disapointed that the further the season progressed the worse her competitive results got. In this situation its natural to go looking for someone or something to blame and then make a change to remove the "problem". Constantly being around ones greatest competition in a time of trouble and disapointment isnt easy and I imagine she felt overshadowed by Aliona and Anna. Moving away from that rink was probably partly about moving away from her biggest competetion and get a bit of a mental break. Competition is good because it makes you push harder but it can get to much. The current spplit of Plushenkos team and the complete 180 of Sashas involvement with Rosanov and Illinik seems to indicate that Sasha and Aliona doesnt want to train together anymore and I imagine a big part of this is wanting to be the main focus and the center of atention from the coaches.
For example I can see how it can mess with your head when the coaches you trust to help you win are at the same time also helping your biggest competition to win. There are examples all over when this kind of situation works good in youger years but when competitions get more serious and more is at stake the situation falls apart. People where predicting years ago that the one of the 3A who was the "loser" of their early senior carrer would leave Eteri. This was Sasha. And when she took Rosanov with her Aliona followed clearly marking who her favourite krystalini coach where.

I want to make it clear that I dont think any of them are bad people or divas only that this is common teenage feelings that just play out verry publicly because of their fantastic succeses as skaters.
 
Magill said:
We don't even know if anything really happened to affect them. It is all just gossip and I would not be surprised at the slightest if lots of black PR was involved, too They were all BFFs for life under Eteri and then got hateful and revengeful divas all of a sudden when moved? Really? How probable is it, judging by your own life experience? As for me, I think neither was or is true. No BFFs then, no mean and hateful divas now. That they have separate coaching teams, not a big deal and probably just best for them..
Lots of bad gossip started when Rozanov stopped working with Sasha cause everyone thought he had been the main reason for her changing coaches. Still it turned out it was ... well, sort of the other way round. :biggrin: Sasha just went to Plushenko for Plushenko. That sounds logical and I find it hard not to believe it. Alyona in her dark hour probably followed Rozanov who had been her fave coach who had given her 3A last season - so she got him,. I tend to believe Sasha relied on Rozanov to start with, as she needed some familiar face in the new environment. Now watching K&C etc. I tend to think she developed a great working relationship with Dima and having Plushy by her side, she just did not need Rozanov any more so she gave him up with no second thought. Similarly with Elena, maybe she just preferred working on her ice dancing skills with Dima and did not get on too well with a lady coach, nothing to do with Alyona again. Who knows? Especially that she has had her SS classes outside of AoP. It might have been just too much and too many experts going in too many directions so she had to choose - and she did.
And as far as we know, Alyona came to AoP really needing help with overcoming her injury and getting back in form again, especially getting her 3A back (and maybe gaining something more:biggrin: ). Just natural that Rozanov was asked to focus on her.
Probably Sasha was not head over heels to be back with Alyona again, but I don;t think she really cared for it as much as everybody wants us to believe. Just a bit of disappointment in the gossip department, but who cares?
Click to expand...

I don't think they were necessarily "bffs for life under Eteri"; sure there were team pictures taken together and we saw clips of them being "friendly" with each other during interviews and a little at press events but I don't think they or even Eteri and her team tried to portray them as Bffs - the "bffs' was a fantasy made up by fans.

In terms of what's going on at Plushenko's - unfortunately given the fact that Trusova seemingly can't keep a coach and the common thread is that the coaches are tied to her competitor is just fuel for gossip galore. Is it a big deal that Kostornaia and Trusova from outside appearance can't be around each other - not particularly; however when it was first rumored that this was the case I mentioned it will cause a problem if Plushenko gets more top tier talent where this "separation" of them is not feasible and that it could potentially cause problems with having to continually accommodate not only them but then other skaters are going to see the special accommodations and want those as well. An American expression comes to mind "give them an inch and they take a mile"; once you are accommodating 1 request you are just going to get more and more.
 
These girls are not friends. They are competitors. The whole 3A photo shoots with Alina were for publicity and money for Eteri. The girls themselves wanted distance from the 3A nickname and being grouped together like that. They felt disrespected. They’ve said so publicly They smiled for the cameras because that’s what they were trained to do.

