2020-21 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating | Page 543 | Golden Skate

2020-21 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating

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You sparked the Physicist in me so prepare for a lecture (preferably one held on chalkboards ;)):
When jumping there is essentially two things that matter Angular momentum ("amount" of rotation) and height.

Angular momentum is the term used in physics to describe rotation. It has a direction (essentialy the axis of rotation) and a value (essentially the amount of rotation produced during the takeoff). Angular momentum (L) relates three quantities: rotation speed (w), weight/mass (m) and moment of inertia (I) as L=mIw.
When jumping multirotation jumps we need to maximise w there are two ways to do this minimize m*I or maximize L.
To minimise m*I there are two things to consider the wheight. In this instance the smaller the better (remember this is not saying anyone should diet. Just laws of nature unforturnately). The second is to minimise the moment of inertia which is essentially a measurement of how far away from the axis of rotation your bodywheight is distributed. This is why I belive a thinner less curvy body type is more suited to quads since that body type will have a lower moment of inertia. This is also why a tight body position in the air is important.

To maximise the angular momentum aquired during the takeoff it is less simple since every jump is different. Loop is in this instance the easiest since the only way to gain angular momentum here is through the speed and the curve of the takeoff. Higher speed and more curve give higher angular momentum. But as Im sure everyone who has tried jumping knows more speed and curve requires more strength to controll since the forces acting on the body will be stronger. So a stronger body could potentially aquire more Angular momentu, and make up for the loss in weight and moment of inertia compared to a weaker thinner body. (But a body like sashas who at least for now is both thin and verry strong gets best of both worlds).
In axel, Toeloop and Salchow the movement of the right leg during takeoff also aquires angular momentum and in flip and Lutz the placement and manner of picking will influence the angular momentum aquired. The loop argument about the curve into the jump is valid for all jumps exept Lutz which essentially takes of on the "wrong" curve (at least if done properly like say Lisa T). This is why its considered more difficult than a Flip.
The arm movement will contribute some as well but comparatively little compared to the rest.

The last thing to consider is jumping height. This is verry strait forward higher jumps= more time in the air=more time to complete the rotation. Jumping height is directly given by the amount of uppward force generated by the takeoff leg when jumping. Here arm movements can also help slightly like in a well timed rippon but their contribution is comparatively small.

To sum up there is nothing stopping any bodytype jumping a quad but a thinner one will have less forces acting on the body and therefore not requirering the same strength. Since a thinner lighter body will naturally spinn faster than a heavier curvier one. The curvier body can make up for this in two ways either aquire more height or more angular momentum both of these requires strength (and good basic technique).
As an engineering graduate student I enjoyed your post haha.
 
Angular momentum is the term used in physics to describe rotation. It has a direction (essentialy the axis of rotation) and a value (essentially the amount of rotation produced during the takeoff). Angular momentum (L) relates three quantities: rotation speed (w), weight/mass (m) and moment of inertia (I) as L=mIw.
It does relate mass and angular velocity, but L = I w, though? I is a function of mass.
 
To sum up there is nothing stopping any bodytype jumping a quad but a thinner one will have less forces acting on the body and therefore not requirering the same strength. Since a thinner lighter body will naturally spinn faster than a heavier curvier one. The curvier body can make up for this in two ways either aquire more height or more angular momentum both of these requires strength (and good basic technique).
:cheer2:For the whole post (and the earlier one talking about body types while managing to remain tactful).

How about body height (e.g. tall and thin vs short and thin)? I guess the analysis gets a bit more complicated because it might also depend on torso-to-limb ratio... I think long arms and legs might help by increasing the potential amount of angular momentum change possible (because you can start wide and pull in more), but then if you don't have the strength and coordination to carry out this angular momentum change they they could be a hindrance. Apart from rotation speed, they'd also raise the center of gravity which I guess would also make it harder to land the jump because the amount of body lean permissible upon landing without leading to a fall would be smaller?
 
I am not sure about that. Both times Anna came as an underdog of 3A. Remember "good advises" people here gave to her at the beginning of the last season including staying in juniors? The first time it could be a pure luck. But 2 times in a row.... If Sasha wins CoR and nails her quads at the Nationals is one thing. If she wins CoR and fails the Nationals - it will be the other thing. Anna has a weapon of 3 highest value quads in the free program plus pcs edge over Sasha. If she lands all of them Sasha will have to deliver a 3A in the short program and 4 clean quads in the free program. She can do it but it will be a big challenge.

As for Alyona, she was more or less hopeless at her first outing in terms of winning either CoR or Rusnats. But there can be an upward looking trend. We shall see next week. My current view about Rusnats is 1-2 Trusova/Scherbakova 3 Valieva 4-5 Kostornaya/Usacheva 6-8 Tuktamysheva/Frolova/Khromykh
Russian Nationals three-peat for Anya! I see it coming. Sasha is on the same level as Anya obviously but she's very up and down mentally while Anya is more steady and more low key. Pressure doesn't seem to bother Anya that much. The pressure is on Sasha this season even more than last season when she was expected to do what Aliona and Anna did.
 
Russian Nationals three-peat for Anya! I see it coming. Sasha is on the same level as Anya obviously but she's very up and down mentally while Anya is more steady and more low key. Pressure doesn't seem to bother Anya that much. The pressure is on Sasha this season even more than last season when she was expected to do what Aliona and Anna did.
Shcherbakova's lack of getting rattled might be in her favor all around when it comes to team selections if she doesn't get her spot winning nationals
 
Shcherbakova's lack of getting rattled might be in her favor all around when it comes to team selections if she doesn't get her spot winning nationals
Anna doesn't have to worry about her spot. Neither does Sasha. The third spot is an open competition between Aliona and Liza. let's just hope they have an international competition or two like Europeans in worlds where we can talk about who the top three is from Russia.
 
