2020-21 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating

[Lzbee]

Maya showing Alyona what sportsmanship is:

Maya's certainly more gracious then your recent posts. The devil, Aliona, appears to be too.

 

[Azikin]

I did not come that conclusion. Both girls might have been unsure of the protocol given COVID-19, and apart from that, I thought Alena looked preoccupied, that’s all.

Agreed. I think from her gestures it's apparent it wasn't intentional.

 

[Tolstoj]

If I didn't watch her performances and just read the comments, I'd assume she bombed all over the place with 3 falls and 4 pops The pressure on those girls to be perfect every time is so ridiculous to the point even when they skate clean they are still "done", "regressing", "falling behind" or whatever. It's so toxic.

Yes, it is becoming a bit of a trend. It happened to Zhenya when she moved to Orser, it happened to Trusova earlier this season, it's happening to Kostornaya. She just needs to think of herself, the training to get back to the old form and leave all of that nonsense out.

Thankfully she seemed aware of everything based on what she said in the interviews (about the fear of scores dropping when you leave Eteri). No reason to attempt the 3a here if she is physically not ready yet, it'll come just this was not the time.

It was nice to see here the 3-3 combos still very clean in the free.

I think that Evgenia and Ksenia could also threathen Alyona, luckily they are both out of competition (?).

That seems very premature considering we haven't even seen them, and Zhenya looked really rough at the Test Skates, even rougher than Kostornaya. (for valid reasons of course but that's what we saw on the ice)

Based on the scores, it seems the podium competition at Nationals will be between:

Alexandra Trusova, Anna Shcherbakova, Kamila Valieva and Alena Kostornaya (but remember Valieva is not age eligible for Senior events). If Kostornaya gets the 3a back, she can beat Valieva, outside of Russia all of them honestly.

Usacheva and Tuktamysheva a bit behind, then the rest.

 

[katymay]

If I didn't watch her performances and just read the comments, I'd assume she bombed all over the place with 3 falls and 4 pops The pressure on those girls to be perfect every time is so ridiculous to the point even when they skate clean they are still "done", "regressing", "falling behind" or whatever. It's so toxic.

Anna Aliona and Sasha are probably the greatest figure skaters who have ever stepped on ice. All three are astounding. Aliona tends to peak later in the year, whereas Sasha peaks earlier. I suspect they will trade "wins" throughout the year, which is what makes the sport exciting. You really never know which one is going to win-how awesome is that? My only quibble is with the costuming, but I dislike long skirts on young girls. (teenagers) I really dislike Aliona's FS costume, and not a fan of Sasha's SP dress either.

 

[Ifwe]

Maya showing Alyona what sportsmanship is:

the same thing happened at jgbf 2017 where aliona forget to hug sasha anyways just say you hate aliona and go you’re embarrassing yourself jazzup.

 

[Artemisa]

"Nah, it looked very insecure, very unfinished, like a crude program, so I'm not particularly happy. Somewhere I didn't follow the drawing, somewhere I stumbled, added my hands and my steps not according to the drawing at all, so I not happy " from aliona interview. at least she’s self aware lol

more that she is a perfectionist .. and every fault she will analyze without sugar .. that's good becuase you know how to be better

If I didn't watch her performances and just read the comments, I'd assume she bombed all over the place with 3 falls and 4 pops The pressure on those girls to be perfect every time is so ridiculous to the point even when they skate clean they are still "done", "regressing", "falling behind" or whatever. It's so toxic.

One of the feww good comments since yesterday

 

[JazzUp]

Maya's certainly more gracious then your recent posts. The devil, Aliona, appears to be too.

My recent posts? My opinion on her performance was literally mirrored by Alyona in her interview

And if you think that "Why should I be thankful to TeamTut" is an example of being gracious, then I guess my thesaurus has a different definition of that word than yours.

 

[Fluture]

Maya showing Alyona what sportsmanship is:

Can someone call Maiia so that she shows JazzUp what common decency is, too?

Anyway, not that one should engage with your toxicity but this whole thing reminded me of Anna Pogorilaya forgetting to hug Ashley Wagner at Worlds 2016 and being grilled online for it. Later she apologized and hugged her at the press conference and all was fine. But the fans had already hunted down the witch. The only difference is, that now we‘re in a pandemic as well, where, you know, hugging might not actually be the best idea. But why use logic when you can -also come to the completely sane conclusion that Aliona‘s an ungrateful, jealous twat instead?

Future, I understand the reason for your sarcastic post (the user you replied to was rude). But I would try to explain you my point of view, as someone who also thinks that most skaters lose their magic after leaving Tutberidze.

