2020-21 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating

[Scott512]

What does Kamila have from Sasha in her? That would be interesting.



What the hell are you talking about?

Just said she has some of their great qualities.

 

[chasingneverland]

Um, I think being concerned about a fever is certainly showing concern for Anna AND the other skaters. I understand you’re a huge Anna fan and good for you. But don’t pretend it isn’t irresponsible of the entire federation to allow a girl to compete with a fever. If they’re not following CDC guidelines here, what makes anyone think they will follow proper guidelines if there is a Worlds?
If you don’t understand how serious this could be, then your fandom is taking over your common sense.
I’m glad Anna won. It takes nothing away from her victory, yet it’s still extremely irresponsible to ignore all guidelines because a 16 year old wanted to win a 3rd title.

Unfortunately, not the first time someone has competed with a fever. Sofia S had a fever at test skates and competed the SP with it before being forced to withdraw. (Considering that most of their Worlds/Euros team and most of the alternates have had COVID/pneneomia/illness and all have been exposed (due to their training mates/coaches having it), I wouldn't be surprised if they're the only ones. The Russian Fed really fouled up and hasn't been protecting their skaters.)

 

[Scott512]

I saw the exhibition's skates of KV and Anna and they were great.

 

[Magill]

Well considering that Anna was asked repeatedly (during practice skates, before the SP, after the SP, before warm up, after warm for the FS, etc) to withdraw and she didn't because she made the decision a month ago that she would compete and against her coach, doctor, and parent's wishes she did, it clearly wasn't too difficult to withdraw.

After all Russia had already changed the method of qualification to RusNats to not be competition at two Cup of Russia stages due to their gross incompetence because almost none of their national team could fulfill that requirement. Literally their entire world/euros team (and almost all their alternates/B skaters) withdrew from/skated injured/ill from either a Cup of Russia stage, Rostelecom, or Russian Nationals (and in some cases more than one.)

Still those who competed thought that two places at the top are guaranteed spots and not just the first one. Which was my point.

 

[Magill]

Trusova’s case was a bit different because she had to show a clean skate after Rostelecom and the sooner the better to erase it, particularly because her closest substitute, Tuktamysheva, won gold. Trusova or her team makes correct decisions, no matter how much they are criticized for it. Her landing quads solidly, including one in the dark driving the highly artistic exhibition skate is also clever.

Agreed. Just was not my point.

 

[Fried]

The Russian Fed announced BEFORE Russian Nats even started that Russian Nats would NOT determine the World's team and would be merely a "motivational camp" with other competitions being taken into consideration. Or did you miss everyone talking about wanting Anna, Liza, Sasha to withdraw from Rus Nats because it was "motivational"?? They said nothing new here in fact it's EXACTLY what the Fed announced BEFORE the competition event started.

Regarding all other competitions, due to so many withdrawls from the Cup of Russia stages, they announced that that would no longer be the sole requirement for RusNats.

So no, they said all of this BEFORE.

No, they just didn't say everything. They made hints. They have only now become precise.
And I ask you, where is the fairness, if on the one hand one simply throws the previously established rules overboard due to injuries and illness and allows the athletes to miss the competitions and instead compete in new competitions later, but on the other hand the athlete, who has met ALL of the pre-determined criteria is denied the option to use them in place of the additional competitions added?
Where is the justice when someone who has excelled everywhere and is now injured as a result is forced to compete again instead of devoting himself to his health?
Where is the justice if all this does only not apply to the gold melaillist?
I don't see any justice here. I see arbitrariness here.

 

[chasingneverland]

I think then that it would be just more precise to say she's managed to beat one of them (not all but one which is somewhat misleading) .
But essentially I agree with you, of course, that they are not unbeatable any more and their spots for whatever competition are not guaranteed anymore. Still, I'd argue the same goes for Kamila. She might beat them all, but just the same might be beaten by them all (that provided Alyona comes back in her full form, with her 3A at least, which I still hope and wish for).

Yup sorry, I worded that wrong. But the point remains Kamila turns senior next year and has already proven to be a threat. She may get beaten, yes, but she's already proven to be capable of beating them (all of them) and she's still just a junior. She also has a 3A, keep in mind, so even a full form Aliona might not have the technical score to beat her. (It isn't stable yet but she's already landed it in competition. And keep in mind Aliona hasn't gotten hers back yet and Sasha's also isn't stable.) She also is arguably the most complete package of the 3 of them (and I LOVE Aliona and Anna and have a soft-spot for Sasha) and has the additional advantage of being younger and closer to the "peak" age next year when the Olympics (so has less issues with puberty/growing). For example, Kamila has a higher technical content than Aliona (also has a 3A so erases a lot of Aliona's SP advantage and has two quads in the FS and can add a 3A so is higher than Aliona's 2 3A FS) and will also get high PCS (so erases a lot of Aliona's PCS advantage), doesn't have a lutz edge issue like Anna and will also get high PCS and has a 3A and 2 quads (could even add a 3A to the long) to Anna's peak 3 quads (so can almost match Anna technically), and is much better artistically/PCS wise then Sasha while also being able to do a 3A and 2 quads (so while she can't match Sasha technically she's almost there and will get way higher PCS). Furthermore, she already scores high internationally even as a junior and is going to get her senior PCS bump (like Aliona, Anna, and Sasha did).