However, I don’t see why it’s an issue if they’re friends or not at this point. It doesn’t affect their skating and Plushenko seems to have the coaching situation under control.
 
plushyfan said:
I never thought real rivals could be friends. That's one thing they do in front of the cameras.
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There’s a reason why Aliona is such good friends with Daria Pavluchenko. This occurs in sports all the time. It is very difficult to be friends with your rivals on a small field, when you are vying for world titles of course that tension is only made worse.

However I don’t think this speculation about whether they are friends or not is productive or healthy. We shouldn’t expect them to be friends. If they are then that’s good for them, if not then we should hope that the arrangements at AoP allow them to each thrive as individuals. We don’t know their thoughts on the arrangements but outwardly if you remove who is “supposed” to be working with who, there is no visible issue. Sasha’s parents were considering Plushenko way before Rozanov. Sasha said she needed someone to Hold a rod, and if that person at Sambo was Rozanov then she’d follow him to the coach she was already considering. But she just needed someone to hold a rod. (Per interview around Jr. Worlds) If her new coaches can help her train jumps without Rozanov, I don’t think she really cares who it is. Aliona obviously left for Rozanov. He was her favorite Sambo coach, they’ve been working together for six years. This makes sense.

Plush said he could not train with (name evades me at the moment) his rival, that Mishin had to keep them separate. He may be considering this angle when approaching Aliona and Sasha. At the end of the day their goals are not to make friends, they are to win medals. So even if there is infighting... does it matter?

Just my two cents.
 
sclloyd said:
There’s a reason why Aliona is such good friends with Daria Pavluchenko. This occurs in sports all the time. It is very difficult to be friends with your rivals on a small field, when you are vying for world titles of course that tension is only made worse.

However I don’t think this speculation about whether they are friends or not is productive or healthy. We shouldn’t expect them to be friends. If they are then that’s good for them, if not then we should hope that the arrangements at AoP allow them to each thrive as individuals. We don’t know their thoughts on the arrangements but outwardly if you remove who is “supposed” to be working with who, there is no visible issue. Sasha’s parents were considering Plushenko way before Rozanov. Sasha said she needed someone to Hold a rod, and if that person at Sambo was Rozanov then she’d follow him to the coach she was already considering. But she just needed someone to hold a rod. (Per interview around Jr. Worlds) If her new coaches can help her train jumps without Rozanov, I don’t think she really cares who it is. Aliona obviously left for Rozanov. He was her favorite Sambo coach, they’ve been working together for six years. This makes sense.

Plush said he could not train with (name evades me at the moment) his rival, that Mishin had to keep them separate. He may be considering this angle when approaching Aliona and Sasha. At the end of the day their goals are not to make friends, they are to win medals. So even if there is infighting... does it matter?

Just my two cents.
Click to expand...

I said that sentence in general. I don't believe competitors who have a chance to win or have chance to win any medals can be friends. Real friends.
I agree with you..it doesn't matter Sasha and Aliona are friends or not.
 
lopsilceci said:
While I don't think that Sasha and Aliona have personal problems, there does seem to be some tension in that group. We even saw it in public at test skates.
They don't have to be actual friends on or off the ice, but at least in TT it did seem like there was a healthy competition going on in trainings and the three girls got along, joked around and hung out sometimes outside of training.

At AoP it seems like, for whatever reason, they are doing everything they can to make sure Sasha and Aliona don't even have to see each other around.
I still find it strange that Rozanov was completely removed from Sasha's ISU profile, where he was previously listed as the choreographer since he choreo'd Sasha's programs this season. Now, for some reason, they changed it to Elena Ilinykh... but she doesn't even work with Sasha anymore either :oops:

