Are we watching skating… or just our faves?

[gsk8]

Be honest—are we here for the sport… or just our skater?

Figure skating fandom has always had favorites, but lately I noticed:

Every score = a personal attack
Every critique = “hater behavior”
Every competition = stan war

Not just on the forum, but across social media.

So what's your take?

• Are we judging performances… or defending our favorites no matter what?
• Has stan culture made discussions more fun—or completely exhausting?
• Do certain skaters get a free pass while others get picked apart?
• Have you ever held back an opinion because you didn’t want the backlash?
• Is it even possible to be both a fan and objective anymore?

At its best, fandom brings hype, passion, and new fans into the sport. At its worst, it can turn every thread (or social media post) into the same argument on loop.

So what’s the balance? Can we love our faves AND love the sport as a whole?

Sound off—but keep it sharp, not personal

​

 

[ladyjane]

One of the main things about our Public broadcaster is that they only show the top 6 if they broadcast FS at all (they like other ice skating sports better). I want to see all. Not just my favourites, and definitely not just the top 6. Of any discipline. I can actually find joy in the performances of many skaters.

To be honest: if I do have a favourite, I generally want to know his/her/their standing before I watch. That way I can't get disappointed.

I do think the closer you get to the top few skaters in a competition the points go up, and I don't think that's fair. Giving Yuma, Ilia or Shun a 3-point GOE for an element while others in the back get only 0.4 for the same element but also executed with quality, does not sound right (and this is an example, not about the skaters in question). It's sometimes as if the judges (and Callers) are doing ordinals again, and they shouldn't. A 3-A well-executed, no under- or over rotations should get good GOE in all cases.

I understood why the Finnish Grand Prix got criticism for the calling of levels. I don't understand why a lift is called in the last competition of the year while I thought it was illegal all along. But, obviously I am no caller or judge. I don't like fans who try to prove that 'their' favourite did it right and another didn't. I leave threads where that happens too much. I don't like fans who act all knowing and patronizing either.

All this hasn't got much to do with the skaters though, and which of them are favourites. I try to love the sport as a whole.

 

[Diana Delafield]

One of the main things about our Public broadcaster is that they only show the top 6 if they broadcast FS at all (they like other ice skating sports better). I want to see all. Not just my favourites, and definitely not just the top 6. Of any discipline. I can actually find joy in the performances of many skaters.

To be honest: if I do have a favourite, I generally want to know his/her/their standing before I watch. That way I can't get disappointed.

I do think the closer you get to the top few skaters in a competition the points go up, and I don't think that's fair. Giving Yuma, Ilia or Shun a 3-point GOE for an element while others in the back get only 0.4 for the same element but also executed with quality, does not sound right (and this is an example, not about the skaters in question). It's sometimes as if the judges (and Callers) are doing ordinals again, and they shouldn't. A 3-A well-executed, no under- or over rotations should get good GOE in all cases.

I understood why the Finnish Grand Prix got criticism for the calling of levels. I don't understand why a lift is called in the last competition of the year while I thought it was illegal all along. But, obviously I am no caller or judge. I don't like fans who try to prove that 'their' favourite did it right and another didn't. I leave threads where that happens too much. I don't like fans who act all knowing and patronizing either.

All this hasn't got much to do with the skaters though, and which of them are favourites. I try to love the sport as a whole.

Apart from the first paragraph, which thank goodness is not what the CBC does, did I write this post in my sleep, under an assumed nom de GS? All the rest is my feelings exactly .

 

[Mathman]

I want to see all. Not just my favourites, and definitely not just the top 6.

My favorite thing is to see new skaters that I had never noticed before so I can add them to my list of faves. Cheering for the big superstar that I have followed for years, that's OK. But what's really exciting is to "discover" an ingenue that I can help propel up the ranks by vociferous praise. (Jia Shin is currently on my list.)

I also greatly enjoy the performances of veteran middle-of-the-packers who catch me up in the excitement of a personal best.

 

[4everchan]

I am watching everyone. I have many favourites across all disciplines. I even watch synchro and juniors. So sport is first, humans second for me.

