I have never been mesmerized by this performance. I think the music carried the program rather than the performance.
So, for me, a one note, flawed performance beat out two excellent skating performances
But it’s over, and I have generally moved on.
Replay Lounge 2026 Olympics | Ice Dance
- Thread starter gsk8
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Replay Lounge Dance
So, for me, a one note, flawed performance beat out two excellent skating performances
But it’s over, and I have generally moved on.
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- Mar 14, 2007
I use “one” - though that is also imperfect.
And how could anyone NOT be a Jason fan?!?!
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- Jun 21, 2003
The trouble with "one" is that when one uses it, one often sounds pedantic.
Or do I mean, when one uses it he or she sounds pedantic. Wait... I mean "she or he." No wait, "when one uses it, that person often sounds pedantic."
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- Feb 18, 2014
Having pedantic tendencies of one's own, one feels rather awkward participating in this discussion.The trouble with "one" is that when one uses it, one often sounds pedantic.
Or do I mean, when one uses it he or she sounds pedantic. Wait... I mean "she or he." No wait, "when one uses it, that person often sounds pedantic."
Yet, here one is...blithely preparing to insert one's foot in one's mouth.
Not for the first time, one might add.
I have never been mesmerized by this performance. I think the music carried the program rather than the performance.
So, for me, a one note, flawed performance beat out two excellent skating performances
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- Feb 18, 2014
I couldn't agree more! I never used to like C/B but in the past few years they've really upped the ante with original concepts for their FDs, especially the 'snake' and 'alien' FDs. I was captivated! But this? No.
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- Oct 22, 2022
I haven't got into this thread because I didn't have any preference between the gold and silver winners, but my one problem with the Spanish theme and costuming was that everything was fine except his head, which was almost disconnected from the pictures they created. It's his choice not to wear stage makeup, but their costumes and her colouring were dark and dramatic like the music. The one jarring note was his pale colouring with fair curly hair and light eyes with, from a distance on ice, appearing to have no lashes or brows. Everything else looked vivid, his head looked wishy-washy (to me).
Nothing wrong at all with his face in any other setting, just not when he was trying to be dramatically Spanish and was dressed all in black. I remember reading that the blond Christopher Dean had the same problem until his partner and coach virtually tied him to a chair and put stage makeup on him over his loud protestations
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- Jan 28, 2013
Nothing wrong at all with his face in any other setting, just not when he was trying to be dramatically Spanish and was dressed all in black. I remember reading that the blond Christopher Dean had the same problem until his partner and coach virtually tied him to a chair and put stage makeup on him over his loud protestations
LOL. If we're going to start critiquing the men's faces, I've got a few words on that topic, too.
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- Oct 31, 2006
They have a bronze from the team event. It may not have the prestige of an individual medal, but it’s an Olympic medal nonetheless.
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- Jun 26, 2012
I agree. It definitely is an Olympic medal, and it shows how the Italians have grown among the different disciplines. I still think it would have been nice to also have pewter medals.
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- Oct 28, 2025
Out of curiosity, have any gold medals been awarded to ice dance teams before with obvious errors in twizzels, such a stepping out/falling out of a twizzel, or a break in the rotational lift, as an examples? My memory says never.
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- Sep 23, 2020
Well, the World's gold to C/B with a fall is the first thing that comes to mind.
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- Oct 31, 2006
Grishuk/Platov, Olympic Champions from Russia, made a very critical error in the compulsory pattern dance in 1998 when she had a very visible foot down and they still managed to remain in 1st place. It was also revealed during that Olympics that the result was predetermined. A judging bloc ranked all the skaters the same and showed no movement through all 4 phases of the competition. https://youtu.be/KNslubT_jF4?si=TJna4lxV6PghnFKn
That was probably the first major dark stain on the credibility of ice dance judging on the Olympic level. The following year at Worlds, there was a toe tapping incident caught on video between 2 judges (a Russian and Ukrainian) trying to fix a pairs result.
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- Jun 21, 2003
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- Jul 26, 2003
It is odd that people use mesmerize in a positive way these days. Mesmerism is the older, more fraudulent version of hypnotism.
