2021-2022 US Women's Figure Skating
- Thread starter Minz
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- Mar 6, 2021
Lindsay will not make the team because she has the disadvantage of having to appear at JGPF. Normally that would be an advantage but she is coming in with a season’s best 15 points below the other skaters, which means her PCS is going to be held down there even relative to the other juniors. So when she goes to senior nationals 4 weeks later, the PCS gap between her and the 5 senior women (Alysa Karen Mariah Amber Bradie) will be very large. Additionally Lindsay’s score from Warsaw Cup hurts her a lot too as she should have been looking to score 200+ there.
I think even if Lindsay has the highest TES at nationals with her 3Lz3Lo combo, the PCS is going to hold her back so much that she will be behind Mariah and Karen even if they have have some mistakes. As long as they don’t meltdown the fed will support them.
I think unless Bradie or Amber make a miraculous comeback at nationals that it will be Alysa Mariah and Karen. They are going to get the lenient judging at nationals which benefits them vs. Amber or Lindsay who won’t be rewarded for actually being able to rotate a 3-3.
I think even if Lindsay has the highest TES at nationals with her 3Lz3Lo combo, the PCS is going to hold her back so much that she will be behind Mariah and Karen even if they have have some mistakes. As long as they don’t meltdown the fed will support them.
I think unless Bradie or Amber make a miraculous comeback at nationals that it will be Alysa Mariah and Karen. They are going to get the lenient judging at nationals which benefits them vs. Amber or Lindsay who won’t be rewarded for actually being able to rotate a 3-3.
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- Feb 17, 2010
I don't think Lindsay will be held down, because if she earns a medal she's someone who can build on the Olympic experience the next few years, unlike most of the others who are likely nearing the end of their careers. I don't see the point of inflating the marks of the veterans who aren't Olympic medal hopefuls nor needed for the team event.
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- Feb 13, 2021
She was and Gabby Izzo is now in her place at Golden Spin
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- Feb 20, 2018
in hindsight, Lindsay should’ve competed on the senior GP this season. she’s put out consistently clean skates the entire season and would have been able to build her scores up this season as a senior. now instead, she goes into nationals with no senior experience except one competition where she was not rewarded properly because she hasn’t had time to build up her reputation (which shouldn’t exist, but it does, and i’m just being realistic)
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- Jul 9, 2014
I would suggest that it's more than being "New and Hot" Other than a clean Alysa, Lindsay has the highest Base Value by quite a bit over the rest of the US Ladies. It will be interesting to see her skate when she's in a field of seasoned senior skaters. I'm excited to see how she does under the pressure at the JGPF.
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- Feb 27, 2012
It would have been very unlikely for Lindsay to be invited to any GP this season other than Skate America, IMO.
(And even Skate America would not have been a sure thing.)
Before this season, Lindsay's entire international record:
- 26th at 2020 Junior Worlds, where she did not qualify for the FS
- 8th at 2019 JGP Poland
- 8th at 2019 JGP Poland
ETA:
Minor addition from Lindsay's USFS bio:
- 2nd in Advanced Novice at 2019 Bavarian Open
- 2nd in Advanced Novice at 2019 Bavarian Open
The only if/if/if scenario for a second GP would have been: *If* USFS had picked Lindsay over other women for the third slot for Skate America; *if* she had made a big impression at Skate America; and *if* someone else withdrew from another GP and the host fed (with no obligation to fill any slot with a U.S. woman) then decided to invite her.
According to the USFS document published in advance for 2018, Ashley's silver from 2016 Worlds would *not* have been considered as part of her BOW for Olympic selection. BOW included results only as far back at 2017 Nats.
In contrast, according to USFS procedures for 2022, Karen's fourth place at 2021 Worlds will be part of her BOW -- and potentially could be as important as results from 2022 Nats.
For skaters within the same Priority Group, one of the three additional differentiating factors will be: "Scores at the 2021 ISU World Figure Skating Championships and 2021 Grand Prix Final and the placement at the 2022 Toyota U.S. Figure Skating Championships to further identify competitiveness at the three most important events immediately preceding the 2022 Olympic Winter Games." (pp. 10-11)
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- Feb 17, 2010
I'm not convinced Karen's 4th place finish will be all that helpful if she doesn't medal at Nationals. She, Amber, and Mariah have all scored in the low 200s this season, so their scores are roughly on par with each other. If Amber finishes ahead of Karen, that would be the second time in a row and it would be hard to leave her home again IMO, especially since she wasn't given the opportunity to show what she could do at Worlds. Personally, I'd pick the two highest finishers among Bradie, Karen, Amber, and Mariah (and possibly Lindsay if she finishes in the top 2).
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- Jul 9, 2014
Neither am I. If she had had a better GP season I could see them holding her up especially with Bradie out. Unfortunately, If she finishes behind Amber for the second year in a row I don't see the Committee getting involved. The way things have gone this year, I hope they take the top 3 at Nationals, No matter who they are. IMO, No one has been dominate enough to warrant leaving a skater who defeats them at Nationals off the team.