Every time I watch a competition, I myself am awed how much better Eteri's skaters are (presumably, they also skate clean). There are a lot of young ladies from other coaching teams that have better technique, have better spins or skating skills, or are born performers, but they can never build the "whole picture" for me. Despite the strategic layouts and trainings, I cannot unsee the attention to detail in Team Tutberidze. Of course, their skaters are not 100% perfect, they constantly have to work on improving, but generally despite the technical part, they excel on n extensions, equal arm and leg involvement, nice hits of the music notes etc. Due to the trend in the past years, we see more and more teams trying to integrate this style but still they don't reach the same effect. Just hitting the music accents or adding some rippons, doing fancy combos is not enough..because a wholesome concept for the certain skater is missing. That's why I also thing that anyone could alure her entire coaching team (Daniil, Dudakov and Zheleznyakov), and the skaters training with them would be very good... but would never reach this uniqueness, because the artistical idea of how someone should develop in the following X years won't be there.

I do appreciate your genuine comment, thanks for that. So, I‘ll try to answer without sarcasm as well.

First things first: It may be surprising but I actually really like the Russian skating style. (i mean, idk why I‘d spend 90% of my time on goldenskate in this very thread otherwise but I said no sarcasm) It was Tutberidze‘s skaters that made me fall in love with figure skating. I watched Evgenia and then I watched Yulia and later Aliona and Nastya Tarakanova and Anna and Sasha and I marveled. Because they had a style of skating - and a complexity - that I‘d never seen like this before. They didn‘t just skate, they told a story, each of them and they made it look seamless, as if the jumps were no struggle at all. I know many like to hate on Evgenia‘s mime programs but I found them theatrical in way to tell a story that was absolutely unique to any sport. I felt like watching a movie and it drew me in completely. Same for most of their other programs. And in general, the concepts were fresh and well executed, too. In that way, I definitely get your sentiments because for a while, I felt the same.

But for me, the novelty has worn off in recent years and I have come to find that some of the originally unique ideas were reused and remodeled so often by their own choreographers, that they lost their entire charm. I‘m sure it‘s also the fact that Daniil has to choreograph about 50 programs per season but I simply do not find the amount of detail and precision in his choreography that I used to. At least not in most programs, there are exceptions where the old brilliance shines through (Anna’s and Alina’s SP last season, for example). Otherwise, though, his lack of inspiration shows. Case in point - Anna and Alina. Eteri and Daniil from 2017-18 would have NEVER simply swapped the music of an entire portion of a FS and yet leave the music the same. They‘d have been insulted by the very idea. They‘d also never have stolen the choreography of a popular dancer instead of creating their own.

And I agree that they tended to have a vision for most of their skaters but then there‘s those who got absolute misfits of programs - even in their best times. Remember Daria Panenkova‘s cheesy lipstick smearing program? She was 14 when they gave her that program. I shudder to even imagine any “artistical idea“ on how to develop that in the next years, had she stayed with them.

And right now, I don‘t see an artistic vision for any of their current skaters, maybe except Akatieva whose programs are actually pretty nice. Anna‘s SP is a worse carbon copy of her brilliant SP last season, her FS is...well, like I said, not something that would have happened in TeamTutberidze before. Kamila‘s SP is gorgeous, of course, but then there‘s that FS which has a nice idea but a rather unfortunate mix of repetitive music and the attempt to slap her usual leg kicks and other contortionist moves on it. And I don‘t want to even mention Daria Usacheva - who really got the short end of the stick two years in a row when it comes to programs. What is the artistic vision for her? Her R&J has a good step sequence but the rest is a rehashed version of her Je Suis Malade. Maybe it‘s the pandemic and a lack of training affecting their creativity in those cases. Fair enough. But you can look farther back and you‘ll find something like Alina‘s POTO or Anna‘s Firebird? What kind of vision was that? The first one was discussed ad nauseam but even the latter wasn‘t particularly brilliant. The two pieces had no correlation at all and while the costume change was cute, it was obviously only there to mask an otherwise quite nonsensical change of track.

Daniil has shown that he can be brilliant at creating seamless music cuts - just remember how he made Alina‘s Black absolutely unique by adding the Moonlight soundtrack to it. But in recent years I‘ve found that this becomes less and less and instead we get a never ending cycle of programs that are structured the same way, with the same old choreo, only to different music. And for someone who fell in love with TeamTutberidze‘s unique skating style, that‘s a pretty depressing development. Because I feel like it‘s become more like a chain production of winning programs than real concepts or artistic visions. I just don‘t see it anymore.

As for Aliona and Sasha:

Their vision for Sasha clearly wasn‘t working and I‘m not even sure what it was. She doesn‘t have to be the ice princess but what’s the sense in having her interpret a literal troll in one of her programs? Especially, when she‘s the skater that‘s always been criticized for a lack of artistry.

