Advice regarding learning to skate

[physiotherapystudent]

Hi everyone,

I have (as many people here probably have) been inspired by watching the winter olympics and have decided I'd like to have a go at learning to figure skate. The only problem is that I don't have access to a rink for the next year or so. What I'm curious about is what would be the best thing to do to give myself a head start at learning once I actually have access to a rink. Should I take up dance of some kind? Roller skating? Or is there really nothing worthwhile other than maybe watching competitions?

For context, I'm in my 20s, male, 185cm tall, decently athletic (martial arts background), living in USA.

Any advice is greatly appreciated!

 

[Diana Delafield]

Hi everyone,

I have (as many people here probably have) been inspired by watching the winter olympics and have decided I'd like to have a go at learning to figure skate. The only problem is that I don't have access to a rink for the next year or so. What I'm curious about is what would be the best thing to do to give myself a head start at learning once I actually have access to a rink. Should I take up dance of some kind? Roller skating? Or is there really nothing worthwhile other than maybe watching competitions?

For context, I'm in my 20s, male, 185cm tall, decently athletic (martial arts background), living in USA.

Any advice is greatly appreciated!

Hi, and yes, you're one of many . I've been a lifelong figure skater and only a couple of years ago got talked into trying artistic roller skating as well. Very similar to figure skating (you can find videos on Youtube of roller competitions, where the programs they skate in competition are virtually identical to what you see on ice. Only with wheels. I do quad roller with the four wheels set in a square, but there are others here who swear by inline skates. Your choice. The bigger skate shops stock the same boots for both and the platforms and wheels as well as the blades for the ice aficionados, so you'll get eased into the world of gliding sports there. Where in the US do you live? Someone can direct you to the best skate shop near you. (I'm in west coast Canada, so not much help with shop locations.)

I was pleased to find that taking up quad roller actually helped my skating on ice, the wheels being heavier and building up my leg muscles more. Not that that sounds as if it's something you need, but for me, a small and lightweight female pairs skater and a retired competitor who's not that young anymore, it was a big plus.

Definitely take up artistic roller while you wait for ice time! If you can find a rink, club, and/or coach, so much the better. Your can learn the same figures (traced over a pattern painted on the floor) and the same set-pattern dances used on the ice. Plus the same freeskating moves like spins, basic jumps -- you'll have a big headstart for your career on the ice and the learning curve will be much less steep. Good luck and welcome to the sport !

 

[FethryDuck]

... I second what Diana wrote.
Maybe artistic inline (with the wheels in a row representing the "blade") is even a bit closer to figure skating than traditional quad roller skates. But both will do, even more so if you are a beginner.
Check the artistic inline posts/roller skate posts in the forum.

Artistic inline requires boots of the same stiffness as what you would need for figure skating. Boots for squad rollers can be a bit softer.

Wrt boots matching your size/weight/ foot form there are others in this forum that can give skilled advice.

 

[physiotherapystudent]

Thank you both! I'm going to look around for coaches for artistic inline and quad roller skating, and decide based on that. There aren't any in my area - so I'm mostly going to look online. Anyone got any recommendations?

I live in rural Virginia (closest city is Culpeper), so if anyone knows where to get skates near there that would be very nice to hear about as well.

 

[Query]

I'm not an expert. But a lot of skaters I know think one particular Virginia skate tech - Marlon at the Fairfax Ice Arena pro shop - is very good. And several of the skate boot makers give his name if you ask for a good fitters. You might be surprised how much of a difference a really good tech can make. You can call him to ask if he works with inline and quad roller skates.- if he doesn't, maybe he knows someone who does. You mostly need an appointment to see him.

As a male, you will likely have to order the skates - ones that fit probably won't be in stock anywhere. Order from the store with the good tech, so they will help if there is a problem - which happens a lot.

I know a karate lady who made pretty rapid progress ice skating. She says there is a lot in common with the katas and aerial moves she learned for karate.

A lot of young skaters have a background in gymnastics and/or ballet. I've had several ice dance coaches who had also taken lessons in ballroom dance to help prepare them for ice dance. Maybe that has something to do with a similarity in holds and posture (and at a higher level, maybe some of the lifts), if you want two people to move gracefully in unison. But AFAIK, ballroom isn't as common for singles skaters. And maybe that is mostly at the higher athletic levels.