 

[Fried]

Just said she has some of their great qualities.

No you wrote:

(...) But I am sure Anna did not want to have KV win Rusnats. She sees KV getting a big push and she saw Sasha get the big push (...)

 

[chasingneverland]

Still those who competed thought that two places at the top are guaranteed spots and not just the first one. Which was my point.

No where did Russia say that. In fact by saying it was motivational and other competitions would be looked at they pretty much said that there were no guaranteed spots.

 

[McBibus]

Nobody says she has to denounce a title.
My posts stated the federation, coaches, parents and athletes should follow CDC guidelines. Why jeopardize your athletes and athletes around the world?

This non compliance is why we are in the predicament we are in to begin with.
Let’s hope the reports are false and they didn’t allow her to skate with a fever.

I agree on that: the fed (any feds not just this) should impose rigid security meausures for any event... avoiding parties could be a start

 

[Fried]

No where did Russia say that. In fact by saying it was motivational and other competitions would be looked at they pretty much said that there were no guaranteed spots.

If they said that, then they lied. Because there are guaranteed spots. Certain guaranteed spots.

 

[Scott512]

This is true anywhere. But there are CDC guidelines that sport teams need to follow. Temperature checks being one and not being allowed to compete with one. Sports are taking place all over the world and athletes are expected to follow these guidelines.

I know too many people that have died from Covid and what Anna did was Wrong. I’m
Very disappointing in her parents, her coaches and the federation at this

You should be least disappointed in Anya compared to everyone else. Athletes know only one speed you know this gurl.

There are reports Anna had a fever. I hope this isn’t true. It wild be extremely irresponsible of her, her parents and her team to allow this. Especially with it being a Covid symptom. Would she knowingly put other competitors at possible risk because she wanted a third title?
I hope the reports are false.

Gurl you know as well as everyone who posts on this board that athletes know only one speed and that is fast. Anna is no different and she desperately wanted a 3 peat at Russian nationals and she desperately wanted to beat Kamila and sasha and she did with her awe inspiring skates. She is trying to hold off KV for as long as possible.

Don't blane Anya for skating blame the federation for allowing her to skate.

Nastya Gubanova did not skate in the cup Series because she came in contact with people who had covid so she had to quarantine several times for a couple weeks at a time ruining her season. She wasn't sick mind you but she still had to basically waste a season of her career because of the protocols in place. If Anna was really not well at nationals and allowed to skate we must admire her courage and guts and huge heart but if that was the case then the federation bent the rules were them. No?

What's done is done and Anna KV and sasha were incredible all things considered. But the Russian federation can't make the same mistakes next season that they did this season in relations to covid and pneumonia.
If Anna really had a temperature of a 100ﾟ or more before the SP in an International competition they would have removed her. But I must say this girl has an unbelievable amount of guts and she has the clutch gene too just like Zhenya.

 

[chasingneverland]

No, they just didn't say everything. They made hints. They have only now become precise.
And I ask you, where is the fairness, if on the one hand one simply throws the previously established rules overboard due to injuries and illness and allows the athletes to miss the competitions and instead compete in new competitions later, but on the other hand the athlete, who has met ALL of the pre-determined criteria is denied the option to use them in place of the additional competitions added?
Where is the justice when someone who has excelled everywhere and is now injured as a result is forced to compete again instead of devoting himself to his health?
Where is the justice if all this does only not apply to the gold melaillist?
I don't see any justice here. I see arbitrariness here.

No, Kogan the director of FFKKR literally said before Russian Nat's, and I quote: "So, the Russian championship is officially not a selection for the world championship, but a motivational camp according to the results of which the federation will decide for itself who deserves to go to the Worlds and who does not." When asked if the Russian championship would not be the only tournament in the selection system for the world championship, he said “We have plans and not one tournament, but several, which pursue the goal of preserving the sports form of our skaters.” All of that was said before the RussianNats events happened.

I don't know how much more clearly you need to spelt out of you, especially when you consider all the withdrawls/injuries of literally the entire Russian World/Euros team (and most of their alternates).

 

[Skatefan15]

Late to the conversation, but I saw that article that said Shcherbakova apparently had a fever before the short... how was she allowed to compete?! And then also didn’t get her temp taken before the free? That was completely irresponsible from both the coaches and her parents. She really put her health AND others’ health at risk by competing with a fever. It’s not like she was social distancing from anyone, from the draw to the interview that had the entire coaching team, students, and interviewer WITHOUT masks. Her short and free were great, but all in all she shouldn’t have competed and the narrative that many are spinning about her skating “despite the adversities” being heroic and brave, is completely inaccurate. Now I just hope that her and everyone around her’s actions don’t have consequences for others (and for her own health as well).