And for Aliona, so far, they‘ve done the same thing as TeamTutberidze did last season - one modern program, one lyrical program. That the effect is worse right now, is kind of obvious. Last season she was in the best shape of her life. This season... she isn‘t. And Twilight wasn’t exactly the pinnacle of choreography either - it only worked because Aliona loved it and that enthusiasm was palpable in her performance.

So, I do agree with you in a way, I just don‘t see the big drama. I certainly don‘t think Plushenko has this big vision for his skaters, in fact I‘ve criticized Rozanov‘s own choreography as a worse carbon copy of Daniil‘s style. And Shae Lynn has bad ideas too (I‘ll just say: Mariah Bell‘s FS this season). I‘m just baffled that some people would declare it as such after one less than optimal performance with intentionally missing choreography (Aliona herself said, she had no conditioning so she focused on landing the jumps primarily) while also not saying a SINGLE word about TeamTutberidze‘s lack of creative integrity this (and last) season. It just reeks of hypocrisy to me.

 

[JazzUp]

the same thing happened at jgbf 2017 where aliona forget to hug sasha anyways just say you hate aliona and go you’re embarrassing yourself jazzup.

the only one embarrassing oneself here is you because you just proved my point by bringing that up

 

[Lechat]

I did not come that conclusion. Both girls might have been unsure of the protocol given COVID-19, and apart from that, I thought Alena looked preoccupied, that’s all.

Nope she looks upset that’s all. If she was preoccupied, she would wear a mask. Sasha is not unsure about the protocol since she hugged kamila and Dasha before.

 

[Shayuki]

It's not really a secret that Kostornaya has a bit of a difficult personality. Daniil hinted such as well, and I've not really seen people going out of their way to speak positively of her like I have of Shcherbakova for example. The whole situation that caused her to leave Team Tutberidze also shows a bit of an ego to me. Well, not like I know her personally so who's to say...

Alëna also seems to require a specific kind of treatment to perform at her best, she's not like Trusova who can willpower herself into great performances no matter what's going on. Hence, I'm at this point not so sold on her having as strong of an end to the season, actually a couple of years ago when I was reading an interview of hers I got the feeling she wasn't so committed and didn't seem to have such a strong drive like Trusova and Shcherbakova have. So we'll see what happens with Kostornaya and whether she actually gets back to where she was last season.

Kostornaya's PCS was quite low for her which was deserved, her skating was almost as uninspired as her programs. They could use some serious work, they're not OK at all. I assume they'll get better but it's a little alarming. Only a level 2 step sequence, too. I don't know if she got a lvl 2 before, since like... the 2016-2017 season or something.

It's good that Trusova seems to have her 4S back in some condition, though I wonder why she decided to not go with Flip. Does she now just straight up Lip them so hard that she no longer wants to include any in her FS? I thought her 4F would have been in better condition than 4S, but guess not. She also could do Eu+3F instead of Eu+3S for more points with that layout, assuming her Flip is functional.


All in all, to this point Trusova's seemed to benefit far more from the transition, while I'm not sure what Kostornaya was looking for, but she definitely isn't there yet. And it's not just the 3A.

 

[McBibus]

I did not come that conclusion. Both girls might have been unsure of the protocol given COVID-19, and apart from that, I thought Alena looked preoccupied, that’s all.

I had the same impression.
Maia unlocked the physical contact and the did go with it too.
Would be nice to hear one of our russian friends translation of what they said before hugging

 

[Lechat]

Maya showing Alyona what sportsmanship is:

I think she only forgot, she must be frustrated not being able to do her most valuable jump yet.

 

[Lechat]

It's not really a secret that Kostornaya has a bit of a difficult personality. Daniil hinted such as well, and I've not really seen people going out of their way to speak positively of her like I have of Shcherbakova for example. The whole situation that caused her to leave Team Tutberidze also shows a bit of an ego to me. Well, not like I know her personally so who's to say...

Alëna also seems to require a specific kind of treatment to perform at her best, she's not like Trusova who can willpower herself into great performances no matter what's going on. Hence, I'm at this point not so sold on her having as strong of an end to the season, actually a couple of years ago when I was reading an interview of hers I got the feeling she wasn't so committed and didn't seem to have such a strong drive like Trusova and Shcherbakova have. So we'll see what happens with Kostornaya and whether she actually gets back to where she was last season.

Kostornaya's PCS was quite low for her which was deserved, her skating was almost as uninspired as her programs. They could use some serious work, they're not OK at all. I assume they'll get better but it's a little alarming. Only a level 2 step sequence, too. I don't know if she got a lvl 2 before, since like... the 2016-2017 season or something.