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- Feb 13, 2021
Karen was behind Amber at Nationals by .35 points. I don't see how Karen is behind Amber so far this season when Amber bombed at her last GP and barely got a 200+ score at Skate America while Karen beat Mariah at her last GP and did well at Finlandia against the top Russians. I trust Karen more than Amber at this point and the fed probably does too.
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- Jul 9, 2014
Mariah's last GP was in Russia and Karen was not there. The way things look from a scoring standpoint, the team will be Alysa, Mariah, and Lindsay. But, as they say, Ice is slippery so we'll just have to wait for Nationals.
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- Feb 13, 2021
I was referring to Karen's last GP but it'll be very interesting to see all of the top women in Nashville. Hoping to see them in person if this variant doesn't shut stuff down
Good afternoon figure skating fans! I have followed all of your interesting and knowledgeable commentary over the years and have learned A LOT form this forum. I have been a loooong time figure skating fan since the days of Jill Trenary. That being said, this is a first time post...so be kind! After watching skating over this year (thank God for Peacock!), I seriously doubt that any US skater will make the final flight at the Olympics. In fact, it should be considered a "win" if they make the second to the last flight in the FS final. We just DO NOT have the goods to beat the Russian ladies (and Japan), and probably not even through the next Olympic cycle. However, we should send out strongest ladies contingent regardless. Sending someone as a "reward" for earning a third spot, or to send someone not ready just to gain experience makes no sense in my humble opinion. It would help our somewhat weakened international standing in this sport to do as well as possible in the Olympics. So my best guess is: Alysa, Mariah, and Karen/Bradie. I WILL be starting a new thread regarding my opinion on the Russian dominance in this sport, across all disciplines and how it is ruining the sport of figure skating.
Editing to add a PS: Isn't Mariah's simpler costumes a refreshing change for the overly decorated and accessorized costumes of some other competitors? Sequined gloves, beaded headbands, bedazzled costumes, and my least fav...tights over the boots (looks clunky). Need I say more?
Editing to add a PS: Isn't Mariah's simpler costumes a refreshing change for the overly decorated and accessorized costumes of some other competitors? Sequined gloves, beaded headbands, bedazzled costumes, and my least fav...tights over the boots (looks clunky). Need I say more?
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- Jul 9, 2014
What I liked about Mariah's performances in Russia is that she stood up to the pressure of skating in that amazing field of ladies. Other than lacking a 3/3 she is, IMO, a better performer than Karen and I think her PCS number will keep her ahead of Karen.
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- Jul 9, 2014
I'm going to suggest that you rethink this idea. There have been plenty of times that the US, Japan, or Canada have dominated the sport and things were just fine. It goes in cycles.
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- Mar 3, 2014
Welcome to Goldenskate, post long and post often.
All disciplines? Not so much. I follow the men most of all, and it would be a hard sell to say that Russian men, despite their many talents, “dominate”
Back to US women, as Mr Rice said, it‘s a long road with no turns. And if you’ve been around since Jill T. , you know that already.
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- Mar 13, 2018
Karen's mean PCS is higher than Mariah's. https://skatingscores.com/2122/women/pcs/
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- Feb 27, 2012
My heart is with Amber
above all (although I like the other women too).At the same time, I hope that USFS will adhere to the selection procedures that it published for 2022 -- especially because they are far more detailed than those published for 2018 and 2014.
And the way I read the 2022 procedures is that if the committee is making a close call, Karen's fourth place at 2021 Worlds could help her. YMMV.
(In any case, my original point remains that Ashley's silver at 2016 Worlds was not part of the BOW considered by USFS for 2018, whereas Karen's fourth place at 2021 Worlds is part of her BOW for 2022.)
If anyone is interested, YouTube channel of NBC Sports has video of Mariah's SP with Weir/Lipinski commentary:
https://youtu.be/H1CDf98Mhes (6:17, published Nov 28)
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- Jan 5, 2016
After this weekend, Mariah has definitely re-asserted herself in getting herself onto the olympic team. If it comes down to Mariah v. Karen though, I don't think "max scoring potential" is going to play a big role as much as who does better at nationals. I just don't see USFS selecting one over the other because of PCS, or who had the higher SB from the season, when neither Mariah nor Karen have a chance at medaling. When it comes to the team comp, if US was actually serious about getting a silver as opposed to the customary bronze, I really don't think Mariah or Karen gives us the edge over Alysa skating both programs.
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- Feb 10, 2014
USFS has actually set forth pretty detailed selection procedures that use benchmarks based on scores at 2021 Worlds and place skaters in priority groups. They focus a lot on how competitive skaters are based on total scores at selected 2021 international competitions and how the skater’s scores are trending. Placement at 2021 and 2022 Nationals is also considered but evaluated separately from scores in international competitions,
USFS doesn’t specify whether international scores are more or less important than placement at Nats, nor does it explain how junior scores will be evaluated versus senior scores (since junior FS programs have fewer elements).
USFS doesn’t specify whether international scores are more or less important than placement at Nats, nor does it explain how junior scores will be evaluated versus senior scores (since junior FS programs have fewer elements).
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