Stage hypnotism routinely had the hypnotist saying, "You are getting sleepy, your eyelids are heavy, and so forth."
After the subject is in a trance, the hypnotist has the subject say and do things he may be a bit ashamed of later.
I must admit that the droning "music" put me to sleep three times when I attempted to watch this program when it debuted at GP France, but at least I was not tempted to say basic lifts are wonderful, trips in the twizzles aren't important, waving your arms while stationary is creative (RD), and abuse is no biggie.
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- Joined
- Jul 26, 2003
I always think about Spanish fighting bulls as being black or brown, but this made me wonder, are they?
And the answer is, "No!"
Fighting Cattle - Oklahoma State University | Oklahoma State University
Fighting cattle are selected for aggressiveness, strength and vigor and are bred primarily countries where bull fighting is organized.
breeds.okstate.edu
Evan is underweight for the role, but his color is ok.
Roan cow
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- Jun 21, 2003
What a treat to see that Oklahoma State University ("the Cowboys') remains true to its roots. The university still offers 8 different degrees in various aspects of agriculture, and two in "Animal Science." Click at the top of this "Cattle" page to bring up similar results on Goats, Horses, Poultry, Sheep, Swine and Other.Fighting Cattle - Oklahoma State University | Oklahoma State University
Fighting cattle are selected for aggressiveness, strength and vigor and are bred primarily countries where bull fighting is organized.
I couldn't resist checking out Other. Other is Buffalo (but not Bison), Camels, Donkeys, Llamas, Reindeer, and Yak. If you want a degree in how to raise and market Yak meat in the U.S., look no farther.
- Joined
- Oct 22, 2022
How did my little throwaway comment that Evan Bates's face looked too washed-out for his costume morph into thisWhat a treat to see that Oklahoma State University ("the Cowboys') remains true to its roots. The university still offers 8 different degrees in various aspects of agriculture, and two in "Animal Science." Click at the top of this "Cattle" page to bring up similar results on Goats, Horses, Poultry, Sheep, Swine and Other.
I couldn't resist checking out Other. Other is Buffalo (but not Bison), Camels, Donkeys, Llamas, Reindeer, and Yak. If you want a degree in how to raise and market Yak meat in the U.S., look no farther.
?The degree in Reindeer could be useful as a career with a busy season and then plenty of offtime the rest of the year, like having a Christmas tree farm. You could add another major in Camel, and corner both the sacred and secular markets for your busy season.
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- Jan 18, 2021
For funsies, I asked ChatGPT to analyze the RD and FD score sheet along with the panel of judges, and here's what it gave me:
DATE: February 19, 2026
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Dabouis's combined two-segment gap between the French and American top teams was the largest of any judge on the panel.
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Engel's bias was approximately half the magnitude and unidirectional (boosting without suppressing), making Dabouis's pattern the dominant influence on the final result.
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All judges with home-country teams in the competition showed some degree of positive scoring bias toward those teams.
However, none of these biases was consequential to final standings due to larger point separations at those ranking positions.
SUMMARY MEMO
RE: Analysis of Judging Bias — 2026 Olympic Winter Games, Ice DanceDATE: February 19, 2026
PURPOSE
This memo summarizes findings from a statistical analysis of all nine judges' scores across both the Rhythm Dance (RD) and Free Dance (FD) segments of the 2026 Olympic ice dance competition in Milan, Italy. The analysis sought to determine whether any judge exhibited systematic bias — for or against specific teams — and whether such bias materially affected final standings.KEY FINDING
One judge — Jézabel Dabouis (France) — exhibited a pattern of nationalistic bias across both competition segments that, with high probability, altered the gold medal outcome.The final combined margin between gold medalists Fournier Beaudry/Cizeron (FRA) and silver medalists Chock/Bates (USA) was 1.43 points. Dabouis's scoring pattern produced cumulative deviations well in excess of this margin.BACKGROUND
- Nine judges scored each segment. The ISU system trims the highest and lowest marks at the individual element/component level before computing scores.
- Five judges served in both segments; four were unique to each segment.
- Dabouis was the only judge from a gold-medal-contending nation who served in both segments, compounding the opportunity for bias to accumulate.