It's good that Trusova seems to have her 4S back in some condition, though I wonder why she decided to not go with Flip. Does she now just straight up Lip them so hard that she no longer wants to include any in her FS? I thought her 4F would have been in better condition than 4S, but guess not. She also could do Eu+3F instead of Eu+3S for more points with that layout, assuming her Flip is functional.


All in all, to this point Trusova's seemed to benefit far more from the transition, while I'm not sure what Kostornaya was looking for, but she definitely isn't there yet. And it's not just the 3A.

yeah Sasha is more combative and confident I only hope Alyona will not rest on her laurels because she needs her 3A back.

 

[Thrashergurl]

These girls were all raised, so to speak, in an environment that pit them against each other. There’s no secret that Sambo is highly competitive and these girls are a product of that.


Regarding Alena- people seem to be forgetting that she had some time off the ice where she wasn’t training. It takes time to get back into form. None of these girls are superhuman and can get into top shape in a matter of a few weeks. I agree the LP dress isn’t the best for her though, but she must like it. She is by far the most talented Russian skater to date, and I hope this season proves success for her.

 

[Idiote]

Crossposted in Sasha's fanfest but I would be curious to confront this thought of mine to other opinions

Regarding Sasha's FS choreo, I feel very lonely out here but I really liked the hip shimmy xD and I missed it yesterday. I understand how some people might find it vulgar or inappropriate, but to me it was a playful move that hinted a bit of characterization for Sasha's evil fate of love persona.

Also ever since test skates I found myself wishing for her to smile during the whole step sequence - not ever a princess-y smile, but more of a dark mischievous grin, to embody the evil fate rejoicing of Romeo and Juliet' tragic fate. That would be a challenge for Sasha to interpret that but I think it would be really cool and could really boost her artistry and help her get more into the character she portrays in her skate. But maybe I'm putting too much thought and fondness for antiheroes into this x')

What are your thoughts on that ?

 

[surimi]

the only one embarrassing oneself here is you because you just proved my point by bringing that up

I'd say the only thing the double non-hug episode proves, is that people will see what they want to see. We have no idea what the girls were thinking.

 

[Ziotic]

Crossposted in Sasha's fanfest but I would be curious to confront this thought of mine to other opinions

Regarding Sasha's FS choreo, I feel very lonely out here but I really liked the hip shimmy xD and I missed it yesterday. I understand how some people might find it vulgar or inappropriate, but to me it was a playful move that hinted a bit of characterization for Sasha's evil fate of love persona.

Also ever since test skates I found myself wishing for her to smile during the whole step sequence - not ever a princess-y smile, but more of a dark mischievous grin, to embody the evil fate rejoicing of Romeo and Juliet' tragic fate. That would be a challenge for Sasha to interpret that but I think it would be really cool and could really boost her artistry and help her get more into the character she portrays in her skate. But maybe I'm putting too much thought and fondness for antiheroes into this x')

What are your thoughts on that ?

I think she may just have been behind the music from the fall, the hip shimmy may return.

 

[macy]

you guys. please.

Aliona had time away from the ice from covid/quarantine plus the coaching switch, adding up to close to 3 months off the ice. that is A LOT of time away, even if you are still working off ice. there is a reason you don't see skaters take more than a week off a year. but Aliona is expected to be in top shape after missing almost THREE MONTHS? that's absurd.

on top of this, her FS is still very very young, not even 2 months old and not choreographed in person. the other girls have an extra 2-3 months of mileage on their programs over her. but she's still supposed to have that Aliona magic, right? she's supposed to whip out a few triple axels right? and since all of that is obviously gone and out the window, she's clearly regressed

AND she had a bad fall on a 3A a couple weeks ago, broke her boots, and couldn't train normally for a week. yes, it takes a week to break in new boots. yes, not training your programs normally for a week is a big deal.

please, THINK about the circumstances before you crucify a skater. you HAVE to be in top form to interpret, pull the audience in, perform jumps as good as you do outside the program, perform fast spins with good positions, skate fast and use the ice efficiently. being out of shape effects literally every single part of her skating-- her lack of speed, slow jump rotation, no 3As, everything.

why would any of you expect perfection from her at this stage? it's not realistic and is so unfair to her. she will get there, give her time. be patient. mark my words, by nationals you will see a much different skater. these girls are humans, not machines.

 

[McBibus]

I think she only forgot, she must be frustrated not being able to do her most valuable jump yet.

Do you really think Aliona come to Kazan in those conditions (weeks of work back on her opponents, new program, back problems, missing her 3A) thinking she could win?
2nd was the best possible result unless Sasha forgot to skate one program.
If she was upset it was at herself cause she expected to do better.

She either tought there should be no contacts or she was lost in her toughts (not uncommon to her even in presence of other persons. There is more than one video of people "waking her up" while she was daydreaming)