 

[noskates]

I want to see everything. I never watch anything but streaming anymore - partly because I literally cannot stand listening to Tara Lipinski run her mouth and explain "grade of execution" 100 times a competition and partly because they only show the top skaters. Since you asked, I do get tired and frustrated with the constant criticism of the judging on the board and the blatant favoritism and nationalism. In a perfect world we would be able to appreciate whoever gave the best performance on any given night and not have to tear them down because they bested someone else. (I guess there are people who think it's great fun to criticize and nitpick and dissect and analyze.) Also, trying to compare current skaters to skaters from the past. It's apples and oranges people. The sport is evolving and it's time to move on. Yes the judges make mistakes but they have to make decisions in the moment and not replay the skate 20 different times over several days. Any sport that is not dependent on a time clock is going to have judging challenges. I just wish that didn't detract from the overall enjoyment. My final answer: I'm here for the sport! Yes I have favorites but I've been following figure skating for well over 45 years and I like to think I can appreciate a great skate no matter who throws it down and in spite of the judging.

 

[DizzyFrenchie]

Be honest—are we here for the sport… or just our skater?

Figure skating fandom has always had favorites, but lately I noticed:

Every score = a personal attack
Every critique = “hater behavior”
Every competition = stan war

Not just on the forum, but across social media.

So what's your take?

• Are we judging performances… or defending our favorites no matter what?
• Has stan culture made discussions more fun—or completely exhausting?
• Do certain skaters get a free pass while others get picked apart?
• Have you ever held back an opinion because you didn’t want the backlash?
• Is it even possible to be both a fan and objective anymore?

At its best, fandom brings hype, passion, and new fans into the sport. At its worst… it turns every thread into the same argument on loop.

So what’s the balance? Can we love our faves AND love the sport as a whole?

Sound off—but keep it sharp, not personal

Embedded HTML content

I will try to answer (or ask about) your questions, rather than comment on the title of the thread and the introduction, I don't know if that's what's expected.

1) Personally, while I admit that an occasional blink of the judges on a just as occasional underrotation by an excellent skater who happens to have the right passport doesn't infuriate me as much as the systematic violation of the written rules in favour of some skaters with never called chronic errors or faults; is it discrimination? I don't think so because it's not the same degree of triggering; and when a favourite of mine got boot problems, all his jumps were underrotated during a Grand Prix season and never called, I ceased to frequent his Fan Fest until it was fixed. And Kaori Sakamoto I find quite an heroin because she addressed the problem regarding her own uncalled Flutz (and only chronic error), twice in public, and it was called for a few competitions afterwards; now that I know her circumstances, I find her even more an heroin. Inversely, I don't appreciate when a skater whose chronic errors and faults are never called, is arrogant and claims when occasionally, on a lesser competition, a small part of the judging problem is addressed.

2) I don't understand what you integrate in stan culture and what not? If it's fan culture in general, some aspects I really like and find heartwarming, others I don't?

3) I don't understand either, in what respect you mean that some skaters get a free pass and others are picked apart, is it with some fans or is it with judging, or something else?

4) Definitely, nearly all the time?

5) I feel a fan (in a general way, not in the etymological meaning of fanatic), there's even a term of "casual fan" (an admirer who's very little invested in the object of their admiration, so one may be a die-hard fan of a skater or several, and a more casual fan of others); I try to be objective. For instance, I will personally prefer an artistic skater, yet I understand that Figure Skating is a Sport and I think that as such, the rules have "enough" consideration for artistry, that is, a very little part of the scoring, the rest is purely technical, and further artistry has to be an unrewarded plus in competition (of course it bodes well for a show career); also, I prefer some styles of music, of programs, of skating over others, yet I really try to be objective, that is, I try to assess (with big shortcomings independent of skaters) skate after skate independently of pure artistry and my tastes, as I think judges have to? When I try of course, which is less and less frequent. I DO NOT think that objectivity implies to "love all skaters equally" (except one), which was a toxic anti policing attempt some years ago. I think that it's normal to enjoy more some skaters than others and to watch them more. With me it even depends on my degree of general and visual tiredness: sometimes tiredness makes me unaware of some faults, and I can watch some beautiful yet technically faulty skaters with pleasure, while at other times it's the opposite and watching the same irks me; which would make me a very bad judge, in addition to my shortcomings! They have to sit through so much!
What I don't understand in your question is "anymore"?

 

[Mathman]

Has stan culture made discussions more fun—or completely exhausting?

