2020-21 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating

[Draculus]

Every time you get on a plane or drive somewhere you're taking a risk. You're completely missing the point. I didn't say risks are bad. Calculated risks are good in fact. I said a culture that encourages needless risks and perpetuates a harmful environment for children (where physical and mental abuse is rampant and fostered) is bad.

Well, the key point is in your needless. Who is the judge? Who decides is risk calculated or not?
You deny Anna to be the judge here and give your opinion. Basically you are telling that you better than Anna know, what is needed for her, was the risk needless or not (without any data about her health).
if you aren't - then you would rather not judge her decision. But you do.

 

[Draculus]

Also, at 16 you ARE legally a minor. Yes, even in Russia 16 year olds have NOT reached the age of majority.

Being "minor" in this case means you cannot vote, cannot be in the army and are limited in some business activities. But you can have sex without restrictions (even marry - though with some difficulties).
You are fully responsible for you action, can be criminally prosecuted, go to prison, etc.

 

[nussnacker]

Freedom of speech is obviously not the the strength of this forum.

Anna performance was brilliant and probably her best ever (pcs wise).she deserved her win so much.

But indeed it leaves some doubts or suspicion how this is possible. But of course no facts/proof

Sorry but there’s a difference between freedom of speech and these kinds of hurtful accusations. At some point it crosses the line.
Alleging Aliona is dating her coach is crossing that line further than anything I‘ve seen here, and has no relation to freedom of speech. Saying Anna is doping, faking pneumonia etc is not a freedom of speech either. Alleging Sasha is faking her injury (for what purpose I can only wonder!) is not a freedom of speech.

“well, I’m just voicing my opinion”... No, guys. Think about what you’re making your allegations about. That’s not okay.

 

[Amei]

Concern is welcomed. I've defended Anna here and yet I'm very concerned about hers (and others) actions here (and elsewhere). While in some cases (like here), they worked out, they were needlessly risky and could have long-term implications.

What I find a bit disingenuous about this forum right now is that since Sochi the conversation about Russian ladies is that their careers are short, when Worlds was cancelled back in March people on here said things along the lines of 'it might have been Kostornaia/Trusova/Shcherbakova's only shot at a World championships' '1 of them likely never goes to Worlds', and now everyone seems to be shocked and alarmed that an athlete basically threw caution to the wind, ignored the potential for some negative long-term ramifications to her health and decided to compete. Some of the positive long-term benefits of what happened this past weekend: 1 thing we know for sure: Regardless of whether or not she ever steps foot on Olympic ice Shcherbakova has earned a place in Russian figure skating history that only 2 other women have accomplished and she did in a much more difficult time in Russian ladies figure skating. A possibility from her national title this past weekend: next year when it comes time for Olympic team selection the fact that she was able to win 3 consecutive national titles over top of most of the ladies who will also be vying for an Olympic team spot means she might have punched her ticket to the Olympics already and all she has to do next year is not completely meltdown.

 

[Vilord]

Only Anna has been named to the World's team. The rest remains to be seen. (Although probably Sasha is also secure.)

Even if Anna is the only one yet to be named I dont see how Sasha could resonably be replaced. She did after all beat Anna in the Russian Cup (by a few points in the 1st tie breaker). She has pretty amazing quads (and verry high BV) and apart from Rostelecom has been landing most of them fairly consistently.

Unless the rest of the season is Rostelecom level (which I hope it wont be) I dont see how two of Aliona, Liza T, Liza N or I guess possibly Nastya G or even Medvedeva could possibly replace her on a world team.

Aliona as has been proven last year can beat her if the 3A is back and stable and she has the stamina again for a full free with two backloaded 3-3s. I do however find that unlikely to happen this season with all the issues shes had. Liza if she sorts out her jump layout could possibly match Sasha on BV but has lower PCS and worse GOE on spins and steps at this point so I dont see her beating Sasha either. The rest just dont have the BV to compete.

 

[Vilord]

Only Anna has been named to the World's team. The rest remains to be seen. (Although probably Sasha is also secure.)