We'll see how the AoP team handles the first Sasha vs Aliona competition.
Click to expand...
What's happening with Sasha and aliona is like all of us when we get tired of hearing our parents and we leave home for the first time we're an individual and we make the decisions. One of the reasons these two girls and especially Sasha left TT was to be an individual and not just one of many amazing talents in the same discipline with the same coach. Sasha was getting this individualized attention at PA and then one of her two greatest Rivals and threats showed up at the same Academy two months later and Sasha was allegedly not happy. Then the whole thing with young Sergei and Elena. While it's disappointing to those of us who want to see these girls as friendly with each other like they were at TT the competition is fierce partly because their careers are so short and their girls coming up behind them who will be able to beat them in a couple years. both girls have more say in their careers than they used to which is one of the reasons they left TT for PA. But with being individuals now and making decisions for yourselves just like of any other young person you're going to make good choices and bad choices and figure things out as it goes along. I think Plushenko is trying to appease both of them and their parents the best he can. That's really all he can do. All we can do for fans of these awesome girls is wish them good health and much success. I hope they're happy innew their nenvironment.
 
Amei said:
I don't think they were necessarily "bffs for life under Eteri"; sure there were team pictures taken together and we saw clips of them being "friendly" with each other during interviews and a little at press events but I don't think they or even Eteri and her team tried to portray them as Bffs - the "bffs' was a fantasy made up by fans.

In terms of what's going on at Plushenko's - unfortunately given the fact that Trusova seemingly can't keep a coach and the common thread is that the coaches are tied to her competitor is just fuel for gossip galore. Is it a big deal that Kostornaia and Trusova from outside appearance can't be around each other - not particularly; however when it was first rumored that this was the case I mentioned it will cause a problem if Plushenko gets more top tier talent where this "separation" of them is not feasible and that it could potentially cause problems with having to continually accommodate not only them but then other skaters are going to see the special accommodations and want those as well. An American expression comes to mind "give them an inch and they take a mile"; once you are accommodating 1 request you are just going to get more and more.
Click to expand...
That was a superlative post the best I've read on this touchy issue. Your last sentebce says it all Amei. Once a person gets power of salt in an individual sense when you're more than just one of the sum of the parts then you're going to want to make more decisions and more decisions and have more impact and more our with decision-making in your career. This is normal in life. The only thing that disappoints me about Sasha and aliona is that their coach is keeping them separated with different coaches and skating at different times. But if the girls are accepting of this then we should be to even though it's perplexing.
 
OK, predictions for Stage Four

This will be the toughest Stage yet.

My predictions would be:

1. Trusova
2. Kostornaia
3. Khromykh
4. Shulskaya (!)
5. Konstantinova
6. Samodurova
7. Tarakanova
8. Tsibinova
9. Nugumanova

We know nothing about Tarakanova and Tsibinova this season, they might surprise.
Shulskaya had a few mistakes last time but scored well, if she's clean this time she can go 4th
Konstantinova might still have stamina and UR issues, the same goes for Samodurova.
Poor Nugumanova won't stand a chance probably, but I hope she does well.

I would initially have placed Samodurova in 4th but she was such a disappointment in Minsk that I doubt she will succeed here. But I might be wrong!

I think the skaters 7th-9th will have difficulties to get to Nationals.
 
Jontor said:
OK, predictions for Stage Four

This will be the toughest Stage yet.

My predictions would be:

1. Trusova
2. Kostornaia
3. Khromykh
4. Shulskaya (!)
5. Konstantinova
6. Samodurova
7. Tarakanova
8. Tsibinova
9. Nugumanova

We know nothing about Tarakanova and Tsibinova this season, they might surprise.
Shulskaya had a few mistakes last time but scored well, if she's clean this time she can go 4th
Konstantinova might still have stamina and UR issues, the same goes for Samodurova.
Poor Nugumanova won't stand a chance probably, but I hope she does well.

I would initially have placed Samodurova in 4th but she was such a disappointment in Minsk that I doubt she will succeed here. But I might be wrong!

I think the skaters 7th-9th will have difficulties to get to Nationals.
Click to expand...
I agree with you, only I would switch Khromykh and Kostornaia 😬

The reason is that I'm not sure about Kosto having the 3A back yet and Maiia has her quad. She will have to be clean, though.
 
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