This word "stan" (stalker-fan) has an interesting history. It comes foroman old song by rapper Eminem with lyrics consisting of letters that "Slim Shady" (Eminem) supposedly received from a truly obsessed and deranged fan (I think that "Stan" was the fictional fan's actual name). "Stan" would berate and threaten Eminem along the lines of, "Why don't you answer any of my my letters, Motherf******, etc.

As years went by, the term became sanitized to refer simply to any enthusiastic fan, not necessarily meaning a a dangerous psychopath.

As applied to sports, to me this is just "school spirit" stuff. My school is the best school in town, yours sucks. We're going to beat your butt on the football field tomorrow, yuk, yuk." Figure skating is almost unique in that some fans actually appreciate excellent performances even when it's the "other guy" and not "my guy."

Are fan wars exhausting? Fun? Different strokes for different folks, I guess.

 

[Anna K.]

When it comes to figure skating events, I watch the whole competition or don't watch at all (I'm guessing that only watch-it-alls hang out in a figure skating forum after the end of the season ) so apparently I watch a sport.

Figure skating is a bit specific sport in this sense.
In tennis, or soccer, or boxing, or other one-on-one competition sport, the spectators who like only one competing party will still watch the whole competition from beginning till the end.
In figure skating, there is no point to do so. If you like only one, you can watch only one. So, loving the sport as a process matters when it comes to watching the whole competition.

 

[el henry]

I love having favorites and watching my favorites and cheering for my favorites. I am sad when they don't do well.

That said, my figure skating fandom does not depend on one person and does not depend on one person's results. I love love love finding new favorites. And I can even *change my mind*. ( I was not impressed with Yuma's performance chops when he first started skating. At all. Now, I Wish is at the top of my favorite programs, like, ever, and based in part on performance).

I can't imagine being a fan of figure skating overall and approaching the sport any other way.

 

[elbkup]

It’s probably human nature to develop favorites in any discipline. I do feel strongly for some skaters more than others, a result of personal preference, mindset, timing. I tend to root for underdogs, for example; if or when they reach top tier I feel my emotional investment can best be served elsewhere tho they still have my heart. I adore finding new young skaters to follow as well as exploring established skaters more fully as their careers develop and also following skaters after they retire. As for watching competitions all the way through, I like watching the very beginning, those skating hopefuls who can be so interesting and appealing. As mentioned before, I am called away often during events to manage “life” so it is rare to watch an entire event from start to finish, more popping in and out during the duration making sure I manage to see specific ones and follow up with others later. I enjoy reading about performance and skaters on GS but don’t really follow if discussions are deeply technical or passionate. And while no one in my family are fans, they respect my interest and send stuff they find my way. My little grandniece, age 3, watched the women’s Olympic event, so a budding new fan perhaps?! She likes the girls, I suspect because of the pretty dresses, but the boys not so much, yet. Lastly, I get upset and discouraged when spats break out over fine tuned elements.. my internal response… really? Get a grip. And I cannot bear savage unkindness anywhere.. these kids don’t deserve it.. that’s where I’m done and take leave. I following this YouTube account often.. it has skating performances from international comps, many skaters we don’t often see

cloudy

Share your videos with friends, family, and the world

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8.4K views · 156 reactions | Cruisin’ into the weekend! TAKE 5 Choreography @benoitrichaud Cast @rohenew @angelawangster @lissastarr and @gabriellapapadakis Filmed by @oniceperspectives @jordanicecam in @sunvalley Costumes @alicia.designs Musi

Cruisin’ into the weekend! TAKE 5 Choreography @benoitrichaud Cast @rohenew @angelawangster @lissastarr and @gabriellapapadakis Filmed by @oniceperspectives @jordanicecam in @sunvalley Costumes...

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EDT to add this Rohene Ward & Co dance to Take 5… just because (Jacob Sanchez ??)

 

[Ladskater]

Be honest—are we here for the sport… or just our skater?

Figure skating fandom has always had favorites, but lately I noticed:

Every score = a personal attack
Every critique = “hater behavior”
Every competition = stan war

Not just on the forum, but across social media.

So what's your take?

• Are we judging performances… or defending our favorites no matter what?
• Has stan culture made discussions more fun—or completely exhausting?
• Do certain skaters get a free pass while others get picked apart?
• Have you ever held back an opinion because you didn’t want the backlash?
• Is it even possible to be both a fan and objective anymore?