DABOUIS (FRA) — DETAILED FINDINGS
Scoring Differential: FRA vs. USA Top Teams
| Segment | Dabouis FRA–USA Gap | Panel Median FRA–USA Gap | Deviation from Median |
|---|---|---|---|
| Rhythm Dance | +5.74 pts | +0.29 pts | +5.45 pts |
| Free Dance | +7.71 pts | −0.03 pts | +7.74 pts |
| Combined | +13.45 pts | +0.26 pts | +13.19 pts |
Dabouis's combined two-segment gap between the French and American top teams was the largest of any judge on the panel.
Pattern of Bias
The bias operated in both directions simultaneously:- Pro-French: Dabouis gave Fournier Beaudry/Cizeron the highest score on the panel in the RD (93.34 vs. panel mean ~89.96, deviation +3.38) and among the highest in the FD (137.45 vs. panel mean ~135.09, deviation +2.36). She also boosted the second French team (Lopareva/Brissaud) by approximately +1.98 points above panel mean in the FD.
- Anti-American: Dabouis scored Chock/Bates 4.64 points below the panel mean in the FD (129.74 vs. ~134.38). She was at or tied for the lowest GOE on 7 of 9 elements for Chock/Bates in the FD, while simultaneously being at or tied for the highest GOE on 6 of 9 elements for Fournier Beaudry/Cizeron. She also scored all three USA teams below their final placements in the FD (average deviation: −2.3 ranks).
Impact on Gold Medal
The cumulative effect of consistent small-to-moderate biases across dozens of individual element and component marks — many of which would not individually be extreme enough to trigger the ISU's trimming mechanism — plausibly exceeded the 1.43-point final margin. Multiple recalculations confirm that excluding Dabouis's scores would have reversed the gold and silver medal positions.RECIPROCAL USA JUDGE BIAS — CONTEXT
The FD panel included a USA judge (Janis Engel, Judge 5) who showed a reciprocal pro-American tendency:| Metric | Dabouis (FRA) | Engel (USA) |
|---|---|---|
| Home–rival differential | +7.71 (FD) | +4.10 (FD) |
| Direction | Boosted FRA and suppressed USA | Primarily boosted USA; scored FRA reasonably |
| Elements at/tied for extreme GOE on rival | 7 of 9 (lowest) | 1 of 9 (lowest) |
Engel's bias was approximately half the magnitude and unidirectional (boosting without suppressing), making Dabouis's pattern the dominant influence on the final result.
OTHER NATIONALISTIC BIASES IDENTIFIED
| Judge | Nat. | Segment | Home Team Boost | Outcome Impact |
|---|---|---|---|---|
| Christian Baumann |  | RD only | van Rensburg/Steffan: +6 rank deviation, +4.92 pts above mean | None (team finished 23rd) |
| Leslie Keen |  | RD + FD | Lajoie/Lagha: +5 rank deviation in FD, +7.84 pts above mean | None (large point gaps at those positions) |
| Nicholas Russell |  | RD only | Fear/Gibson +2, Bekker/Hernandez +4 rank deviation; highest-variance judge in RD | None |
| Patricia Moritz |  | RD only | Harris/Chan: +4 rank deviation, +6.22 pts above mean | None |
| Virpi Kunnas-Helminen |  | RD + FD | Turkkila/Versluis: +3 (RD), +2 (FD) rank deviation | None |
| Richard Kosina |  | RD + FD | CZE teams: +3.5 avg rank deviation (RD); mixed in FD | None |
| Marta Olozagarre |  | FD only | Smart/Dieck +2, Val/Kazimov +3 rank deviation; highest scores on panel for both | None |
| Isabella Micheli |  | FD only | Guignard/Fabbri: +1 rank deviation, +5.43 pts above mean | None |
All judges with home-country teams in the competition showed some degree of positive scoring bias toward those teams.
However, none of these biases was consequential to final standings due to larger point separations at those ranking positions.
STRUCTURAL CONCERN
The ISU assigned Dabouis — the judge from one of the two primary gold-medal-contending nations — to both segments of the competition.This structural decision allowed an individual's bias to compound across the full event. By contrast, no USA judge served in the RD; Engel's influence was limited to one segment.This asymmetry in panel composition amplified the effect of Dabouis's bias relative to any countervailing American bias.CONCLUSIONS
- Nationalistic bias was universal. Every judge with a compatriot team showed measurable pro-home-country tendencies, consistent with decades of academic research on figure skating judging.