Anna doesn't have to worry about her spot. Neither does Sasha. The third spot is an open competition between Aliona and Liza. let's just hope they have an international competition or two like Europeans in worlds where we can talk about who the top three is from Russia.
I'm not sure any spot can be guaranteed... Although, I have an awful feeling if it's between Aliona and Liza, Liza has no chance even with a 3A. We all saw how T Tarasova politicked the Judges Council and stopped Liza from going to the 2019 Worlds (despite her results earlier in the season), I have no doubt she would do it again.
 
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I'm not sure avy spot can be guaranteed... Although, I have an awful feeling if it's between Aliona and Liza, Liza has no chance even with a 3A. We all saw how T Tarasova politicked the Judges Council and stopped Liza from going to the 2019 Worlds (despite her results earlier in the season), I have no doubt she would do it again.
Unfortunately, as it stands I think if it comes down to any of Anna, Sasha, and Alena and Liza, I don't really think Liza has much of a chance... She would need to beat them outright at Nationals and not have it be close or have any of them make uncharacteristic mistakes.
 
Anna doesn't have to worry about her spot. Neither does Sasha. The third spot is an open competition between Aliona and Liza. let's just hope they have an international competition or two like Europeans in worlds where we can talk about who the top three is from Russia.
I'm not just talking this season :) This season may not result in a lot of international competitions, but showcasing to the coaches council for why you are a good bet for the Olympic team next year is just as important and a reputation for not getting rattled isn't something you gain or show that you have with 1 competition.
 
Unfortunately, as it stands I think if it comes down to any of Anna, Sasha, and Alena and Liza, I don't really think Liza has much of a chance... She would need to beat them outright at Nationals and not have it be close or have any of them make uncharacteristic mistakes.
Well that's true.

Although I'll never ever forgive Tarasova for what she did. Inexcusable as fast as I'm concerned -which is why I was fuming when Tarasova had the utter gall to post a photo of herself with Liza on her Instagram. That woman has no shame and I hope everyone knows it and gives her the side-eye for the rest of her days!
 
I just rewatched Kamila's short at her last CoR and I'm just mesmerised. The control of her body movements esp her arms. At first, I thought she might just be flailing but if you look closely, you notice the control she has on them most notably during the step sequence. Just gorg. I have fallen in love with the music piece too and I'm sad as not that many skaters have skated to that piece. I really wish more skaters will skate to it in the coming seasons. I watched the only other performance I saw of it which was Patrick Chen which was also sublime. Apparently the music was made for Patrick?
 
I'm not just talking this season :) This season may not result in a lot of international competitions, but showcasing to the coaches council for why you are a good bet for the Olympic team next year is just as important and a reputation for not getting rattled isn't something you gain or show that you have with 1 competition.
Yes, this season may not mean anything. But what about next season? And how are the RusFed going to choose GP entries for next year? That means that probably every domestic competition counts this year. How else would you get chosen to GPs...
 
Well that's true.

Although I'll never ever forgive Tarasova for what she did. Inexcusable as fast as I'm concerned -which is why I was fuming when Tarasova had the utter gall to post a photo of herself with Liza on her Instagram. That woman has no shame and I hope everyone knows it and gives her the side-eye for the rest of her days!
You're so dramatic sometimes...but in a good way. :)
 
I just rewatched Kamila's short at her last CoR and I'm just mesmerised. The control of her body movements esp her arms. At first, I thought she might just be flailing but if you look closely, you notice the control she has on them most notably during the step sequence. Just gorg. I have fallen in love with the music piece too and I'm sad as not that many skaters have skated to that piece. I really wish more skaters will skate to it in the coming seasons. I watched the only other performance I saw of it which was Patrick Chen which was also sublime. Apparently the music was made for Patrick?
Yes, the song was especially written in late 2018 by pair skater Eric Radford for Patrick Chan to skate during the Thank you canadian tour after the 2018 Olympics, where Canada took home the Olympic gold. Then Kamila skated it with Eric Radford playing the song at the piano in an European ice show earlier this year and used it as an EX for a while. The song is very beautiful and really suits Kamila.
 
Yes, the song was especially written in late 2018 by pair skater Eric Radford for Patrick Chan to skate during the Thank you canadian tour after the 2018 Olympics, where Canada took home the Olympic gold. Then Kamila skated it with Eric Radford playing the song at the piano in an European ice show earlier this year and used it as an EX for a while. The song is very beautiful and really suits Kamila.
For the case someone didn't see it:

 
It does relate mass and angular velocity, but L = I w, though? I is a function of mass.
After googling a bit I think you can write it either way. I can either include the mass or it can just be a shape factor that is multiplied by the mass. (at least if you assume the body is homogenious in its mass distribution)
 
Yes, the song was especially written in late 2018 by pair skater Eric Radford for Patrick Chan to skate during the Thank you canadian tour after the 2018 Olympics, where Canada took home the Olympic gold. Then Kamila skated it with Eric Radford playing the song at the piano in an European ice show earlier this year and used it as an EX for a while. The song is very beautiful and really suits Kamila.
Eric Radford and even her Mom has also liked twitter posts encouraging him to work with Kamila for her Olympic programs. if Eteri's team see the positive feedback Kamila is getting now with Eric's music i think they will be more than willing to collaborate again
 
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