My current Power rankings for the worlds team would be:
1 Anna
2 Sasha
3 Aliona (without 3A but rest stable) (could be 1st or 2nd with stable 3A)
4 Liza T (could be 3rd if Aliona falters or sorts out the layout to maximize her BV)
5-6 Liza N (beat Liza T at nationals but protocol has potential to be a carrot cake if the panel is strict and has verry litte reputation internationally)
5-6 Nastya G (beat Sasha at Rostelecom and has more solid jumps than Liza N but is less special performance wise)

 

[Deripashka]

Well maybe 95% of russian top skaters live in Moscow which is area heavily hited by covid so its not so surprising. They training in groups, they changing clothes in common rooms, they have always full nose when for hours train in 10 °C and always blowing their noses around ice, touching each other, touching same door handles, same water taps etc. In such conditions its just a matter of time when whole group get covid. But these kids are athletes, they are young and strong, Im more worried about their parents and coaches.

 

[chasingneverland]

Even if Anna is the only one yet to be named I dont see how Sasha could resonably be replaced. She did after all bet Anna in the Russian Cup (by a few points in the 1st tie breaker). She has pretty amazing quads (and verry high BV) and apart from Rostelecom has been landing most of them fairly consistently.

Unless the rest of the season is Rostelecom level (which I hope it wont be) I dont see how two of Aliona, Liza T, Liza N or I guess possibly Nastya G or even Medvedeva could possibly replace her on a world team.

Aliona as has been proven last year can beat her if the 3A is back and stable and she has the stamina again for a full free with backloaded 3-3s. Liza if she sorts out her jump layout could possibly match Sasha on BV but has lower PCS and worse GOE on spins and steps at this point. The rest just dont have the BV to compete.

Oh agreed. Completely. I fully expect her to be on the team and she's certainly proven she's capable.

Sasha's just going to have to still compete more though, unfortunately.

 

[Scott512]

Only Anna has been named to the World's team. The rest remains to be seen. (Although probably Sasha is also secure.)

Sasha is not on the team? Does the fed want more of the wrath of plushy?

Anna is obviously an automatic and sasha should be as close to automaric as possible.
If AK can get her 3A back then she should be the third. Then you would have 3 great skaters that complement each other Sasha would be told by the fed to do 3 or 4 quads to win the gold for Russia if Anna or alyona have an off day. I like having 3 skaters that can compliment each other and are somewhat different but all can score 240 plus on an International scale.

 

[Vilord]

Sasha's just going to have to still compete more though, unfortunately.

I just hope she gets a month or so at least off from competing so there is time to heal whatever was going on at Rostelecom. Then we can have her wonderful 4T back along with this new rippon 4Lz.

 

[Vilord]

If AK can get her 3A back then she should be the third. Then you would have 3 great skaters that complement each other Sasha would be told by the fed to do 3 or 4 quads to win the gold for Russia if Anna or alyona have an off day. I like having 3 skaters that can compliment each other and are somewhat different but all can score 240 plus on an International scale.

I think Aliona is the 3rd even if she doesnt have the 3A but just her pree 3A layout back and stable. Liza could deffenitly challenge but Aliona have a huge advantage in PCS, spins and StSq and Liza isnt known for maximizing her jumps layout.

 

[Novalis]

I just hope she gets a month or so at least off from competing so there is time to heal whatever was going on at Rostelecom. Then we can have her wonderful 4T back along with this new rippon 4Lz.

She should be given the spot, so that she doesn't have rush back.

Though her next start is probably 2 months from now so that's likely long enough

 

[anonymoose_au]

That's an interesting idea. I call it 'blame hero culture'. So "heroic" deeds (in different times different things are considered heroic) are bad.
300 against 100000 is management error, first non-stop flight across Atlantic is madness (on a wooden plane!), mount Everest climbing is life sacrificed for pride (how many dead bodies are still there?), etc.

Do not take any risk! Avoid pain and stress! Never ever force yourself, willpower is a sin.
And die relaxed at your home sitting on sofa, streaming.

Now I'm the first to admit I hate pain and I can get stressed just sitting on my butt never mind doing something crazy.

But this is an obvious missing of the point.

These girls risked their health for a competition that except for one was ultimately pointless. This wasn't the Olympics, or Worlds, or even Euros or GPF.

It was Nationals (according to Yagudin "No-one cares who is Russian National Champion")

And it didn't even guarantee you a spot on the Worlds Team anyway! Even Anna, because remember before the event the Russian Figure Skating Fed totally covered their butts by claiming no spots would be decided from it. Which when you think about it is appalling - they were preparing for the possibility that the athletes they wanted wouldn't even make the podium! They knew how many of their top skaters were sick or injured and basically went ahead anyway. They're monsters.

Incidentally people should stop climbing Everest, people mostly do it for a lark these days, people who have no training. Of course the victims of their incompetence are the Nepalese Sherpas who often warn people of the dangers, are ignored and pay the price. 13 were killed in a single day in 2014.