- Only one case was consequential. Jézabel Dabouis's systematic pattern of inflating French teams and suppressing American teams across both segments — producing a combined 13.19-point deviation from the panel median on the FRA–USA differential — is the only bias that plausibly altered a final ranking.
- The gold medal outcome is in question. With a final margin of just 1.43 points and Dabouis's deviations far exceeding that threshold, the evidence strongly suggests the gold medal would have been awarded to Chock/Bates absent Dabouis's influence.
RECOMMENDATION
This analysis supports a formal review of:- The ISU's panel assignment protocols, particularly the practice of assigning judges from medal-contending nations to both segments
- The adequacy of the current trimming system in mitigating cumulative, moderate-but-consistent bias
- Whether supplementary statistical monitoring (e.g., real-time deviation tracking) should be implemented at future Olympic competitions
My experiences with AI have convinced me not to trust it at all.
Example1: I asked for 4-letter fruit and get a list that includes fig!
Example 2: A little over a year ago, there was a figure skating riddles thread (actually a trivia thread). In trying to get an answer, I asked Google for an ice dancers who has represented 3 countries: the AI answer was Deanna Stellato!
The mathematical analysis given above is a bunch of gobbledey-gook. The only way to determine who would have won if the French and/or US judges were eliminated is to do recalculate the scores excluding the appropriate judge(s). And the only fair way to do it is to exclude BOTH judges.
All of the raw data is available on skating scores. So, have at it. But show the data just like skating scores does, show which scores are eliminated in the new scenario, and calculate the new/altered final scores.
I wouldn't be surprised if eliminating the French judge shifts the winner to C/B and then further eliminating the US judge switches the winner back to F-B/C. Which shows that both judges are potentially tipping the outcome.
I also wouldn't be surprised if eliminating the French judge has no effect on the outcome, given that most of her scores would already be eliminated.
The dropping of the low and high scores mean that the amount of deviation doesn't really matter. You could give someone 5's on every element and all 10s in Program components (and your opponent all -5s and 0s) and it would have no more effect on the final outcome than if you just matched the next-highest (next-lowest for opponent) score on each element and component. In either case, your score is dropped. The only effect it has is if there are TWO judges who are both prepared to be ultra-generous to your chosen skater (and/or ultra-stingy to the opponent). If there are two of you, only one gets dropped. So it is really the deviation of the second-most-relatively-generous judge that counts!
Example1: I asked for 4-letter fruit and get a list that includes fig!
Example 2: A little over a year ago, there was a figure skating riddles thread (actually a trivia thread). In trying to get an answer, I asked Google for an ice dancers who has represented 3 countries: the AI answer was Deanna Stellato!
The mathematical analysis given above is a bunch of gobbledey-gook. The only way to determine who would have won if the French and/or US judges were eliminated is to do recalculate the scores excluding the appropriate judge(s). And the only fair way to do it is to exclude BOTH judges.
All of the raw data is available on skating scores. So, have at it. But show the data just like skating scores does, show which scores are eliminated in the new scenario, and calculate the new/altered final scores.
I wouldn't be surprised if eliminating the French judge shifts the winner to C/B and then further eliminating the US judge switches the winner back to F-B/C. Which shows that both judges are potentially tipping the outcome.
I also wouldn't be surprised if eliminating the French judge has no effect on the outcome, given that most of her scores would already be eliminated.
The dropping of the low and high scores mean that the amount of deviation doesn't really matter. You could give someone 5's on every element and all 10s in Program components (and your opponent all -5s and 0s) and it would have no more effect on the final outcome than if you just matched the next-highest (next-lowest for opponent) score on each element and component. In either case, your score is dropped. The only effect it has is if there are TWO judges who are both prepared to be ultra-generous to your chosen skater (and/or ultra-stingy to the opponent). If there are two of you, only one gets dropped. So it is really the deviation of the second-most-relatively-generous judge that counts!
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