At its best, fandom brings hype, passion, and new fans into the sport. At its worst… it turns every thread into the same argument on loop.

So what’s the balance? Can we love our faves AND love the sport as a whole?

Sound off—but keep it sharp, not personal

Embedded HTML content

Be honest—are we here for the sport… or just our skater?

Figure skating fandom has always had favorites, but lately I noticed:

Every score = a personal attack
Every critique = “hater behavior”
Every competition = stan war

Not just on the forum, but across social media.

So what's your take?

• Are we judging performances… or defending our favorites no matter what?
• Has stan culture made discussions more fun—or completely exhausting?
• Do certain skaters get a free pass while others get picked apart?
• Have you ever held back an opinion because you didn’t want the backlash?
• Is it even possible to be both a fan and objective anymore?

At its best, fandom brings hype, passion, and new fans into the sport. At its worst… it turns every thread into the same argument on loop.

So what’s the balance? Can we love our faves AND love the sport as a whole?

Sound off—but keep it sharp, not personal

Embedded HTML content

That’s a good question. I used to enjoy watching every competition but lately I mainly watch Skate Canada and the Canadian National Championships. and the world championships of course. I really like Ted Barton’s commentary and have been tuning in to see how the Jr skaters are developing here in Canada. I’m glad we have Stephen Gogolov back skating strongly and of course all our wonderful ice dance teams like Piper and Paul and Zach and Marge. We also have some upcoming pair teams. Our women’s field is still building. I love the Japanese skaters especially the women. Of course the only favourites I have are Canadian skaters no matter their placement.

 

[Arriba627]

I enjoy the sport as a whole, especially pairs and men. I watch a lot of stuff on Peacock, but there is nothing like being in the arena and seeing things unfold live. I am hooked on the excitement of seeing who is not only a good skater, but a good competitor as well. I have a lot of favorites but enjoy finding some newbies and watching how they develop. For next year, I'll have my eye on Jacob Sanchez. I respect the hard work and sacrifices that all the skaters make. Skaters from smaller federations have a special place in my heart.

I ignore threads where posts are splitting hairs over some miniscule point.

 

[gsk8]

I have my favorites too! When I started watching the sport as a child, I was only hooked on the women's discipline. Later in my teens, I became a huge pairs' fan as well. Men shortly followed. Ice Dance, which confounded me for many years, I now really enjoy.

I have my favorites and like to see them do well. But as a whole, I like seeing all skaters do well, even if it means beating my favorites

Here's my personal take:

• Are we judging performances… or defending our favorites no matter what?
  If my fav(s) don't do well, I just hope they do better next time. I can't remember when I "defended" a favorite if he/she/they were edged out because someone else (or a team) did better.
  
  
• Has stan culture made discussions more fun—or completely exhausting?
  Exhausting. It also detracts from other skaters' achievements.
  
  
• Do certain skaters get a free pass while others get picked apart?
  Yes. I've seen it many times.
  
  
• Have you ever held back an opinion because you didn’t want the backlash?
  Yes.
  
  
• Is it even possible to be both a fan and objective anymore?
  For me, absolutely

 

[dorispulaski]

I have been watching skating for a very long time. I subscribe to Peacock so that I can see everybody. And one of the best things about the JGP is that they show every skater.

These days I am rather looking for skaters to surprise me a bit. I loved seeing Julia Sauter's joy at the Olympics. Two of my favorite performances at Worlds were the first two teams to skate in the FD-Lauriault & Le Gac & Lim & Quan.

Finding new favorites is a particular joy. I like hearing about other fan's new discoveries, too

I don't enjoy reading repetitive back and forth discussions about whose flutz went uncalled

But I do find myself posting less in more recent years.

 

[TallyT]

Coming as I do from a lifelong and cheerfully chaotic background in film/tv/media/book/you-name-it-and-I've-watched-the-chaos fandoms (though I have been scared off sometimes), I am still rather bemused by the fact that people seem surprised at the way public consumption of skating - yes, a sport but also sometimes an artform and also highly personality-based, especially in this day and age when the skaters interact on social media - is developing. Mind you, when I go back and look at the archives here and elsewhere, the way fans act and fight and take sides and nitpick really really isn't all that different or more subjective in itself. Like most things, the acoustics are way louder these days - and there are a lot more avenues to be loud - so it seems much more different than it probably is. But yeah, the fandom as I see it from my little corner of the world is getting closer to 'conventional' fandom, only much milder and more polite even when acting and fighting and taking sides and nitpicking. It's also become more parasocial, for good or bad that genie is out of the bottle and the skaters themselves are helping it along with all their might.

