2021 Worlds: Pairs' Free Skate

[Andrea82]

The rules says:
"3 Spots for contries with top 2 max 13
2 spots for those with top 2 max 28
2 spots for one athlete top 10

1 Spots to be filled up as follows
Next highest ranked athlete from the NOCs not qualified with three (3) and two (2) places, until the quotas (16 for pairs) of qualification through the ISU World Figure Skating Championships 2021 are reached."

I interpret that as the +1 spot for china and Japan come before the 1 spot for HUN and CZE and that those contries dont get an automatic spot now but will have to go to Nebelhorn and that there then will be 3 +2 spots at Nebelhorn since Japan and China have to sen a 3rd/2nd pair to qualify there.

When will we get confirmed by the isu who is right?

The rule was amended to add:

"ISU Members who have earned the necessary points according to Rule 378, paragraph 2b) and c) will have the right for two (2) or three (3) entries if, in addition, they had two (2), respectively three (3) Skaters/Pairs/Couples qualified for the Free Skating/Free Dance in the World Senior Championships immediately preceding the OWG. The remaining entries under this paragraph 3 will be attributed to the ISU Members with the best placed and qualified for the Free Skating/Free Dance Skaters at the World Senior Championships immediately preceding the OWG"

I interepreted as Ice Coverage did.

However, there seems to be confusion about it. Czech Federation posted on their official IG that they got the Olympic spot tonight.
However, Jackie Wong tweeted that other sources indicate it works how you say.

 

[Vilord]

The rule was amended to add:

"ISU Members who have earned the necessary points according to Rule 378, paragraph 2b) and c) will have the right for two (2) or three (3) entries if, in addition, they had two (2), respectively three (3) Skaters/Pairs/Couples qualified for the Free Skating/Free Dance in the World Senior Championships immediately preceding the OWG. The remaining entries under this paragraph 3 will be attributed to the ISU Members with the best placed and qualified for the Free Skating/Free Dance Skaters at the World Senior Championships immediately preceding the OWG"

I interepreted as Ice Coverage did.

However, there seems to be confusion about it. Czech Federation posted on their official IG that they got the Olympic spot tonight.
However, Jackie Wong tweeted that other sources indicate it works how you say.

Im confused. So I will wait until its confirmed by ISU or IOC before I belive either

 

[flanker]

I know. I was mostly commenting to say it's a little disingenuous to say that M/G weren't even a pair. That's technically true but (1) Mishina was already a World Junior medalist and JGPF champion and (2) it's not like B/K were this great pairing and M/G came out of nowhere. As for the coaching switch, yes that happened but it didn't happen until this year. M/G had already won everything in juniors and medalled on the GPF their first senior season.

Yes, that's technically true and that's true in any other thinkable way. I don't see where you find it disingenuous. It wasn't said in a way to bash the other pair, just to show what way they walked through from summer 2017 to spring 2021. And They definitely improved under Mishina, gained more confidence, their movements are bigger, their performance is more self-conficdent (though of course they are still very young and in five years they can grom even more), which again is not said as anything against Velikovs. That's just said because that should be praised, that is victory for them and for Moskvina who definitely doesn't have the best part of her life now, nd yes, Velikovs should gain their part of appreciation.

 

[removof]

What are the spot for JO and for Worlds 2022?

 

[Lana05]

M/G were UNDERSCORED in PSC.
Get used to M/G's win. They'll get higher PSC next time

 

[ice coverage]

... When will we get confirmed by the isu who is right?

Adding to @Andrea82's reply, see also page 109 of the Minutes of the 2018 ISU Congress, where the acceptance of Proposal No. 211 is discussed:

If a country achieves enough points in the previous World Championships for two or three skaters, they have direct entries only if the country had the same number of skaters qualified in the Free Skating at the previous Worlds. If the country did not have as many, it can send a skater who did not skate in the FS in the Worlds to the qualifying competition. The proposal does not affect the right of other countries to send skaters to the qualifying event.​

In May 2017, the ISU published Communication 2093, which showed the status of 2018 OWG spots after 2017 Worlds -- with 2017 Nebelhorn yet to come.

I hope/expect that before too long, the ISU will be publishing an analogous document regarding the official status of 2022 OWG spots.
(I look forward to finding out what it will say.)

 

[Lamente Ariane]

The bile some people are spitting about "undeserving champions" is just ridiculous. At the end of the day, it's just a sport and you don't have to like the outcome. No one's making you rewatch the winner's skate on repeat. You don't even have to acknowledge them. But maybe consider that all of these athletes are hard working human beings who deserve respect for their achievements, and at least try to be civil in a public space?

 

[withwings]

Sasha looks pissed at Moskvina, says “congrats with world champions”

I am sure it will work out for the best to all of them. Moskvina is too good pscyhologist and have lot of expierence, and wisdom; so shecertainly will figure out how to turn biterness into good and productive energy.

 

[[email protected]]

Well, they were clean. That’s fair.

I do think Sui/Han should have been placed above M/G, though.

They surely will...next time...when they do proper SBS jumps. All their 3 passes were with mistakes. They lost to M/G more than 10 points on jumps. What gold for S/H are we talking about? With clean landings they would get a couple of extra pcs points because bad shaky landings detract from the performance and should be reflected in SS mark as well. So should deliver clean performances even with their overall lower BV they would still get something like 233 - 235 vs. M/G's 227. "Wuzrobbed" shouting in this particular situation is meaningless and just the unhappy fan emotion.

 

[Dogo]

Random comment: I'm happy for the Japanese pairs! His smile trying to cheer his partner is everything These guys have come a looong way

 

[[email protected]]

S/H's TES was a bit overscored all around. I do think the final difference is kinda fair, and could go either way. The fact is that, in the entire competition, M/G were the ONLY pair to do two clean programs.