AFAICT, the figure skaters who compete at the Olympics, or even at U.S. Nationals, usually started skating and/or gymnastics and/or performance dance at the age of 2 to 5. A dance teacher once told me that you can easily distinguish people like that - because that is when people can develop the right bone and joint structures to flow smoothly. I have no idea whether your martial art background creates body structures capable of the same graceful flow, or whether everyone agrees with that. Of course, if you just want to look more graceful than 95-99% of the people at a typical rink, that has a much lower bar. Most of them don't put in the time and dedication, never take private lessons (which are somewhat expensive) or buy good equipment, and some of them are afraid of balancing and falling on skates. If you have a solid martial arts background, you probably at least know how to fall without hurting yourself. A lot of adults don't know that.

 

[physiotherapystudent]

Thank you! I will definitely look into ordering from the Fairfax Ice Arena pro shop. It is quite a far drive for me, but it will be worth it. And I do not know if my martial art creates the appropriate body structures for flow. It certainly has a performance aspect to it that does value flow, so I surmise it would do something - but I do not know how it would compare to dance/gymnastics/skating.

 

[midori green]

Is your name accurate? Are you a PT student? Work on your gluteus medius muscles! Single-leg squats in multiple planes, small hops, etc. This will help you with edge contol and jump landings. Picture skaters with deep knee bend and smooth turns and edges. People that learn as adults often skate a little more stiff and lack knee bend (not always, of course). I think your martial arts background will help you.

 

[physiotherapystudent]

Thank you! I have not been accepted into a program yet, but I do intend to study physiotherapy. I totally understand the reasoning behind gluteus medius strengthening, and will work on it. I have started watching skating competitions and have definitely noticed what you mentioned about the stiff skating. Adult nationals vs standard-track nationals look very different in that regard.

Also, in terms of getting skates: I found a good deal on a Jackson Finesse boot with roller frames (3 wheels and a rubber thing that appears to work like a toe pick). How far would I be able to go with the Finesse boots? Are they one of those boots that is good for recreational but stops being useful as soon as I start jumping? Or would they take me through some single jumps and basic spinning? I accept the fact that one boot will not last my whole career, but I am hoping that I might be able to use one boot with the roller frames, and get by with that until I move and have access to ice. Is that realistic?

 

[Anna K.]

I have not been accepted into a program yet, but I do intend to study physiotherapy.

I can give only off-ice advice but I can't keep this one to myself: do it! When you will start skating and meeting skating people, you will as a minimum find excellent clientele as a physiotherapist. This is a very demanded skill in skating circles. And a physio with practical knowledge in skating? Awesome!

 

[FethryDuck]

Given your size (together with the respective weight) the Finesse boot is probably not stiff enough for you.

I suggest you start a new post (title: "boot advice needed for male, 20 years, 185cm tall, xx kg / lbs weight) to solicit proper boot recommendations.

Apart from stiffness and boot length, different boot models fit different foot types (fleshy/ bony, wide/narrow, egyption/greek toes, flat/high arches, ...) differently.
For obvious reasons boot manufacturers do not state on their websites things like "our boots are suited best for narrow feet with high arches, if you have different feet look somewhere else".
But there are persons in that forum who have the respective knowledge wrt fit of different boot models.

The boot needs to fit as a glove: no lifting of the heel but no squashing of forefoot/toes either. Otherwise you mave experience pain, blisters or in the long run bunions or hallux valgus or other issues. Apart from the fact that it is no fun to skate with feet that hurt.

Heat molding and some punchouts to remove pressure points are possible but best to in the first place buy a boot that suits your foot type.

And, as stated before, artistic inline requires the same boots and boot stiffness as figure skating. I am saying this as some persons may not respond to posts that read "inline" or "roller skating".

 

[physiotherapystudent]

Thank you - I'll do exactly that!

 

[Diana Delafield]

I can give only off-ice advice but I can't keep this one to myself: do it! When you will start skating and meeting skating people, you will as a minimum find excellent clientele as a physiotherapist. This is a very demanded skill in skating circles. And a physio with practical knowledge in skating? Awesome!

I had a physiotherapist once who was the younger brother of a pair of Canadian ice dancers, although he only took a few years of lessons himself. He said he'd grown up seeing one or other of his siblings using therapists for injuries, and figured he might as well become one so they could save time and money with him patching them up at home . It was a family joke at first, but then he actually became one and made a good career out of it. (And it helped that his siblings eventually retired, both became coaches, and sent any injured students to him.)