And I suspect quite a lot of people outside the 'seriously serious old school' do watch only the skaters they like, because the main method of consumption has moved from live and free to air tv to online, much of which either comes clipped and separate, or is easy to clip and separate, to help do just that. It's like music, I can pick and choose if (as is the norm) I am listening at home on the computer.

 

[yfan1]

I tend to ponder the real questions, like how Alysa Liu's hairstyle might bring in new fans, or whether Yuzuru Hanyu will marry me...

 

[CaroLiza_fan]

I have my favorites too! When I started watching the sport as a child, I was only hooked on the women's discipline. Later in my teens, I became a huge pairs' fan as well. Men shortly followed. Ice Dance, which confounded me for many years, I now really enjoy.

I have my favorites and like to see them do well. But as a whole, I like seeing all skaters do well, even if it means beating my favorites

Here's my personal take:

• Are we judging performances… or defending our favorites no matter what?
  If my fav(s) don't do well, I just hope they do better next time. I can't remember when I "defended" a favorite if he/she/they were edged out because someone else (or a team) did better.
  
  
• Has stan culture made discussions more fun—or completely exhausting?
  Exhausting. It also detracts from other skaters' achievements.
  
  
• Do certain skaters get a free pass while others get picked apart?
  Yes. I've seen it many times.
  
  
• Have you ever held back an opinion because you didn’t want the backlash?
  Yes.
  
  
• Is it even possible to be both a fan and objective anymore?
  For me, absolutely

Wow.

I used to think that we thought differently. But reading your post, I could have written it myself. Because everything you have written is exactly the same as how I feel! The only difference is that I only started getting interested in the sport in my teens. But the order was the same.

As for the original question, the position I am currently at is one that I don't particularly like.

I would always have said that I watched skating rather than just my favourite skaters. But, as you all know, motorsports is my first love. And because the calendars of the motorsports series I follow have expanded in recent years, it means that there is less time to follow my other interests.

I used to watch motorsports, snooker, ski sports and figure skating. And it used to be that the calendars dove-tailed in a way that you could do it. But then the promotors started expanding the calendars to bring in more money, and it became much more difficult to follow them all.

The first to do this was snooker. And when it got to the stage that it was finish one tounament one day and start the next tournament the following day, it became so stressful trying to watch everything that I stopped watching the sport completely. And doing this did wonders for how I was feeling. Then when the F1 and MotoGP calendars expanded after the pandemic, I gave up watching ski sports because I couldn't fit them in around the motorsports and figure skating. I have even given up watching some of the motorsports series I used to watch, because there was so much F1 and MotoGP.

And I hate that I had to give up watching those things. During the recent Olympics, I decided to watch the ski sports that I used to watch. And I really enjoyed watching them again. And I realised just how much I missed them.

Now, I am finding it hard to watch all the figure skating that I would want to. And on the weeks when there are motorsports on, I often just watch the skaters that I run Fan Fests for. And I am not enjoying that, because when you just watch one skater / partnership, you don't get a proper perspective of what is going on in the competition.

With the F1 and MotoGP currently on an unplanned month-long break due to rounds in the Middle East being cancelled, I have been enjoying watching in full the smaller figure skating competitions that are currently on (and which have free streams).

For me, I have never cared much about the results of competitions. I just want to see people going out there and trying their best. Which is why when watching figure skating, I nearly always enjoy watching the earlier groups more than the later groups. Indeed, if I have had to leave watching, I have been known to not bother going back to watch the final group. Because I am less interested in the top skaters.

I know. I'm odd.

CaroLiza_fan

 

[iluvtodd]

I have my favorites, but I enjoy watching all of the skaters. I'd rather watch the whole competitions on Peacock (with commentary by Mark Hanretty & Ted Barton, etc.), than on NBC. It's fun to discover other skaters who may not be Top Ten contenders.

 

[gsk8]

Also, maybe it's old age, but I can never remember medal positions (except for Olympics/Worlds) for the most part. I have to go back and double check.

But what I do remember are performances.

While "old school", I tend to like a lot of the newer skaters from this decade just as much, if not better.