That alone deserves praise.

I agree that S/H were overscored with twists getting virtually the same score as T/M whose twists are just on the different level. Their combo looked quite bad and to me the punishment was too mild. The throws were stronger than M/G's especially the flip but they had flip vs lutz and salchov vs. loop so that their throwBV is lower.

In the end of the day it's all about placements. People cry out that 1.15 pcs difference between clean "juniors" and non-clean "veterans" is too small? Fine, make it 2.15 or 2.5 points. Happy now? The placement won't change, though. M/G won this fair and square.

 

[Jammers]

Well the US had the first chance in probably decades to get 3 teams to Worlds and the Olympics next year and of course they couldn't get it done. It really was doable considering how weak the field is in Pairs right now even just a year before the Olympics when the depth should be a lot better.

 

[rain]

Congrats to Moore-Towers/Marinaro for pulling up to 6th after a very disappointing SP. Way to go!

 

[4everchan]

i read a couple pages of this thread... and i am going to have to say that i had forgotten not to show up in those threads after the event is over... during the event : awesome... people are watching, commenting, writing down content, etc... some focus on clothes or music, others on jumps... some have good choreographic insight... after the event " the wuzrobbed" bickering is overwhelming... i am a devoted S/H fan.. but others delivered better performances... you know.. it happens. Moving on.

 

[4everchan]

Well the US had the first chance in probably decades to get 3 teams to Worlds and the Olympics next year and of course they couldn't get it done. It really was doable considering how weak the field is in Pairs right now even just a year before the Olympics when the depth should be a lot better.

for worlds yes.. but not for Olympics : with only 2 pairs participating, there was never a shot to automatically qualify a 3rd pair... at least, that's how i understand the rules... IF they had gone 13 points or less, they would have been able to entered a pair at nebelhorn to get one of the potential spot there.... to get 3 spots for the games, a team needs to have 3 skaters/teams skating in the free program AND get 13 points or less.... Russians did this... Chinese will have to qualify a 3rd team at nebelhorn if they want to do so... (writing this that way as in the case of Japan, I can see them not bothering sending a 2nd team in Nebelhorn)

 

[Hyena]

I couldn't post during the last few groups because I was in work meetings, but WOW that was an exciting final group. Heartbreaking moments right beside brilliant moments in the same programs. I'm so sad for T/M, B/K, and S/H but thrilled for M/G. I was expecting S/H still to take it after they finished (and TBH there's something funky about the PCS in this comp so far) but can't say I disagree strongly with the outcome. I've seen potential in M/G since their Master & Marguerita program as juniors. They have excellent elements, solid skating skills, and a spark when they're on, even if they're not (yet) the most artistic team.

When is the last time we had a team win Worlds their first time out? The pressure will be on next year for sure, especially with such amazing competition at home.

I have a feeling it will end up like that for these two - and I think it will similarly mean people come down on one side and we will all argue over it every season with no one ever being 100% correct!

Oh gosh, B/K and M/G becoming a current Virtue/Moir vs. Davis/White? I better pick a side now!

...or go all in for Peng/Jin and Pavliuchenko/Khodykin just for kicks.

 

[rccr25]

I agree that S/H were overscored with twists getting virtually the same score as T/M whose twists are just on the different level. Their combo looked quite bad and to me the punishment was too mild. The throws were stronger than M/G's especially the flip but they had flip vs lutz and salchov vs. loop so that their throwBV is lower.

In the end of the day it's all about placements. People cry out that 1.15 pcs difference between clean "juniors" and non-clean "veterans" is too small? Fine, make it 2.15 or 2.5 points. Happy now? The placement won't change, though. M/G won this fair and square.

I think I need to remind you that PCS is not just about skating a program clean.

It's about skating skills, transitions, performance, composition, and interpretation of the music. S/H should definitely score higher. I like M/G as well. But S/H is just on a different level in terms of the above components and most importantly, the two skated as one.

I think part of the reason why people are not happy with the scoring is also skaters do get higher points, be it GOE or PCS, if they are Russian, compare to other skaters at the same level (and even beyond them). You have to admit that.

 

[[email protected]]

I think I need to remind you that PCS is not just about skating a program clean.

It's about skating skills, transitions, performance, composition, and interpretation of the music. S/H should definitely score higher. I like M/G as well. But S/H is just on a different level in terms of the above components and most importantly, the two skated as one.

I think part of the reason why people are not happy with the scoring is also skaters do get higher points, be it GOE or PCS, if they are Russian, compare to other skaters at the same level (and even beyond them). You have to admit that.

As I said I don't care about whether it is 1 or 2 or even 3 point pcs gap. Yes, even with 3 point gap S/H would have still lost - they needed at least 3.04 And no matter what pcs is made of I don't see 3.04 point gap between S/H and M/G not because I am the ultimate expert in judging pcs objectively but because the Chinese judge in this competition did not see that sort of gap either. She gave S/H 2.8 points more. And that would not be enough for them to win.

 

[Veronica245]

Completely deserved win. I really don’t get people who disagree. Yes we all love the Chinese, yes they are magical. But they cannot just walk out and win anymore. They have to be clean, they weren’t. And M&G are still kids but they are super talented kids and have amazing potential, and they skated the program of their lives. Earned 100%

 

[skylark]

Completely deserved win. I really don’t get people who disagree. Yes we all love the Chinese, yes they are magical. But they cannot just walk out and win anymore. They have to be clean, they weren’t. And M&G are still kids but they are super talented kids and have amazing potential, and they skated the program of their lives. Earned 100%

Absolutely!