 

[anonymoose_au]

I also worry that she (and Sasha for that matter) feel justified in their determination to skate here. (Not only for them but for others who watched them. Although that's certainly not new.)

I'm happy and proud of their achievements. But there are real concerns in them skating here and it remains to be seen what the long-term affect of that will be.

While Aliona will feel like she was robbed, and in a direct contradiction to claims here regarding how only Anna could withdraw herself, she was withdrawn by Plushy, she wanted to go.

So guess who's she's gonna blame? (But hey for most you that's a big old bonus.)

 

[Greengemmonster]

They need to send Trusova and bench her for now so she can rest and heal. This is absolute madness that she's not on the world team.

What is the plan here? Make Trusova skate until she pops a tendon and then send someone subpar? Russia may have a lot of quadsters but they actually don't have anyone of age with Trusova's BV right now for Worlds this year besides Anna. Making Trusova skate more is just insane.

They went medals and domination yes???? How is it rational to hinder Trusova????

 

[anonymoose_au]

Anna is obviously an automatic and sasha should be as close to automaric as possible

But she still needs to compete in an additional competition (or possibly more!) just to earn that privilege.

What happens if she has another outing like Rostelecom? Bye bye spot.

And she's injured, she needs time to recover, but noooooo the Russian Figure Skating Fed apparently knows better.

I sure hope they don't sit around at meetings wondering why their female skaters often suffer injuries.

 

[NadezhdaNadya]

I think Aliona is the 3rd even if she doesnt have the 3A but just her pree 3A layout back and stable. Liza could deffenitly challenge but Aliona have a huge advantage in PCS, spins and StSq and Liza isnt known for maximizing her jumps layout.

Unfortunately, Alyona has problems with almost everything these days - even with her spins. And she needs better choreographed FS, I do not think that Shae Lynn Bourne made a good program. Not by far.
I think similar program will be good for Alyona:

- YouTube

Enjoy the videos and music you love, upload original content, and share it all with friends, family, and the world on YouTube.

youtu.be

 

[NadezhdaNadya]

Alleging Aliona is dating her coach

OMG! He is so lovely!
I am wishing her happiness.(If it is true.)
People should stop being so narrow minded.

 

[Scott512]

What I find a bit disingenuous about this forum right now is that since Sochi the conversation about Russian ladies is that their careers are short, when Worlds was cancelled back in March people on here said things along the lines of 'it might have been Kostornaia/Trusova/Shcherbakova's only shot at a World championships' '1 of them likely never goes to Worlds', and now everyone seems to be shocked and alarmed that an athlete basically threw caution to the wind, ignored the potential for some negative long-term ramifications to her health and decided to compete. Some of the positive long-term benefits of what happened this past weekend: 1 thing we know for sure: Regardless of whether or not she ever steps foot on Olympic ice Shcherbakova has earned a place in Russian figure skating history that only 2 other women have accomplished and she did in a much more difficult time in Russian ladies figure skating. A possibility from her national title this past weekend: next year when it comes time for Olympic team selection the fact that she was able to win 3 consecutive national titles over top of most of the ladies who will also be vying for an Olympic team spot means she might have punched her ticket to the Olympics already and all she has to do next year is not completely meltdown.

It is painful to think 1 of 3A may never go to a world championship because there's only 3 spots. Anna is secure if she's healthy. I would think sasha would be likely even a year from now. Clearly the 3rd spot would be Kamilas to lose. There is a reasonable chance she will be the best I'm 31 year from now if they can have a season next season.

 

[Scott512]

But she still needs to compete in an additional competition (or possibly more!) just to earn that privilege.

What happens if she has another outing like Rostelecom? Bye bye spot.

And she's injured, she needs time to recover, but noooooo the Russian Figure Skating Fed apparently knows better.

I sure hope they don't sit around at meetings wondering why their female skaters often suffer injuries.

If there is a worlds this year I don't think of Sasha has anything more to prove. They have to take someone capable of scoring 240 or more.

I think we know she was banged up at the Moscow GP and skated because they thought it would be an easy gold for her. I like her only doing 2 quads now and I think if there's a worlds and she's on the team with Ana and allioni or lizer then you give her 3 quads to do and rack up the points.

I think I read somewhere that American skaters have had events that have been virtual we may be hammered by Corona virus for years why can't see the skating figure this out and while it won't be very good at virtual complications it will be better than nothing.