 

[Magill]

Yup sorry, I worded that wrong. But the point remains Kamila turns senior next year and has already proven to be a threat. She may get beaten, yes, but she's already proven to be capable of beating them (all of them) and she's still just a junior. She also has a 3A, keep in mind, so even a full form Aliona might not have the technical score to beat her. (It isn't stable yet but she's already landed it in competition. And keep in mind Aliona hasn't gotten hers back yet and Sasha's also isn't stable.) She also is arguably the most complete package of the 3 of them (and I LOVE Aliona and Anna and have a soft-spot for Sasha) and has the additional advantage of being younger and closer to the "peak" age next year when the Olympics (so has less issues with puberty/growing). For example, Kamila has a higher technical content than Aliona (also has a 3A so erases a lot of Aliona's SP advantage and has two quads in the FS and can add a 3A so is higher than Aliona's 2 3A FS) and will also get high PCS (so erases a lot of Aliona's PCS advantage), doesn't have a lutz edge issue like Anna and will also get high PCS and has a 3A and 2 quads (could even add a 3A to the long) to Anna's peak 3 quads (so can almost match Anna technically), and is much better artistically/PCS wise then Sasha while also being able to do a 3A and 2 quads (so while she can't match Sasha technically she's almost there and will get way higher PCS). Furthermore, she already scores high internationally even as a junior and is going to get her senior PCS bump (like Aliona, Anna, and Sasha did).

All true. Still Kamila is also rather nervous as a skater, able to give an inspired perfomance like yesterday, or a splatfest like in CoR 2 FS. I don't mean she's not a threat or she's somehow inferior to them. I just think all the girls are still in the game with no one crossed out just yet, there is still a year to go and nobody's a lock as a lot might happen during this time.

 

[Fried]

No, Kogan the director of FFKKR literally said before Russian Nat's, and I quote: "So, the Russian championship is officially not a selection for the world championship, but a motivational camp according to the results of which the federation will decide for itself who deserves to go to the Worlds and who does not." When asked if the Russian championship would not be the only tournament in the selection system for the world championship, he said “We have plans and not one tournament, but several, which pursue the goal of preserving the sports form of our skaters.” All of that was said before the RussianNats events happened.

I don't know how much more clearly you need to spelt out of you, especially when you consider all the withdrawls/injuries of literally the entire Russian World/Euros team (and most of their alternates).

And if that's the case, I ask you why the first-placed don't have to go to the selection competitions. And I ask you why past competitions can be missed due to injuries and why not future ones.

 

[chasingneverland]

All true. Still Kamila is also rather nervous as a skater, able to give an inspired perfomance like yesterday, or a splatfest like in CoR 2 FS. I don't mean she's not a threat or she's somehow inferior to them. I just think all the girls are still in the game with no one crossed out just yet, there is still a year to go and nobody's a lock as a lot might happen during this time.

Oh agreed! My point was more that no one is a lock unlike last year where Anna, Aliona, and Sasha were as close to a lock as possible. And it's hard to see that they're not anymore when they haven't even had a chance to go to Worlds yet. Also yeah, Kamila is nervous but other than Anna (kinda) the others are too. Sasha, for example, has definitely had a nervous splatfest, not even counting her injured Rostelecom Cup event this year but looking at last year. She has even said that she hates skating last. They are also not immune to nerves.

 

[chasingneverland]

Late to the conversation, but I saw that article that said Shcherbakova apparently had a fever before the short... how was she allowed to compete?! And then also didn’t get her temp taken before the free? That was completely irresponsible from both the coaches and her parents. She really put her health AND others’ health at risk by competing with a fever. It’s not like she was social distancing from anyone, from the draw to the interview that had the entire coaching team, students, and interviewer WITHOUT masks. Her short and free were great, but all in all she shouldn’t have competed and the narrative that many are spinning about her skating “despite the adversities” being heroic and brave, is completely inaccurate. Now I just hope that her and everyone around her’s actions don’t have consequences for others (and for her own health as well).

Yeah. Unfortunately not the first time. Sofia S skated at senior test skates in the SP with a fever. She wasn't pulled until after she had already competed in the SP despite having a fever.

 

[emmaleemochizuki]

Yes KV is talented but I just don't find her skating particularly interesting to watch.

Shoot me if you want but this is my opinion.

 

[Magill]

No where did Russia say that. In fact by saying it was motivational and other competitions would be looked at they pretty much said that there were no guaranteed spots.

Yes, a day or two before the competition they announced they would announce the new rules after the competition . I explained my stand already and I do not think this discussion will get us any further. So I'd rather agree to disagree and end it here, on friendly terms, of course