 

[physiotherapystudent]

I can give only off-ice advice but I can't keep this one to myself: do it! When you will start skating and meeting skating people, you will as a minimum find excellent clientele as a physiotherapist. This is a very demanded skill in skating circles. And a physio with practical knowledge in skating? Awesome!

I am sort of hoping to become a skating specific physio - it might be ridiculous but I think it would be quite a nice life to be training and competing in the adult circuit whilst working as a physio for elite/youth skaters.

 

[Query]

There are at least a couple PTs who have published training materials specific to figure skating, like Sk8Strong. I bought some of her stuff, and was reasonably pleased by it. That was some time ago. She was, at least at that time, able to answer some of my questions.

There are also a fair number of coaches who are also PTs.

And you can find figure skating-specific exercises for free by searching Youtube.

Some times free stuff is worth what you pay for it, but some of it might be useful.

Some places that don't have ice skating rinks do have roller/inline skating rinks. You can sometimes take lessons there.

I don't know exactly what it is that people who start similar activities very young develop that some of us don't. But flexibility is a big one. E.g., a surprisingly large fraction of very young children can put their feet in their mouths, do splits, and go into Ballet first position (in which your feet point sideways, in opposite directions - many people say done "right", to reduce knee injuries, the rotation should be entirely from your hips, without needing to rotate at your knees.) And they can point and flex their ankles a lot. That is partly because they still have cartilage where those of us who are older have bone. But the bone shape develops adaptively, depending on what you do. Very flexible people have to have joints (e.g., e.g., in ball-and-socket shaped joints) that are relatively flat. They also have or develop relatively long muscles and ligaments length.

There are good reasons for adaptive growth - very flexible people are particularly vulnerable to certain categories of injury. So it makes sense for the body to adopt a configuration that tends to prevent those injuries, if you don't need them - which is probably true if you don't use them. I'm not sure how true that is for martial arts. And maybe it depends on which martial arts you study.

A lot of of very good figure skaters can do splits, or come fairly close, and it is harder to do some figure skating moves if you can't come close to ballet first position. But not all good figure skaters can do those things.

Does the type of martial arts training you have had include "isolation exercises" - where you practice moving one joint, while holding adjacent joints still, even if they are crossed by the same muscles? As well as exercises where you let the motion point flow smoothly from one joint to the next? (E.g., start a rotation in an ankle, let it flow smoothly upwards through your knee - though you have to be careful of that - you don't want to jump or land on rotated knees - then through your hips, and on up the spine, one disk at a time, and on up through the neck and arm joints. Then reverse the motion. Again, start a wave of motion in fingers, let it flow progressively through your wrist, elbow and shoulders, through the neck and into the other side, all the way to the fingers of your other hand. And smoothly reverse that flow back to the original hand.) There seems to be a fair bit of isolation and flow transfer in the most graceful figure skating. I found that sort of thing hard to learn as an adult. It seems to be part of what people call "grace". But maybe you learned it in martial arts - e.g., if you studied Akido, Tai Chi, or something similar, that involves smooth controlled dance-like motion flow.

I wonder if spinning without getting dizzy is also a skill best learned young. Though - spins in figure skating - both on the ice, and in the air - are often so fast that coaches tell us it is OK to get dizzy, as long as we can ignore the dizziness without losing our balance.

I am pretty sure that being aware of the relative positions of various body parts is something that is best learned young.

 

[physiotherapystudent]

Thank you for those suggestions! I started searching a lot on YouTube, and found jump tutorials. Is it worth trying to figure out the jump mechanics off ice by learning from those tutorials? Or is it better not to do that and just do general body preparation until I find a coach/get on ice?

The martial arts I studied helped somewhat with both flexibility and flow work. I did a couple of Chinese styles, including a form of Tai Chi. We had an exercise similar to the one you described. I'll certainly start looking more into that flow work though, I see how it would be helpful. The isolation exercises were a big part of training across all four martial arts I learned.

 

[Diana Delafield]

Thank you for those suggestions! I started searching a lot on YouTube, and found jump tutorials. Is it worth trying to figure out the jump mechanics off ice by learning from those tutorials? Or is it better not to do that and just do general body preparation until I find a coach/get on ice?

The martial arts I studied helped somewhat with both flexibility and flow work. I did a couple of Chinese styles, including a form of Tai Chi. We had an exercise similar to the one you described. I'll certainly start looking more into that flow work though, I see how it would be helpful. The isolation exercises were a big part of training across all four martial arts I learned.

Trying to learn anything about figure skating from videos, and particularly jumps, is never a good idea. Please wait until you have a coach and then wait until that coach says you're ready to learn to jump, which won't be at the beginning. You need a coach standing by in person, checking and correcting each part of whatever you're trying to do. Basic safety for injury prevention.

 

[physiotherapystudent]

Thank you. That makes a lot of sense and is honestly what I thought was the right course of action - just wanted to make sure. I'll find a coach for roller skating then, as it seems multiple people have mentioned that as a worthwhile thing to train until I get on the ice. Does anyone have any recommendations?

 

[Diana Delafield]

Thank you. That makes a lot of sense and is honestly what I thought was the right course of action - just wanted to make sure. I'll find a coach for roller skating then, as it seems multiple people have mentioned that as a worthwhile thing to train until I get on the ice. Does anyone have any recommendations?

Can't help you with specifics, not knowing the roller scene where you live. But look/phone around for a roller rink in your area (in Canada, many arenas with multiple ice surfaces take the ice out of one or more rinks for the spring and summer and use the floor for roller hockey and public sessions at least) that has public skating. You could start there and ask the better skaters you see where they train, or ask at the rink office. The management may offer at least group lessons, or if you're lucky there may be a club you can join that would have coaches. Good luck!

 

[Query]

Is the Prince William Ice Center (Dale City, VA) too far away for you? Google maps claims it's about an hour's drive from Culpepper.

From metro D.C., it can be a major drive, because traffic jams often turn I95 into a huge parking lot. But you needn't take I95 from Culpepper.

Based on when I skated there a very long time ago, they had pretty nice ice. And at least back then, it had some pretty good coaches. But my info on them is completely out of date.

I think you are going to find that if you want to ice skate, you sometimes have to take a lot longer drives than that. At least that was my experience, while I was working. And skaters who compete at more than their own local rink often travel a lot further.

I know absolutely nothing about it, but Dominion Skating is listed as a roller rink in Culpepper. It's website doesn't mention lesson availability, but you could call and/or visit. Some roller rinks are basically run as social meeting places - e.g., a place to go for a date, or find one - rather than serious sports training venues. I have no idea if that is true of Prince William, though that seems to be most of what the website advertises. Still, you could learn basic skating.

Dominion also rents speed skates. If there are many kids going very fast in an uncontrolled manner on public skating sessions, that might make practicing figure skating moves harder - but without actually being there it is hard to guess.

There is another ad online for Culpepper Skating Center. If you search Google maps for Culpepper, VA, zoom out a ways, and then search for "skating", you find several other places. About which I also know nothing.

 

[physiotherapystudent]

Is the Prince William Ice Center (Dale City, VA) too far away for you? Google maps claims it's about an hour's drive from Culpepper.

From metro D.C., it can be a major drive, because traffic jams often turn I95 into a huge parking lot. But you needn't take I95 from Culpepper.

Based on when I skated there a very long time ago, they had pretty nice ice. And at least back then, it had some pretty good coaches. But my info on them is completely out of date.

I think you are going to find that if you want to ice skate, you sometimes have to take a lot longer drives than that. At least that was my experience, while I was working. And skaters who compete at more than their own local rink often travel a lot further.

I know absolutely nothing about it, but Dominion Skating is listed as a roller rink in Culpepper. It's website doesn't mention lesson availability, but you could call and/or visit. Some roller rinks are basically run as social meeting places - e.g., a place to go for a date, or find one - rather than serious sports training venues. I have no idea if that is true of Prince William, though that seems to be most of what the website advertises. Still, you could learn basic skating.

Dominion also rents speed skates. If there are many kids going very fast in an uncontrolled manner on public skating sessions, that might make practicing figure skating moves harder - but without actually being there it is hard to guess.

There is another ad online for Culpepper Skating Center. If you search Google maps for Culpepper, VA, zoom out a ways, and then search for "skating", you find several other places. About which I also know nothing.

Thank you! I'll definitely look at skating at the Prince William Ice Center. I've got a client for personal training that lives near there, usually I train him online but he's been wanting in-person work so I might end up there anyway. And Dominion Skating does really seem to be a social meeting place. I messaged them on Facebook, their hours are really limited and they seem to just have social opportunities - although like you said that's probably good enough to learn basics. If I can make my last year of undergraduate coursework line up with making the drive to Prince William then I might even be able to get started skating sooner than I thought!